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Old 11-13-2006, 01:59 PM   #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Francis M.
I beleive that the batts needs to be submitted and aproved by 10/1/06 but the actual date it will be legal to race is 01/01/07.


the fact that roar already has the approved list this year shows that ib 4200
will be legal for 2007.
You are correct they are legal for 2007, and they fixed the heading...

But the way they had the heading before, they were not legal, but it is all fixed now....
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Old 11-13-2006, 02:01 PM   #107
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Originally Posted by McSmooth
Supreme Court Justices need to be approved the the Senate.

And the Supreme Court doesn't make the laws.
Guess you've never heard of Case law...


I'm still in awe that they outlawed LiPo reciever packs....
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Old 11-13-2006, 02:07 PM   #108
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AdrianM - This is a sugguestion from a newer member to R/C...

When posting the National locations, could ROAR include with the name, the address, phone number or web site...

Dirtburners - I have no idea what State or how to find out if this reasonable distance to attend or just to go and watch.

I'm sure that others that have more time in this hobby know the location of the bigger tracks, but in this case I know of a number of people in my area that would like to attend a race, if it is close to them... for some 700 miles may be ok, but others it may be only 200 miles...

Anyway, I think you get my request...
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Old 11-13-2006, 02:10 PM   #109
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I had the same problem. I dont know where ARCOR is. All I know is that they are a sanctioning body for oval racing.
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Old 11-13-2006, 03:56 PM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bvoltz
AdrianM - This is a sugguestion from a newer member to R/C...

When posting the National locations, could ROAR include with the name, the address, phone number or web site...
We will be doing this shortly. We just need to work out a few final date conflicts.
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Old 11-13-2006, 10:58 PM   #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bvoltz
AdrianM - This is a sugguestion from a newer member to R/C...

When posting the National locations, could ROAR include with the name, the address, phone number or web site...

Dirtburners - I have no idea what State or how to find out if this reasonable distance to attend or just to go and watch.

I'm sure that others that have more time in this hobby know the location of the bigger tracks, but in this case I know of a number of people in my area that would like to attend a race, if it is close to them... for some 700 miles may be ok, but others it may be only 200 miles...

Anyway, I think you get my request...
Your request actually should go to me. When the dates and races are final I will put them on the National race page with links to each of the tracks information. You can search for tracks by name on the Track Locator http://roarracing.com/tracklocator.php

Corey
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Old 11-13-2006, 11:24 PM   #112
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Also:

11/12/06 LiPo battery decision clarified.

For 2007 Lithium Polymer batteries are not permitted to compete with
NiCad or NiMh batteries in electric class racing because the voltages
are not equivalent nor do the pack dimensions match those currently
observed by ROAR and IFMAR. This rule does not currently affect
receiver packs at this time, however ROAR is concerned with the overall
safety of these cells when located near or around flammable/combustible
materials. ROAR will investigate this further.

http://roarracing.com/news.php
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Old 11-14-2006, 08:50 AM   #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Smash
I had the same problem. I dont know where ARCOR is. All I know is that they are a sanctioning body for oval racing.
www.arcorraceway.com

They're located in New Mexico (near Albuquerque I think).

Paul
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Old 11-14-2006, 10:23 AM   #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianM

We have to chase most of our Regional directors just to send reports and race results to RevUp. There are 2 regions with directors that do NOTHING that ended up having ZERO regional races this year. Are you sure thats who you want in charge?
With the way the ROAR upper-crust basically craps all over the Regional Directors, who's to blame them?

They're expected to promote ROAR (which usually means defending their unfathomable policies to the masses of irritated racers), send in race reports/write articles, organize and travel to the Regional events, try to get people to vote, and what do they get in return? $1 per member and the opportunity to run for higher office? No wonder people are lining up for the job.

Any suggestions or recommendations they make are "taken under advisement" and then they're simply powerless beyond that. These are the elected people that have to go back to their Region and face the racers with "All I could do is make a suggestion, but my hands are tied beyond that."

If you mean what you say about the Regional Directors being your front-line contact with the racers, then make them a voting part of the process. Give them a true voice and you'll get more cooperation out of them.

The non-elected positions should be in the committees and be the ones making recommendations. Otherwise, stop this illusion of being "by-the-racers, for-the-racers" and make ROAR a for-profit company.

That way if we don't like the product, we just won't buy it. Scotty, Boylan, and Mr Bill have been operating under this policy for years...they either make their race better, or racers will go somewhere else.

I had a choice this past year of one big race to travel to. Guess which event I chose? (Hint: it wasn't the ROAR Nationals)

Last edited by McSmooth; 11-14-2006 at 12:13 PM. Reason: Spelling and punctuation
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Old 11-14-2006, 10:24 AM   #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RoachRacing
Also:

11/12/06 LiPo battery decision clarified.

For 2007 Lithium Polymer batteries are not permitted to compete with
NiCad or NiMh batteries in electric class racing because the voltages
are not equivalent nor do the pack dimensions match those currently
observed by ROAR and IFMAR. This rule does not currently affect
receiver packs at this time, however ROAR is concerned with the overall
safety of these cells when located near or around flammable/combustible
materials. ROAR will investigate this further.

http://roarracing.com/news.php
Thanks, I will wait for the posting... about the track loctions....

On the posting above, this is simply not true on the voltage. I have 4200 Worlds and when you add the voltage up you get 7.44 total, and a LiPo is 7.4, so your beloved NiMh are better by .04 volts. All I can say is "next". As far as safety, LiPo is no more or less safe then NiMh, yes it completely true that they both have different ways of being unsafe in the wrong hands, but the question is would you rather be shot in the head by NiMh going off or burned by LiPo, so let's get real here, and start calling correctly. If safety is a concern (no issue with that topic) then they need to take a look at helmets and knee pad for the turn marshals first (all you have to do is watch an 1/8 off road club race), that is a greater risk then this point about batteries.
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Old 11-14-2006, 11:41 AM   #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bvoltz
Thanks, I will wait for the posting... about the track loctions....

On the posting above, this is simply not true on the voltage. I have 4200 Worlds and when you add the voltage up you get 7.44 total, and a LiPo is 7.4, so your beloved NiMh are better by .04 volts. All I can say is "next". As far as safety, LiPo is no more or less safe then NiMh, yes it completely true that they both have different ways of being unsafe in the wrong hands, but the question is would you rather be shot in the head by NiMh going off or burned by LiPo, so let's get real here, and start calling correctly. If safety is a concern (no issue with that topic) then they need to take a look at helmets and knee pad for the turn marshals first (all you have to do is watch an 1/8 off road club race), that is a greater risk then this point about batteries.
FYI Roar goes off of Nominal voltage....NOT average. You are comparing average of a NIMH pack to the Nominal voltage of a LIPO....If your going to try to compare at least do it apples to apples.

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Old 11-14-2006, 11:50 AM   #117
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Quit reading the label on the battery....our batteries are matched and cycled a totally different way than anything else.....there are lots of ways you can make the voltage look even bigger than the 1.2 its rated at. What you are seeing is the average voltage over a certain discharge curve....you are not seeing the nominal voltage.

A Lipo is rated at 3.7 per cell.....however, if a guy like me or oscar or danny were to work up a rating system....you would see numbers even higher than 3.7 per cell.....

Basically what you are doing right now is comparing Horsepower to Rear Wheel Horsepower....

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Old 11-14-2006, 12:31 PM   #118
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I'm not aguring with but this sure seems a lot like marketing hard at work...

EA - I have no idea what you said in your posting, and to me a newbie.... What is point of volatage on a lable from the matchers then? Help me to understand... I really want to learn, but every time I think I understand someone toss in a curve ball.

Don't we want the best discharge voltage, after all this is current/voltage used by the motor when you put the trigger?

Sorry if I'm seem dumb, but really this makes no since to me.

The bottom line, voltage, amps, etc.... that is not the point, the point is ROAR got on the band wangon of saftey about LiPo, and this is just plain BS. My question still stands, which would your prefer getting shot by a NiMh or burned by a LiPo? The correct answer is neither, but it could happen, either one. If LiPo is a "safety" issue, then I see a lot of other things that are MUCH more likely to happen then this topic. It has been pointed out by others on here what the saftey issues that have a great chance of happening are.
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Old 11-14-2006, 12:40 PM   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bvoltz
I'm not aguring with but this sure seems a lot like marketing hard at work...

EA - I have no idea what you said in your posting, and to me a newbie.... What is point of volatage on a lable from the matchers then? Help me to understand... I really want to learn, but every time I think I understand someone toss in a curve ball.
Nominal voltage is what a cell is rated at when it has no charge in it...Its also "resting voltage". If you look on the actualy cell shrink wrap it says 1.2 volts 4200mah. On a lipo pack its "resting" voltage is 3.7 volts. But its average is much higher than that. Just like a IB cells is much higher on average than its "resting" voltage.

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Old 11-14-2006, 12:43 PM   #120
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Ok, well first....our batteries are processed to help weed out bad cells.....thats a big thing, as one bad cell can sure ruin a pack.

Second, the cells are processed under a set of conditions that attempt to mimick the conditions in an RC car......

So, since we know a race is 5 minutes.....and amp loads are at least 20 amps at all times....matchers often use these as a basis for their settings on their matchers.....

So right now, a battery is charged at 5 amps and then discharged at 35 amps until it reaches .90 per cell......many matchers feel that this represents a good set of numbers to see how a pack will perform over a 5-8 minute race.....

Now, if you say....discharged at 50 amps or discharged down to say .10 per cell, you would see MUCH lower voltage ratings.....

Now, a lithium based battery would be no different......charge it up......then discharge it at a certain amperage to a specified voltage......depending on your numbers, you will get a average voltage that either is over or under the 3.7 per cell rating.....

So what I am saying, is before too long.....you will see little stickers on lithium packs......that have numbers bigger than 7.4 volts per pack....

You don't honestly believe that all the battery companies are just going to fade away do you? Ask any big battery company....NO two batteries are created equal.....it would cost a hell of alot more than $10 a cell or whatever....

Later EddieO
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