R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 12-21-2006, 01:50 AM   #1
Tech Rookie
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 3
Default What is this???

I just browsed the net and ended in following pages.

http://personal.inet.fi/koti/liljero...asso/asso.html

What is this? I don't understand this language at all, so I can't read anything. It's looks like TC3, but why that motor is like that?
Rebuild is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2006, 02:00 AM   #2
Tech Elite
 
WheelNut's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Edmonton, Ab
Posts: 3,210
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Send a message via MSN to WheelNut
Default

Looks like a mid motor TC3, probably someone trying to eliminate torque steering. Would be pretty dang hard to change the gearing I would think though!
__________________
•Brad Comis
WheelNut is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2006, 02:20 AM   #3
Tech Master
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,152
Default

Its a TC3....And its obviously someone's home DIY project.
Ben.C is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2006, 05:14 AM   #4
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Europe
Posts: 177
Default

The bevelgear and pinion is from a Savage. But I think the motor is way too much out to the side. The concept would need quite a bit of engineering to get the motor in as much as possible plus it needs smaller teeths on the gears to be able to properly alter the gear ratio . Maybe some manufacturer will try this in the future.
moonman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2006, 05:51 AM   #5
Tech Master
 
Speedie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 1,844
Default

thats a cool idea and he did some nice work doing it. But like was said b4 no way to change gearing. It could work but he would have to add an extra shaft and run a spur gear on it with that beveled pinion on the other and then flip the motor over to drive the spur with a regular pinion. that would also bring the motor in. But that would probably add alot of drag to the drivetrain. Still looks cool.
__________________
www.victoryhobbies.com Greenbay, Wisconsin
Speedie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2006, 06:23 AM   #6
Super Moderator
 
Marcos.J's Avatar
R/C Tech Elite Subscriber
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Semper Fi
Posts: 27,183
Trader Rating: 182 (100%+)
Default

looks cool but thats extra weight hanging off it side
Marcos.J is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2006, 06:46 AM   #7
Tech Master
 
Anders Myrberg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Man´s best friend: Hugo Myrberg
Posts: 1,987
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rebuild
I just browsed the net and ended in following pages.

http://personal.inet.fi/koti/liljero...asso/asso.html

What is this? I don't understand this language at all, so I can't read anything. It's looks like TC3, but why that motor is like that?

Finnish. ( Mika Häkkinen, Kimi Räikönen etc. )Impossible to understand.
Anders Myrberg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2006, 08:18 AM   #8
Tech Champion
 
F. Mendoza's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: SoCal
Posts: 7,232
Trader Rating: 79 (100%+)
Default

I can't read the article but I would of tried it. If it does work then I would of notorized pics then went to Team Associated with the idea. T.A. can make the right gears and hardware for it to make it work. Cha- ching. $$
__________________
RC America - Xray - Hudy - Gravity RC - KO Propo - Super Rad Graphics

Mr. Shookie goes home 10-06-08. Bill Levinson 4-14-15
F. Mendoza is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2006, 08:40 AM   #9
Tech Champion
 
tc3team's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 6,151
Default

Possibly could have been better if a proper spur gear was mounted onto the propshaft, allowing the motor to stay fully inside the chassis and the change of a standard pinion.The hardest part would be machining a spur gear adaptor which fits onto the propshaft, for sure! Even if the propshaft was bigger and a pin was secured into it to somehow hold the spur gear you've instantly increased rotating mass.

I think the propshaft may also need some retainer to keep wobble to a minimum near the new location of the spur gear too, like the original mounting has but I guess that would only be apparent on a testing session

Nice idea, but not very practical.
__________________
Fusion Hobbies / www.horshamrc.org

The wife stops me being sane and the r/c stops me from going insane....
tc3team is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2006, 11:00 AM   #10
Tech Initiate
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: TORRINGTON CT
Posts: 27
Send a message via AIM to MIKE VALENTINE Send a message via Yahoo to MIKE VALENTINE
Default

Why would you say there's no way to change gearing. You can get different size pinion bevel gears and the cam (motor mount) on the motor works the same way as it would mounted in it's original location.
MIKE VALENTINE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2006, 12:54 PM   #11
Tech Rookie
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 3
Default

One problem must be that one tooth smaler or larger pinion gear would change the overall ratio quite much.
Rebuild is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2006, 06:13 PM   #12
Tech Elite
 
RCSteve93's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Long Island, New York
Posts: 4,601
Trader Rating: 11 (100%+)
Default

It truely does not eliminate tourque steer. There is still tourque to one side caused by the shaft drive.
__________________
rm -rf /windows
RCSteve93 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2006, 06:18 PM   #13
Tech Elite
 
GrandeGixxer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Waldorf, MD
Posts: 2,921
Trader Rating: 15 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rebuild
I just browsed the net and ended in following pages.
Are you saying you found the end of the internet?


__________________
Joe Cude
Mugen MBX-7R Mugen MTX-6R Mugen MTC-1 Mugen MRX-6 Mugen MST-1 Tamiya Euro Truck
GrandeGixxer is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2006, 07:25 PM   #14
Tech Rookie
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 1
Default

Hi all

Knowing the guy who did this and too much time at hand, i decided to translate the text. Partially an exercise for english, done mostly from top-of-the-head, there will be lots of errors. Try to endure.

Team Associated TC3 with a sideways placed motor

25.1.2006

The whole idea of the project started mostly as a joke. The thought at hand was, how to make Asso go straight. The biggest problem is, that longitudinally placed wildly spinning motor causes quite a lot of rotor effect (?). So if this feature could be eliminated, Asso would probably go a lot straighter. Now the only thing needed was an idea, how to turn the motor sideways. The most natural option was to use cone gears in place of pinion and spur gears. After a small price comparement, the best option seemed to be HPI Savage diff gear and pinion (#86030 ja #86031).

Savage gears, naturally, weren't usable out-of-box. Because turning the causes that spur gear will have to be moved to the middle of the cardan axle (=drive shaft), the cardan had to be remade. Proper material for this was 6 millimeter (.23 inch) carbon fiber pole. Because of this, the Savage's diff gear, that goes to the place of the spur gear, was quite easily usable. It had 6 mm hub hole, so only the attaching mechanism was needed. I even thought of gluing, but decided to use a pin that goes through the spur gear and axle. Drilling a hole to the spur gear couldn't be done straight. The gear was hardened to be very hard, so it had to be (?detained?) first. The fitting was made so tight, that the pin stays in place even without glue. In addition to this pin, to the both ends of cardan axle was naturally made a bit over centimeter (.4 inch) long pins, so that the axle wouldn't spin for nothing. The attaching of these was reinforced with cyanoacrylate glue.

The pinion was a bit greater pain in the ass. First, the pinion had to be (?detained?) because of very hard hardening. Next, it had to be shortened to the length of a standard electric motor pinion. But the biggest work was in the pinion's center hole. It was originally a lot bigger than motor's 3,17 mm (.12 inch) axle, therefore the middle hole needed a proper sleeve. Finally, a hole and threads had to be made for the pinion's attaching screw, for the pinion would stay on the motor's axle.

spur gear Axle pinion gear

**********************

29.1.2006

When the axle was fully assembled, it was time to try to fit it in the car. The spur gear will be placed so, that it hits right on the place of fourth cell, therefore a 3+3 saddle pack will be used. In middle of the Asso's chassis there is a supporting piece, that was badly in way. I removed the piece from place of the forthcoming spur gear. In addition i had to extend the fourth cells hole in the chassis also undet the spur gear. Now the spur gear is barely above the chassis. I thought that cutting the chassis makes it a lot more flexible, but no significant change was observed, so no extra strenghtening at this point.

Hole in the bottom 2 The hole in the bottom Axle attached

**********************

1.2.2006

The motor will be differently than originally, so more dremeling was needed. Ih this version, the motor will stick about a centimeter (.4 inch) out of the chassis. For starters, a hole had to cut to the side of the chassis for the motor and motor mount. Next, supports from around the old motor mounting place were removed. Now there is enough space for motor and it's mount. But cutting the chassis side made it a lot more flexible, so some support had to be made to the side at some point. At the time, only one of the mount's screws hole fits to the current chassis. The remaining two are at the place of the old motor hole and outside of the chassis. Additionally, without a 2,5 mm raise the pinion won't fit right to the spur gear. Both problems will be solved with a properly molded 2,5 mm thick piece of carbon fibre to the mount's place. Wich coincidentally will be the next phase.

Engraving Fitting the motor

**********************

7.2.2006

First I drew the model of the carbon fibre plate to a piece of cardboard. Using the model, I drew the sawing lines to the plate and sawed it. I drilled and (?sinked?) the motor mount's attaching holes to the plate. One attaching screw place hit to the area of the chassis, so it too needed a hole. The carbon fibre plate was attached to the chassis using epoxy. Probably a strong enough attachment. Surprisingly, the carbon plate stiffened up the chassis a lot, so for now no extra strenghtening needed. And surprisingly, the motor with it's mount fitted beautifully.

I haven't had time to install other electrics, but the desire to try it out was strong. So I tried spinning the motor with battery only. The metal gears make quite a noise. The sound will probably be smaller with some dry lube, but even with it, the sound will raise attention. The gap could also be adjusted. But worse was, that with high rounds the cardan started to flutter. This wasn't a big surprise though, as it was estimated before. So, the next phase is to find a proper bearing and make a mount for it right in front of the spur gear. It should keep the cardan in proper order. Also mounts for the servo have to be found, for some reason I don't have them.

Carbon fibre plate Bottom's up Motor attached

*******************

11.7.2006

This project has been on the shelf for a while, even though it was close to finish. A support for the cardan had to be built for the high rev fluttering. The most natural solution was to support the axle right next to the spur gear with a bearing. One day i received a fitting piece of plastic from my loyal right hand. Because the mount was made precisely to my instructions, the bearings fitted to the mount and the mount to the car perfectly. I attached the mount to the car with a pair of 4 mm screws, so it should sit steady. Now, after a quick test, no fluttering was detected.

So only installing electrics was due to do. This was routine, and no unexpected troubles occurred. Servo fit to it's place, the receiver right behind the servo, the motor already had it's place and ESC had nice room behind motor. But the battery had to be re-soldered, as I didn't have a saddle pack with overhead connectors. While driving, the sound of the metal gears is considerably lower than expected, although while throttling the car on the pits the sound is infernal. Further conclusions of the car's handling can't be made, before I get to try the car on a real track.

Bearing mount Gear area Done
V-mies is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2006, 10:49 PM   #15
Tech Rookie
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 3
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RCSteve93
It truely does not eliminate tourque steer. There is still tourque to one side caused by the shaft drive.
The Drive shaft spins about four times slower than the motor -> There must be much less torque steering.
Rebuild is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 06:43 AM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net