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Old 01-01-2007, 07:43 PM   #76
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Originally Posted by UN4RACING
On asphalt rubber can you run say 28 in the rear and 32 in the front.? With any insert you want?

X
No because the numbers on rubber tire mean nothing.

For example:

A Sorex 28R is about the same traction as a Pit Shimzu 24

A Sorex 24R is about the same traction as a Pit Shimzu 20

A Take Off RP30 has more traction and steering than a Take Off CS27

FYI, running harder tires in the front is old school. Running the same compound all around and using the suspension to balance the grip yeilds faster lap times.
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Old 01-01-2007, 07:46 PM   #77
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I do see the point much clearer now. It s keeping the cost that club racers can compete at a higher level. I would exspect that the same is for asphalt.
I just cant zero in on why foam isnt more raced at these events?

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Old 01-01-2007, 07:48 PM   #78
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Is it turn out or just the rule's? It appears that majority could rule a class.
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Old 01-01-2007, 07:57 PM   #79
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Adrian I am parcial to foam on any surface. But i must say you have me dangling on the rubber asphalt. Thanks. They both have there benifit's.

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Old 01-01-2007, 07:57 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by speedxl
That is why we all run rubber in Fl. Tires end up being a 1 to 2 run tire and thus where is the advantage, where as a rubber tire will last 2 -4 runs .
Not all run Rubber in Florida. We actually have those that run electric TCs on foams. Especially by the Coral Springs and Okland Park tracks. For the past year we have been running them, and they are defenitely better. We dont true them. There is no real need for this. We just run them new, and set it up so that they handle even better than new rubbers. As the foams wear, they get better and better, while the rubbers get worse. On prepared tracks we get 12-15 runs, running GTB 3.5 and 4.5 with Orion 4800 Lipo's(that's what we run, Brushless with foams and Lipo). With rubbers, we get 6-8 runs at best, and they cost about $35-38 for set of 4, versus $24 for set of 4 Ennetti tires. I dare anyone to try racing a good TC driver with brand new rubber tires, and another good driver with new foam tires. Set cars up for the track and you'll see that the foams driver will be quicker, faster, and save lots of money in the end.
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Old 01-01-2007, 08:05 PM   #81
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Ok lets try and finish this up. Foam and rubber have to be seperated.
Choose your bugdet so to speak. Tire diamater. would not allow for fair racing just to say the least. I guess get enough people and run foam.
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Old 01-01-2007, 08:12 PM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yyhayyim
Not all run Rubber in Florida. We actually have those that run electric TCs on foams. Especially by the Coral Springs and Okland Park tracks. For the past year we have been running them, and they are defenitely better. We dont true them. There is no real need for this. We just run them new, and set it up so that they handle even better than new rubbers. As the foams wear, they get better and better, while the rubbers get worse. On prepared tracks we get 12-15 runs, running GTB 3.5 and 4.5 with Orion 4800 Lipo's(that's what we run, Brushless with foams and Lipo). With rubbers, we get 6-8 runs at best, and they cost about $35-38 for set of 4, versus $24 for set of 4 Ennetti tires. I dare anyone to try racing a good TC driver with brand new rubber tires, and another good driver with new foam tires. Set cars up for the track and you'll see that the foams driver will be quicker, faster, and save lots of money in the end.
Until you get a few really hard core guys that start running at your track with their tires trued to 58mm from the begining. Then you will have to do it too or just accept that you will not be competative.
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Old 01-01-2007, 08:12 PM   #83
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Thanks fellas I am deffinitly more enlight'ned. Thank's for your pacience. Hopfully everyone reading learned some thing to. Adrian you all most made a rubber racer out of me. Not to gouge but I still would rather do foam any time I could. I for one got something out of this thread I'm going to keep reading though.I would start my foams right out of the box.

Later X.
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Old 01-01-2007, 08:18 PM   #84
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Taller foam more traction. Longer wear. And dont dope your foam's on asphalt for even longer wear.
Sorry could'nt help it. You can get me back later.

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Old 01-01-2007, 08:21 PM   #85
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The costs involved in racing foam or rubber are about the same. The really differance for club racers is keeping up with foam tire wear. Rubber dire dont change in diamter to any meaningful degree from new to completly worn out.

With Foam tires as the tires wear you need to raise the ride height, change the droop becuase as you raise the ride height you get an equal reduction in droop. As you raise the ride height you get a change in camber so you have to reset that. Also as you tires wear every time you get a 2% reduction in tire circumferance you need to alter your gear ratio to maintain the same roll out and overall speed.

On carpet foam wear is less of an issue so all of this is pretty managable. On asphalt, especially unprepared tracks, foam tire wear can be a huge issue. All of this makes more work for guys that just want to race and have fun.

On carpet foam can make sense. On asphalt foam is not good for the hobby.
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Old 01-01-2007, 08:23 PM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UN4RACING
Taller foam more traction. Longer wear. And dont dope your foam's on asphalt for even longer wear.
Sorry could'nt help it. You can get me back later.

X
No dope is less traction, less traction is more sliding, more sliding is more tire wear.

This applies to Rubber and Foam tires.
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Old 01-01-2007, 08:24 PM   #87
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Ok fine sell me some rubber's you dirty dog. I say that nicely. You make it apealling. You definitly got the marketing down. In an honest way.

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Old 01-01-2007, 08:25 PM   #88
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Your missing the point. Nobody argues that Foam is not faster in alot of situations. What is being said... is when things get competetive ( which they always do ). then people will be truing the tires down , so they are 1 or 2 run tires... at that point, you either true your tires down that small, or go home.. because the person truing will be faster. If you want to be competetive, you buy more tires.

Now at Oakland Park, if your not getting 8-10 decent runs out of your rubber tires, then your not setup right. Well then again ( not picking on you here) .. you guys run non rules conforming classes. You dont set a minimum weight.... you guy are out having a good time., and thats great for the hobby, but when it coems to getting into competetive racing, IMHO, you are off base the cost WILL be higher... you could be roasting the rubber with that power...

We run the CS 27 in FSEARA,and if you race that series, you can buy the tires at a sereis price... you would be surpised.... Johan, come on up on Wed night, and you can try out my rubber shod car...

Just because something is faster, does not mean it is better ( more fun for sure:>)


Quote:
Originally Posted by yyhayyim
Not all run Rubber in Florida. We actually have those that run electric TCs on foams. Especially by the Coral Springs and Okland Park tracks. For the past year we have been running them, and they are defenitely better. We dont true them. There is no real need for this. We just run them new, and set it up so that they handle even better than new rubbers. As the foams wear, they get better and better, while the rubbers get worse. On prepared tracks we get 12-15 runs, running GTB 3.5 and 4.5 with Orion 4800 Lipo's(that's what we run, Brushless with foams and Lipo). With rubbers, we get 6-8 runs at best, and they cost about $35-38 for set of 4, versus $24 for set of 4 Ennetti tires. I dare anyone to try racing a good TC driver with brand new rubber tires, and another good driver with new foam tires. Set cars up for the track and you'll see that the foams driver will be quicker, faster, and save lots of money in the end.
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Old 01-01-2007, 08:38 PM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UN4RACING
Is it turn out or just the rule's? It appears that majority could rule a class.

It goes back to bringing different compounds to the track, then you have that special compound tires available to the teams only.
So having a spec tires helps eliminate the advantage of any company or racer.
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Old 01-01-2007, 08:47 PM   #90
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Default Hard Foam tire?

If a race program which had everyone run a spec foam tire, that was very hard( made primarily for long life and durability) and that came pre trued to some set size like 58mm, might solve some of the issues discussed in this thread.

While a hard compound would be slower everyone would be equally effected.

The combo of brushless and lipo cells has the potential of lowering long term costs and maintainence, if we could bring tires into the equation I can see it really helping the sport.
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