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Old 03-13-2007, 12:37 PM   #76
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In the end, I would much rather say "I got beat by Cole Trickle, professional race car driver" than "I beat Droolin Bob, the guy that drives like Ray Charles".
Come on....leave Nash out of this!
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Old 03-13-2007, 12:40 PM   #77
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It might be nice to see 19 turn changed to a "Pro Stock" class and keep the factory modified guys out. This is a good stepping stone for the top stock racers to move into modified.

Or

Create two modified classes. Open mod and factory mod. This would be another nice stepping stone for top stock racers to move into modified.

No matter what any top level stock racer tells you it is hard to swallow your pride and move into modified. Go from A mains to D mains and lower. Very few stock racers have moved up and done well. Bobby Flack, Ray Darroch, and Jeff Dayger are exceptions.

Lets not forget how much harder modified is on the equipment and your wallet. If you do not have some SERIOUS support there is no way to compete in modified.
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Old 03-13-2007, 12:42 PM   #78
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Originally Posted by or8ital
I purchase my RC related stuff at a Hobby Shop not a Sporting Goods store

I guess that kind of shows some of the difference. I would guess maybe those that view this as a hobby want a seperate Stock class for sponsored drivers and those that view it as a sport dont.
Do you think Rick Hendrick buys his racing equipment at a sporting goods store probably not so does this mean that auto racing is not a sport ???????
I guess Hendrick has to change thier name from Hendrick motorsports to Hendrick hobby LOL......

Simply put some view it and enjoy it as a hobby and there are those that view it and enjoy it as a sport but it also such as my case I view it as both a hobby and a sport
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Old 03-13-2007, 12:44 PM   #79
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I think the bottom line here is wins sale parts and kits. I know while i was watching the nats on liverc there where a million questions as to what is so and so running all the way from kits to batts. reguardless of what class thay where running. also when the pics from nash come out there are a million threads with "Whats this i want one"

I have had the pleasure to meet and race with a local highly sponsered guy and for the work i see him put in i hope to god he gets somthing out of it. Not to mention hes one hell of a guy and willing to help anyone and everyone in our club and benifited from it. I am so glad he races in stock because i have learned what took him years to learn in just a short season. now if i could just wheel like him

race on guys
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Old 03-13-2007, 01:15 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by gijoe64
At the Snowbirds I seen alot of yelling by sponsered drivers in stock foam to slower guys, is it fair to the slower guys to recieve this type of abuse? This is stock racing , should the pro driver in stock foam be running in 19T? My point is that the competition is high and should the slower guy be told to pull there car off the tack because he is not as good? When the pro driver did not enven pay a entery fee. I want everyone to have a good time but while attending large race events these team guys are pretty mean on the driver stand to less skilled drivers.
This is exactly why the sponsored guys should be in a class of their own, this kind of behavior should be unacceptable, but the manufacturer's and organizers allow people to get away with this. There simply needs to be a consensus reached by the manufacturers and/or organizers, all together to solve this. Obviously you can't please everybody, but the changes obviously need to happen if there is this much division amongst the racers an manufacturers alike. The reason why people race is to win, for competition, bragging rights or fun and that is understandable. Some will complain if they don't win, some don't. Manufacturer's and distributors, look at it in a different spektrum, they want to drive revenue. The problem is many are concerned about the "NOW" vs. the Future of the sport. And this is the largest reason behind the struggles of the growth of the hobby.

Not only is it expensive to do it, but new racers go to the track, you get yelled at because they are in some "Factory" guys' way, you have no chance at improving or winning because nobody helps you out, therefore you drop it and quit. What these "Sponsored" drivers fail to see is these avg. guys' are paying their contingencies for winning in the stock/19T class. If they are getting the equipment for free why not run Modified. (after all, if you get stuff free, why should the cost, which is why many people get deterred from mod, matter), and if they want to engage in fisticuffs because they took each other out in the MOD class, let them (man just think of the Drama you could market $$$$$). And I do believe it is not the driver's, but rather the manufacturers that do this. There is simply TOO MANY sponsored drivers. 10 years ago, you were lucky if you got a lick and stick motor manufacturer to work on your stock motor if you were in the A-Main at the ROAR Nats. Now 50% of people at these events are sponsored and the manufacturers' keep handing out more. Back then if you didn't make the A or B main consistently in MODIFIED, you simply would get dropped. Stock was left for the up and comers and it should still be like that. It won't hurt sales either. If you offer a good product in the PREMIER category, people will still purchase it if "Fast Guy X" Promotes it. (Think, Gold Dust Twins circa 1994(?))
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Old 03-13-2007, 01:37 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CristianTabush
This is exactly why the sponsored guys should be in a class of their own, this kind of behavior should be unacceptable, but the manufacturer's and organizers allow people to get away with this. .....but new racers go to the track, you get yelled at because they are in some "Factory" guys' way, you have no chance at improving or winning because nobody helps you out, therefore you drop it and quit.

Whoa! Put away your broad brush!!! Sponsored guy does not equal rude idiot. I met lot's of "factory guys" at the nats this past weekend and can't wait to race against them again. They work hard to be good but it doesn't keep them from laughing and having a good time. I can think of a ton "fatory guys" who would drop everything to help out anyone who asked for it.
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Old 03-13-2007, 01:43 PM   #82
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Changing the names of the classes or creating another mod class will do nothing. These guys just plain don't want to move up. Why should they?

I don't race stock much anymore because I don't want to. Until the top stock racers actually want to run a faster class they aren't going to move up. Slow stock down? We shouldn't even go there it would be way too ugly.

What's wrong with running with sponsored guys in stock anyways? Last I heard you couldn't run prototype stuff in stock so they have the same stuff as everyone else (just more of it). And don't start crying about batteries either because they aren't that much better that what you can get.
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Old 03-13-2007, 01:46 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CristianTabush
10 years ago, you were lucky if you got a lick and stick motor manufacturer to work on your stock motor if you were in the A-Main at the ROAR Nats. Now 50% of people at these events are sponsored and the manufacturers' keep handing out more. Back then if you didn't make the A or B main consistently in MODIFIED, you simply would get dropped. Stock was left for the up and comers and it should still be like that. It won't hurt sales either. If you offer a good product in the PREMIER category, people will still purchase it if "Fast Guy X" Promotes it. (Think, Gold Dust Twins circa 1994(?))
10 years ago we didnt have the web and magazine adds were outrageous (some still are). Ive been racing for 17 years (15 purely oval) and even when I started there were still lots of sponsored guys. We just didnt have the web for everyone to air out opinion's and keyboard courage.

Results sale products....period!! Always been that way and always will. Is it a bad thing that I go to a race and offer my services to ANYONE who walks up and ask? I always try to help guys out and explain what I am doing and why I am doing it to ANYONE who ask...Not just "Team" Guys....

The web has changed a lot with how companies run business's and advertise results......good and bad.

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Old 03-13-2007, 01:47 PM   #84
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The yelling at Snowbirds had nothing to do with the factory guys in stock. It had everything to do with the fact that the board was set randomly.

Another big race (Cleveland) goes by your previous years results. It's not perfect but it's a start. God knows it's not the best race of the year either but at least they try to get similat speeds together.
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Old 03-13-2007, 01:47 PM   #85
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Notice I didn't state all factory guys are rude idiots. I never stated anything drastic, just pointing out the obvious. It is human nature to get defensive on your turf. There is just a time and place for everything. Having people racing for money and for fun in the same category does not make for a very good recipe. Again, I'm all for brawls at big races in between Hot Shots! (j/k)
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Old 03-13-2007, 01:56 PM   #86
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EA, been in it for 18 (got ya beat ) and at least, here in Texas there was very few, but very fast racers that were sponsored and you are talking about 160 entries on a club race back then. The only sponsored people were Quincy Hughes, Frosty St.Clair, Kyle Wilson, Jonathan Morgan (in offroad) and Rusty Husband, Ralph Burch and Tommy Porfirio in Onroad. Heck it took David Joor (avid R/C , RC10B4.com) a second place qual spot in 1/10th modified touring at the ROAR nats (and about 10 years of racing) to get sponsored. Now you go to any small to medium event and 75% of the people have some sort of sponsorship. There is nothing wrong with having a "support" driver here and there, but I think we've gotten to the point we are self-imploding with the whole sponsorship thing. Sponsor less drivers and they can't complain about them getting beat by all these factory guys.
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Old 03-13-2007, 02:09 PM   #87
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So what are you saying? Non-sponsored drivers aren't as competitive as the sponsored guys?

Who would pay to race a bunch of non-competitive racers?

I can guarantee you, non-sponsored drivers want to win just as badly as the sponsored racers do.
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Old 03-13-2007, 02:09 PM   #88
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Where I see the problem is that "pro" level equipment is allowed in stock class. The exact same tires, batteries, chassis, and electronics are allowed. Even pro-tuned motors are allowed. If "pro" level equipment was banned, take for instance, Only use Mabuchi sealed endbell motors and unmatched 1800 batteries. If those were the required equipment for stock class, then how many battery and motor sponsored drivers would be in that class? Probably alot less. Another example would be if you only allowed the Novak 4300 brushless system in the class. That would weed out alot of the drivers sponsored by other speed control manufacturers like Tekin, LRP, and such. If your racing with professional level equipment, then expect professional level drivers. Nobody should expect the better drivers to get kicked out just so the slower drivers can win.

I always wonder why I don't see the professional drivers starting a thread about kicking the loser drivers out of certain classes. How come its always the losers that are getting beat that want to kick out the fast guys? Shouldn't the winners have greater say?
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Old 03-13-2007, 02:11 PM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McSmooth
Even skeet shooting, bowling, and archery are more physically demanding. RC Racing is more like marbles.

Have you ever tried bowling with 16 pound balls ?????


but in keeping with the thread...... I think racing stock with "Pro" drivers is a chance that you don't always get.

I have bowled in events with Pro's and you learn alot from them....

It is the same way with racing with these Pro guys. There is a certain respect that goes with racing at these events.

If you are slow (like me) you need to learn to drive at your own level and move so the faster guys can pass you.
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Old 03-13-2007, 02:21 PM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mal
So what are you saying? Non-sponsored drivers aren't as competitive as the sponsored guys?

Who would pay to race a bunch of non-competitive racers?

I can guarantee you, non-sponsored drivers want to win just as badly as the sponsored racers do.
Didnt you say sponsored drivers arent as competitive as the full-ride factory guys? I dont understand why then sponsored and non-sponsored arent different?
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