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Old 04-09-2007, 03:23 PM   #166
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Looks like 13.5 is the new Stock Class.
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Old 04-09-2007, 03:26 PM   #167
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Originally Posted by UN4RACING
It would not be adding another class. 27t stock bushing, 23t pro stock bearing. I don't see the problem if they added 10 more classes thats just more choice for the ones who normally wouldn't show up, and if they don't bump the ones who did.
The pros are trying to get there with a stock 27t any way.
Although thats just a possible fix for now on a totally different subject.
I can only agree that with brushless new rules need to be made, but to avoid new classes it will be impossible. (as long as brushes are around). It is a great opportunity.
But I must say My son used to race with me and he quit because he said its just getting to serious. Hes wanting to do some dirt this summer and its the first sign of R/C racing from him in about 2 years. (Even with brushless lipo).

As for Turbo Joe I agree 100% Keep brushed going by it being just a touch faster mix them separate them what ever it takes.
I try to win but my true intent with brushless lipo is the ease and cost, efficiency no hassle no working at it fun, and I've had more time to share at the track, In all honesty we have a few racers at our track that I will never put in that much work to beat, FORGET IT! I'm a budget once a week guy with other priorities to spend my money on. I believe that keeping brushes going will also help keep the cost of brushless down as well. It will all come around on its own either way.

Brushless Lipo has made its mark........ But its yet to stake its claim.

Soon enough brushless lipo will have to take the gloves off.
I guess I'm missing something then... If we ADD 23t Bearing, which class will we eliminate so that we are not adding another class?


When I started racing, we only had Stock and Mod. That seemed to be enough classes, even though we had WAY more racers each weekend. Now we have Stock, 19t and Mod and fewer racers. Everybody gets into the A main now...


Now, I like the idea of an interim class above Stock but not quite Mod. And since brushless is coming on so strong, let's redefine what these three classes should be and work with the brushless motor manufacturers to ensure they are building motors that support these classes.

Stock: Spec brushless motor, fairly slow, but enough to challenge beginning racers. It should be slower than the current crop of brushed motors and slower than the 13.5. Most sponsored racers should feel that it is too slow to have fun in this class.

Pro-Stock: Spec brushless motor, pretty fast, probably close to what 19t is today, maybe just a tad slower to open the gap between it and open Mod. This is the class where you should start to see a significant number of sponsored racers.

Mod: Anything goes. Brushed or brushless. Exactly as people would imagine this class. This is where the big dogs come to play!


As we transition to new Brushless class definitions, those with brushed motors and speedos will be grumpy. But, that's just the way it needs to be. The Brushless Revolution has begun, and we can't stop it! So instead of stopping it or tailoring it to the old-tech brushed world, lets set new standards and start having fun again!
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Old 04-09-2007, 06:13 PM   #168
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Originally Posted by gotpez
I guess I'm missing something then... If we ADD 23t Bearing, which class will we eliminate so that we are not adding another class?


When I started racing, we only had Stock and Mod. That seemed to be enough classes, even though we had WAY more racers each weekend. Now we have Stock, 19t and Mod and fewer racers. Everybody gets into the A main now...


Now, I like the idea of an interim class above Stock but not quite Mod. And since brushless is coming on so strong, let's redefine what these three classes should be and work with the brushless motor manufacturers to ensure they are building motors that support these classes.

Stock: Spec brushless motor, fairly slow, but enough to challenge beginning racers. It should be slower than the current crop of brushed motors and slower than the 13.5. Most sponsored racers should feel that it is too slow to have fun in this class.

Pro-Stock: Spec brushless motor, pretty fast, probably close to what 19t is today, maybe just a tad slower to open the gap between it and open Mod. This is the class where you should start to see a significant number of sponsored racers.

Mod: Anything goes. Brushed or brushless. Exactly as people would imagine this class. This is where the big dogs come to play!


As we transition to new Brushless class definitions, those with brushed motors and speedos will be grumpy. But, that's just the way it needs to be. The Brushless Revolution has begun, and we can't stop it! So instead of stopping it or tailoring it to the old-tech brushed world, lets set new standards and start having fun again!
Your not missing anything. You have very good strong points.
But instead of pro stock 27t it would be pro stock 23t. And novice or sportsman could be 27t. May work may not but its really some thing that we have talked about at our track to keep it even with 13.5 vs. 27. Instead it would be 13.5 vs. 23t. Pro stock 27t would be replaced by 23t.

And I agree lets have fun again.
When I started racing 11 years ago I started in .12 gas truck. And it was all skill level classes, motors were all the same.
On the carpet we had mod and stock.
And a run what you brung novice.
I do agree the future is brushless so I would say define the classes to the future and I think thats what your saying?
Quit beating around the bush and get it done.
But I don't think brushed will end either way. That is right away.

I guess if and when B/L is the dominant force it will become?
Any hoot I hope you don't think I'm trying to argue, Just debating.
read ya later.
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Old 04-10-2007, 08:27 AM   #169
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The classes are being defined now. I suspect there will be rules for 13.5 and 10.5 classes for 2008.

However, I hope none of you DARE to complain when you end up buying 3 diffrent 13.5 or 10.5 BL motors in 2008 because faster ones keep coming out.

The development of BL motors is in its INFANCY but consumers like you all want motors NOW. You are going to get them and you will have to deal with with it when the motor manufactuers use you to figure things out over the next 2 years.
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Old 04-10-2007, 08:49 AM   #170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianM
The development of BL motors is in its INFANCY but consumers like you all want motors NOW. You are going to get them and you will have to deal with with it when the motor manufactuers use you to figure things out over the next 2 years.
Isn't that how business works? Bleed the consumer until the next latest greatest product is developed, and then bleed them some more. It's a never ending cycle. Get over it, and move on.
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Old 04-10-2007, 08:53 AM   #171
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Originally Posted by KE4PJO
Isn't that how business works? Bleed the consumer until the next latest greatest product is developed, and then bleed them some more. It's a never ending cycle. Get over it, and move on.
just like computers you buy the latest one and by the time you get home and hook it up its outdated
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Old 04-10-2007, 09:09 AM   #172
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianM
The classes are being defined now. I suspect there will be rules for 13.5 and 10.5 classes for 2008.

However, I hope none of you DARE to complain when you end up buying 3 diffrent 13.5 or 10.5 BL motors in 2008 because faster ones keep coming out.

The development of BL motors is in its INFANCY but consumers like you all want motors NOW. You are going to get them and you will have to deal with with it when the motor manufactuers use you to figure things out over the next 2 years.

AND this is different than brushed mtrs/spd cntrls HOW???
As a LHS owner I can assure you that the WHOLE industry changes constantly, and the BL is no different, it will continue to change. AND it is not only elec, nitro is constantly changing also,
So buck up, change with the times or be left behind
AND this is coming from a guy who STILL races a T-Maxx!!

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Old 04-10-2007, 09:26 AM   #173
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I would like to chime in here and let you all know the outcome of our clubs decision. This post was started for the sole intention of helping us make a decision about our classes for the upcoming year. Here is what OUR club decided.

First we will have a Sportsman Touring Car class where brushed and brushless run together. Rules are any 27 turn stock or rtr brushed motor and any rtr ( 4300 ) or 13.5 novak brushless motor. This is sorta our beginers class. We have a lap cut off at 16 laps in 5:10. If you beat that more that twice you step up into one of the following two classes depending on what type of motor you are running.

Stock Touring Car: any 27 turn 24 degree fixed timing motor, 4200 batteries and any roar approved body.

or

13.5 Brushless Touring Car class. Same as stock rules but must run the novak 13.5 brushless (only motor at this point). This class will be running 6 min heats and mains.

Then we have a Mod class, anything goes. Lipo, gtp bodies, pan car tires, anything.

Alot of people here like to run 2 classes. With alot of people running brushless mod, the 13.5 class will play off that. These people can pick up a 13.5 motor and run 2 classes with minimal maintanance and work.

I think we are very lucky here localy to split our Touring car classes into so many, but it has helped in the past because alot more people have a chance to win. That is what keeps people coming back. This weekend is our first race with our new classes. We will see how everything works out. I have a feeling it is going to work great for us. We will see.

I think everyone on here has valid points. The only thing I can say is that if your track doesn't try it you will never know what the outcome will be. Our club has made a step towards the future of RC. Whether it is wrong or right we will see but we can always make changes to our rules as we see fit to fix any unforseen troubles. Keep the info coming, whether it is good or bad. I have learned alot about brushless and how alot of people feel about it from reading this and other topics.
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Old 04-10-2007, 09:33 AM   #174
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It sounds like you have a good plan, I like the cut-off/bump-up idea.
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Old 04-10-2007, 09:38 AM   #175
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianM
The classes are being defined now. I suspect there will be rules for 13.5 and 10.5 classes for 2008.

However, I hope none of you DARE to complain when you end up buying 3 different 13.5 or 10.5 BL motors in 2008 because faster ones keep coming out.

The development of BL motors is in its INFANCY but consumers like you all want motors NOW. You are going to get them and you will have to deal with with it when the motor manufacturers use you to figure things out over the next 2 years.
If Roar announced the specification`s for a brushless stock would that not make all the latest 13.5 motor`s available out of spec ?
Just like they did with 27T way back ....


All we need is a announcement ...

question really is....

How much longer do we have to wait ?
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Old 04-10-2007, 09:38 AM   #176
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Originally Posted by Ozzie

Then we have a Mod class, anything goes. Lipo, gtp bodies, pan car tires, anything.
so basically "run what you brung"?? sounds like the "trailer park nationals" do we need a mullet to enter??
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Old 04-10-2007, 09:41 AM   #177
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You would not be disciminated against if you didn't. LOL
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Old 04-10-2007, 09:45 AM   #178
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You would not be disciminated against if you didn't. LOL
Did you mean: discriminated
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Old 04-10-2007, 09:54 AM   #179
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcos.J
Did you mean: discriminated
yeah!
WHAT HE SAID!
sPEEDY

ps does 'mod' scare you? or are you 1 of those 'stocker' guyz??
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Old 04-10-2007, 09:57 AM   #180
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Quote:
Originally Posted by speedybill
yeah!
WHAT HE SAID!
sPEEDY

ps does 'mod' scare you? or are you 1 of those 'stocker' guyz??
i only run mod i dont even own a stock motor let alone any brushed motors
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