Pancar?
10-09-2006, 08:35 AM
#1
Pancar?
Can/Will 1/10th pan car make a comeback?
Is it possible that there is a backlash against 4 wheel drive sedan now? Could it be that some racers want to see pan car racing comeback? Would it really be easier and less expensive to race? Would it be 4 cell instead of 6? Who knows.........
Is it possible that there is a backlash against 4 wheel drive sedan now? Could it be that some racers want to see pan car racing comeback? Would it really be easier and less expensive to race? Would it be 4 cell instead of 6? Who knows.........
10-09-2006, 10:31 AM
#2
Tech Apprentice
I have one in my basement, ready to go. I wouldn't mind seeing this class take off. They aren't as much work as the current 4wd touring cars, which makes everyone spend and spend and spend on the latest car/gadget chasing handling. That's a good thing for manufacturers - keeps em buying the car of the day.
10-09-2006, 04:38 PM
#4
I'd love to see them come back... Run Narrow TC/GT bodies and Wide LMP/GTP bodies... My L3T with a stratus body on it will outcorner any TC...
10-09-2006, 05:09 PM
#5
our club is jumping in, we have several 12th scales and i have my 10l3t, and may add a pantoura.. watch the videos on the pantoura thread af that thing smoking the sedan.. and .3 seconds off some sponsored 8th scalers pace.. all with two wheel drive and getting 17 minute runs.. i'm sold.. also, there are plenty of other companies still making 1/10th pan cars.. darkside motorsports, proten holland has his own prototype, corally, calandra, and even the older associated cars are still well supported with the exception of the 10l3T (touring narrow).. i'm sure i may even be missing one or two... as cheap as you can get into these things i can't figure out why not everyone has one as a second car for fun as i do..... with a stock motor and practice packs i turn in almost as fast of laps as my mod tourer...
Last edited by tallyrc; 10-09-2006 at 05:19 PM.
10-09-2006, 06:55 PM
#6
when i started it was all bout the pan cars. no doubt the fastest forms of rc cars out there. But here is why i dont see come back any time soon:
-boring, the design is flat and by flat i mean there is only so many "right"ways to make one and there is only so much you can do to change them.... they dont need to changed i agree,but what gets the juices flowing most on rc tech more? A spy shot of the T2007? or some pan car with 20year old associated front end on it??
-cost i find the value in a pan car to be low. They are over priced when compared to a touring car of any level, from cyclone sport to the full factory rides. When u consider they lack,tires,rims,bodies half the bearings,3 other shocks,suspension arms top plates,alloy bulkeads,dual diffs ect ect, the componet comparison for the dollar is not on par. For instance from associated you can get a TC4 team car for 214$ or an rc10l4oval for 240$!! Get extreme and a custom works car goes for over $400!!! i know they are 2 different classes of cars but you cant ingore you get ripped when buying a pan car, they should be selling for around the 100$ range
-no RTR pan cars... hate to say it(i hate RTR) but if little jonny cant get his ready to run he likely never would buy one. The cars are 100% track cars only, so the casual rc'r is not likely to ever get his hands on one. none of my 3 local shops even carry a pan car, the odd time they had one they could not sell to anyone cuz for there 300$CND they had box of parts with terrible instructions and another couple a hundred bucks to spend an o by the way they dont run well on parking lots!
-who makes 10th pan cars??? Sure Associated/Yokomo and CRC... but what about the other major brands(cRC not being a major brand in my books) I know buba-racing makes one and ma-and-pa-racing has a conversion kit but what about the major players? With out big names its never going to get big like the pre-touring car days
As for racing for sure once u jump the negatives i posted above for racing at a carpet track its all down to affordable racing, foam tires, low stress on the motors cars never break! ITs all about setup,driving and well motor wars but its a very low cost class compared to touring car, but man touring car is soo much cooler, they look cooler they resemble real cars, they are fun to work on. and dont forget the bling, and the new models ever few months... oh and everyone in the world loves them and races them....
its a tuff battle i think....
-boring, the design is flat and by flat i mean there is only so many "right"ways to make one and there is only so much you can do to change them.... they dont need to changed i agree,but what gets the juices flowing most on rc tech more? A spy shot of the T2007? or some pan car with 20year old associated front end on it??
-cost i find the value in a pan car to be low. They are over priced when compared to a touring car of any level, from cyclone sport to the full factory rides. When u consider they lack,tires,rims,bodies half the bearings,3 other shocks,suspension arms top plates,alloy bulkeads,dual diffs ect ect, the componet comparison for the dollar is not on par. For instance from associated you can get a TC4 team car for 214$ or an rc10l4oval for 240$!! Get extreme and a custom works car goes for over $400!!! i know they are 2 different classes of cars but you cant ingore you get ripped when buying a pan car, they should be selling for around the 100$ range
-no RTR pan cars... hate to say it(i hate RTR) but if little jonny cant get his ready to run he likely never would buy one. The cars are 100% track cars only, so the casual rc'r is not likely to ever get his hands on one. none of my 3 local shops even carry a pan car, the odd time they had one they could not sell to anyone cuz for there 300$CND they had box of parts with terrible instructions and another couple a hundred bucks to spend an o by the way they dont run well on parking lots!
-who makes 10th pan cars??? Sure Associated/Yokomo and CRC... but what about the other major brands(cRC not being a major brand in my books) I know buba-racing makes one and ma-and-pa-racing has a conversion kit but what about the major players? With out big names its never going to get big like the pre-touring car days
As for racing for sure once u jump the negatives i posted above for racing at a carpet track its all down to affordable racing, foam tires, low stress on the motors cars never break! ITs all about setup,driving and well motor wars but its a very low cost class compared to touring car, but man touring car is soo much cooler, they look cooler they resemble real cars, they are fun to work on. and dont forget the bling, and the new models ever few months... oh and everyone in the world loves them and races them....
its a tuff battle i think....
Last edited by Joel Lagace; 10-09-2006 at 06:58 PM. Reason: more
10-09-2006, 07:22 PM
#7
4 sale plug
Pan car 4 sale plug 
Dialed pan car and gear link:
http://www.rctech.net/forum/showthread.php?t=132247
Dialed pan car and gear link:
http://www.rctech.net/forum/showthread.php?t=132247
10-09-2006, 08:55 PM
#8
joel... an xray is $400 a factory team tc4 is/was $350... an rc10L2 is $164 as is the pantoura... also i guess value is in the eye of the beholder.. to me cheaper is cheaper.. for about half the price of an xray, i can smoke one with less maintenance and operational cost.. further, not everyone looks forward to the new cars when they hit the market. infact, some of us dread them and believe they are the bain of our hobby and the primary cause of people leaving it... i'd rather drive the archaic pancars in close fast competition than wrench on my slower more expensive xray in benign tedium. they look cool? they look as dumb as nascars.. amphorous blobs like bars of used soap.. give me a low slung gtp or can-am car anyday so long as it is fast...
10-10-2006, 04:05 AM
#10
tally im not talking about kit costs im talking about kit value. When u compare what u get in a box it dont add up. Obviously to buy a pan car is less money then a touring car, but not by much, The prices i posted where from towers(all 3 prices) For what u get pan cars are a not good value. On the other side of the coin. IF you bought a RTR 1/8th scale these days i feel you getting way better value then either pan or touring car. The mass production of these kits gives you extreme return on your dollar.
As for one being faster then the other i wont disagree, but again they dont race the 2 cars in the same class nor should they. So i wont argue what i dont disagree with, 12th is faster then 10th pan and all pans are faster then touring, but drop by my club with your pan and you dont race. So it dont matter much how fast they are if they dont sell or get raced. And no one is intrested in selling them at local hobby shops... Again i agree they are superior on the track.
I also am not crazy about my latest touring car getting replaced every year by a new model. But u know it comes down to will power and common sence. You dont buy a 2006 honda civic and replace is every year after year cuz they make one?? For some reason racing circles are brain washed into feeling there car is now obsolete the moment the newest chassis drops. A guy at my club is kicking ass with his fk04 still against all the newest tamiya and xray cars... The reality is that people must want new touring cars cuz they sell and they continue to release new chassis for a reason. The market wants them
It truely is a matter of taste but to address the topic as to when or why they wont make a come back you cant discount my original post as bs. Much of what i say is the true. No one has to agree with me but if i feel that way chances are many others do to. OR even worse many others dont(new racers) because they never actually see a pan car in there local hobby shops. Im not bashing pan cars, i started racing on pan, they are great, but the reality is to make a come back they will need some sereios marketing behind them...
As for one being faster then the other i wont disagree, but again they dont race the 2 cars in the same class nor should they. So i wont argue what i dont disagree with, 12th is faster then 10th pan and all pans are faster then touring, but drop by my club with your pan and you dont race. So it dont matter much how fast they are if they dont sell or get raced. And no one is intrested in selling them at local hobby shops... Again i agree they are superior on the track.
I also am not crazy about my latest touring car getting replaced every year by a new model. But u know it comes down to will power and common sence. You dont buy a 2006 honda civic and replace is every year after year cuz they make one?? For some reason racing circles are brain washed into feeling there car is now obsolete the moment the newest chassis drops. A guy at my club is kicking ass with his fk04 still against all the newest tamiya and xray cars... The reality is that people must want new touring cars cuz they sell and they continue to release new chassis for a reason. The market wants them
It truely is a matter of taste but to address the topic as to when or why they wont make a come back you cant discount my original post as bs. Much of what i say is the true. No one has to agree with me but if i feel that way chances are many others do to. OR even worse many others dont(new racers) because they never actually see a pan car in there local hobby shops. Im not bashing pan cars, i started racing on pan, they are great, but the reality is to make a come back they will need some sereios marketing behind them...
10-10-2006, 06:55 AM
#11
Joel, the current TC's have become "Race Only" also... Yea, they will hook up better on a parking lot because of the AWD but the surface is going to destroy your $450 toy.... Except for the RTR TC4 and a Tamiya or 2 it's going to cost you at least $700 for a 10th scale TC these days. That's on the low side if you're not going with top of the line electronics....
10-10-2006, 07:33 AM
#12
i guess we are arguing different points.. all it would take for a resurgence in pancar is 3 people at any track to show up with them.. i guess if there were no value in them the manufacturers would be making a killing profit wise so why don't they push them? probably becasue long before the exotic toureres these were the first cars that had to be machined as compared to mass produced with injection moulding.. (except the front ends) also there are probably more manufacturers producing exceptionally high quality pan kits than touring kits... mom and pop or not, i'll take the quality in a crc or corally kit and put it up against anything from xray tamiya or associated... i guess the real question is what will it take for them to make a resurgence, and for me the answer is for more people to try it and realize that for about half the cost to race they can have a vastly superior racing vehicle... F1 looks nothing like a "real" car but are generally considered the epitome of race cars. pan cars are the F1 of the RC world... and tourers are well... honda civics...
10-10-2006, 11:24 AM
#13
I agree with almost everything said here:
Issue 1- TC is getting far too expensive and is loosing popularity bit time right now because of it.
Problem: Pan cars are far cheaper to make yet they are often over priced due to the low volume produced for said kits. This is also why you very few of the larger companies supporting this market. Tamiya has recently released the F103-GT I know it is not a cutting edge Pan car with all the tech that is available but it very affordable in price and is easily avaialable to the masses is it selling like crazy? I am not sure however I do know it is selling well enough for them to persue making further editions as well as many aftermarket companies popping up to support the chassis.
Issue 2- Pan Cars are not easy to drive in a parking lot or street.
Problem: This is due to them being designed to run close to 2mm if ride height and running foam tires which tear and cone frequently. Some manufactures have begun to develop hubs that allow the use of today TC tires and wheels allowing for a very decent grip level on an un-prepped asphalt surface. The parts are out there but the market is small so there is not alot of racers who know about them.
Issue 3- There no RTR Pan Cars.
Problem: Because there are no RTR kits many people will never experience the ease of use of a Pan Car I would not be surprised to see Tamiya, Corally or somebody else who is developing a pan style car to come out with an RTR version soon.
I think as kits go a beginner would have an exellent experience if they had to assemble a Pan car as there first kit as the simplicity make the assembly much easier.
BoLink has just announced they are re-releasing there legends series anyone remember those? Tamiya hasthere F103-GT which is based on there long running F-1 car from back in the day I have heard rumors of other manufacturers seeing the benefits of the direct drive formula to there customers. In short I feel we will see more and more designs based on the getting costs down as the Chassis manufacturers are the first to see sales figures and the writing is on the wall. I think threads like this are great and serve as a good sounding board for those that are wanting to see Pan cars return. However to make even more of a statement contact the manufacturers directly and let them know what you would like to see they will listen even much more them when they read it on forums.
Issue 1- TC is getting far too expensive and is loosing popularity bit time right now because of it.
Problem: Pan cars are far cheaper to make yet they are often over priced due to the low volume produced for said kits. This is also why you very few of the larger companies supporting this market. Tamiya has recently released the F103-GT I know it is not a cutting edge Pan car with all the tech that is available but it very affordable in price and is easily avaialable to the masses is it selling like crazy? I am not sure however I do know it is selling well enough for them to persue making further editions as well as many aftermarket companies popping up to support the chassis.
Issue 2- Pan Cars are not easy to drive in a parking lot or street.
Problem: This is due to them being designed to run close to 2mm if ride height and running foam tires which tear and cone frequently. Some manufactures have begun to develop hubs that allow the use of today TC tires and wheels allowing for a very decent grip level on an un-prepped asphalt surface. The parts are out there but the market is small so there is not alot of racers who know about them.
Issue 3- There no RTR Pan Cars.
Problem: Because there are no RTR kits many people will never experience the ease of use of a Pan Car I would not be surprised to see Tamiya, Corally or somebody else who is developing a pan style car to come out with an RTR version soon.
I think as kits go a beginner would have an exellent experience if they had to assemble a Pan car as there first kit as the simplicity make the assembly much easier.
BoLink has just announced they are re-releasing there legends series anyone remember those? Tamiya hasthere F103-GT which is based on there long running F-1 car from back in the day I have heard rumors of other manufacturers seeing the benefits of the direct drive formula to there customers. In short I feel we will see more and more designs based on the getting costs down as the Chassis manufacturers are the first to see sales figures and the writing is on the wall. I think threads like this are great and serve as a good sounding board for those that are wanting to see Pan cars return. However to make even more of a statement contact the manufacturers directly and let them know what you would like to see they will listen even much more them when they read it on forums.
10-10-2006, 11:43 AM
#14
Here in Edmonton, Alberta, ten of our club guys bought pancars and some of the "old guard" still have theirs from back in the day, and once or twice a month we all bring them down and run them in an open motor class. Wickedly cool looking, exceptionally fast and very easy to maintain. We even have a few guys who run the cars outdoors in the summer on our prepared asphalt track. With a 19 turn, six cells and foam tires, these cars were beating almost all of the 1/10 nitro cars!!!
Our club has certainly sen an increase in 1/12 over the car of the week T.C. club and i would love to see the 1/10 pans start to takeoff again just like the sportscar scene in the U.S. and Canada.....I would run the new Audi Diesel body on my kit.......if someone made it!!
Our club has certainly sen an increase in 1/12 over the car of the week T.C. club and i would love to see the 1/10 pans start to takeoff again just like the sportscar scene in the U.S. and Canada.....I would run the new Audi Diesel body on my kit.......if someone made it!!
10-10-2006, 12:11 PM
#15
Pancars died because the TC came about. But at that time you could set up a course in a parking lot and pretty much run the cars anywhere. With the new TC's that is no longer the case, there is no way any of us are going to run our CF chassis open drivetrain cars on a lot riddled with cracks and rocks...
There are no more entry level TC's... Don't tell me Tamiya... Besides the Tamiya "toy" cars I have never seen a Tamiya "race" car close up... No one in over 100 miles from here (and many other palces) stock Tamiya. They do carry the toy stuff, but not the stuff you can race...
Pancar may come back because you have a group of people hooked on On Road racing but are tired of the "car of the week" club... Racing at my LHS is pretty much dead... I could drive 40 minutes to another track with a little better turnout but I like where I race and the 5 other guys who also come down... Good thing the LHS doesn't need the track or the racers to stay open...
There are no more entry level TC's... Don't tell me Tamiya... Besides the Tamiya "toy" cars I have never seen a Tamiya "race" car close up... No one in over 100 miles from here (and many other palces) stock Tamiya. They do carry the toy stuff, but not the stuff you can race...
Pancar may come back because you have a group of people hooked on On Road racing but are tired of the "car of the week" club... Racing at my LHS is pretty much dead... I could drive 40 minutes to another track with a little better turnout but I like where I race and the 5 other guys who also come down... Good thing the LHS doesn't need the track or the racers to stay open...