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Old 11-23-2006, 11:15 AM   #31
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why the change to 4 cell?

Do we really believe the cost of two batteries will seal the deal for a new racer to BUY in. 4 cell may keep the exsisting racers racing with slightly less expense. But then I think back about the experience of the Japan Nats just completed and the stress put on the 4 cell packs and the result.... new packs for every run. That doesn't sound like what was intended. EFRA and 5 cells may be a smarter move adding that little extra capacity...

Attracting new racers who's very first question is HOW FAST is it - will going to 4 cell or even 5 help? IMHO it is the cost of getting started and nearly complete lack of any organized racing - meaning if you join a bowling, Golf, Little League group there is an outlined organized path for developement and expectations. Again IMHO the $$$ to start racing needs to be addressed and there needs to be a "production car" long ago this was an entry racing class in ROAR. Using bushings in place of bearings, FIberglass chassis verus graphite type stuff. But these things helped at the time to lower the cost of entry. Maybe SPEC Batteries, Charger etc to lower the "tools" cost as well. Bring back this class and have ROAR make rules fitting todays situation to have a LOW COST racing class. This would involve input form the manufactures without saying.

I think 4 cell proponates should consider what happened in Japan, and consider or ask why EFRA decided on 5 cell.

Maybe 4 cell racing will stress the batteries to the point of creating the need to replace them more often and then what have we or ROAR accomplished
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Old 11-23-2006, 11:15 AM   #32
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I say do not jump the gun on decision and run 4 mod in a provisional National event on carpet and at the next paved national event run a 4 cell 19t as a provisional class this year. This will let us racers see if it is really enjoyable on differt size tracks, and in return I hope this will make all the factory guys that run in 19t 6 cell run the 4 cell mod and 19t 4 cell class at that event. That will give the opportunity to the none sponsor drivers to WIN a National event and get then some espouser for future sponsorship from stock and 19t class 6 cell until things are voted and decided. I also will be testing on a asphalt track 118 x 62. I think if we do not test on larger tracks we will never know because on some track that is small the cars are going to be still very fast.
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Old 11-23-2006, 11:20 AM   #33
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I don't think I've ever raced anywhere where there has been more than a cursory adherence to ROAR rules. I agree with DerekB, if it was something racers wanted, clubs would be doing it already.
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Old 11-23-2006, 11:21 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asw7576
Hahahaha .....


I won't play with 4 cells either

In my opinion, going to 4 cells or 5 cells are just smelly strategy done by NiMH manufacturers to kill LiPo market share in battery industry. As everyone knows, LiPo is lighter, superior and need less maintenance than NiMH. LiPo threatens NiMH life cycle. Possibly the battery matching industry could be affected too by LiPo. Same problem with battery discharging equipments, they will be obsolete machines because LiPo doesn't need to be discharge.

IMO, Instead of going slow and slower ( dumb idea ), I would prefer everyone to increase race length to 8 minutes per race in modified and 12 minutes in stock, considering the race in GP ( nitro ) cars are able to race up to 1 hour during the final.

When race length is increase to 8 minutes or 12 minutes, people automatically choose milder motor to save battery power, and they race longer ( more fun ?? )

I guess yes, long race = more fun.
well how about using a voltage regulator for Lipo batteries like the one they use for receiver packs to bring the voltage down.
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Old 11-23-2006, 11:25 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YLLIB
I say do not jump the gun on decision and run 4 mod in a provisional National event on carpet and at the next paved national event run a 4 cell 19t as a provisional class this year. This will let us racers see if it is really enjoyable on differt size tracks, and in return I hope this will make all the factory guys that run in 19t 6 cell run the 4 cell mod and 19t 4 cell class at that event. That will give the opportunity to the none sponsor drivers to WIN a National event and get then some espouser for future sponsorship from stock and 19t class 6 cell until things are voted and decided. I also will be testing on a asphalt track 118 x 62. I think if we do not test on larger tracks we will never know because on some track that is small the cars are going to be still very fast.
Our whole objective is the growth of the hobby and keep every imporant person that is in this hobby now, to stay with us and not quit.

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I completely agree with this, and I think the testing needs to be with stock and 19T TC's not just modified .

The thing that get's me is that a decision is beeing comtemplated for a rule change 6 weeks from now ...and although I know there has been talk back and forth about this subject, the talk was never about "we are thinking of changing all TC classes to 4 cells" ...it's just been pro and con talk.

It just doesn't seem right to make a decision like this that affects all of us paying members without a vote or consensus from us of some sort, and with such a short time period of implementation.
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Old 11-23-2006, 11:28 AM   #36
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ROAR, EFRA and IFMAR all need to work together and make the same changes.

I think 5 cell is a great idea and will bring the speeds down to where they were 2 years ago. Racing isn't always about speed. Look at the results in Cleveland this weekend and you will see that the fast 19t guys will run faster than the average mod guys. So the extra power of a 7 turn doesn't mean your going faster unless your car or driving can handle it. So speed isn't always the solution.

In another few years if cell or motor technology keeps improving then 4 cell can be considered then. But for now the logical step would be 5 cell.
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Old 11-23-2006, 11:30 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny/SMC
ROAR, EFRA and IFMAR all need to work together and make the same changes.

I think 5 cell is a great idea and will bring the speeds down to where they were 2 years ago. Racing isn't always about speed. Look at the results in Cleveland this weekend and you will see that the fast 19t guys will run faster than the average mod guys. So the extra power of a 7 turn doesn't mean your going faster unless your car or driving can handle it. So speed isn't always the solution.

In another few years if cell or motor technology keeps improving then 4 cell can be considered then. But for now the logical step would be 5 cell.
Does'nt 5 cell require different chargers than we have? i.e. my understanding was that current chargers (e.g. I have a 2 pitbulls and a GFX) can do 4 and 6 cell ...admitedly this is just "hearsay" as I have not looked into it on my equipment.
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Old 11-23-2006, 11:30 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TimPotter

My personal opinion is 5 cell. taking the edge off the voltage, and not making stock TOO slow... But it will help the professional stock racers move up to 19t and help stock to be the class it was intended to be.

DUDE THAT IS SO FAR FROM THE TRUTH stock sandbaggers will continued to run stock regardless of 4,5,6 or 7 cells.The reason they won't move up is becuase they lose their alpha male status.....professional stock now that's funny .


On another note this move by Roar "IF" approved would very bad for consumer and the manufactor,, new Corally car, 007 , WC Cyclone, Losi and the Ass. will have to go right back the drawing board to design new car for the lost of weight by switcing from 6 to 4 cell
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Old 11-23-2006, 11:31 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarshGuy
Does'nt 5 cell require different chargers than we have? i.e. my understanding was that current chargers (e.g. I have a 2 pitbulls and a GFX) can do 4 and 6 cell ...admitedly this is just "hearsay" as I have not looked into it on my equipment.
what about 5 cell receiver packs? I think my LRP charges them just fine
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Old 11-23-2006, 11:32 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dawgmeat
DUDE THAT IS SO FAR FROM THE TRUTH stock sandbaggers will continued to run stock regardless of 4,5,6 or 7 cells.The reason they won't move up is becuase they lose their alpha male status.....professional stock now that's funny .


On another this move by Roar "IF" approved would very bad for consumer and the manufactor,, new Corally car, 007 , WC Cyclone, Losi and the Ass. will have to go right back the drawing board to design new car for the lost of weight by switcing from 6 to 4 cell
...wouldn't the Losi with it's mid battery design not have an issue?
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Old 11-23-2006, 11:33 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcos.J
what about 5 cell receiver packs? I think my LRP charges them just fine
I have no idea??? ...again, just going on what people have "said" ..never had a reason to try/look into it before now I guess!!
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Old 11-23-2006, 11:33 AM   #42
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I think that they should eliminate stock alltogether, or change it to Beginer Class that should keep all the pro guys out
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Old 11-23-2006, 11:34 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarshGuy
I have no idea??? ...again, just going on what people have "said" ..never had a reason to try/look into it before now I guess!!
I tried my EC with 4 and 5 cells and its fast either way , the charger had no problems charging the batteries
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Old 11-23-2006, 11:35 AM   #44
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ROAR modified races will be all brushless. I'm a proponent of brushless, but this feels like two steps backwards for one step forward. Did you guys see the pictures of Hara using 4 Cell Masters to charge each cell of his packs individually? Yes, I know you can build that functionality into one charger, but that means we all need new chargers now? What about power supplies?

How does EddieO feel about this, or Daryl Silva? Those two guys rule mod racing. The 4 cell guys were dumping the last 3 laps of a 5 minute races in mod. Why would anybody not just throw a brushless in there and be fast until the end? No amount of tuning will make a brushed motor anywhere close to a brushless in efficiency.

The timing of this, along with the recent ban on LiPo from ROAR events leaves the door wide open for speculation. Like others have said, it probably doesn't matter since nobody actually cares about ROAR, but they have historic importance that still gives them a bit of influence.
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Old 11-23-2006, 11:36 AM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarshGuy
Does'nt 5 cell require different chargers than we have? i.e. my understanding was that current chargers (e.g. I have a 2 pitbulls and a GFX) can do 4 and 6 cell ...admitedly this is just "hearsay" as I have not looked into it on my equipment.
You can charge 5 cells with current chargers. I use a Pitbull and charge 5 cell packs as this is what I use in offroad.
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