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Old 03-14-2007, 07:04 PM   #1006
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The sticky out contains petrolium distillates but it is pure orange oil mostly "limonene". This can be considered a petroleum distillate but it is made from orange peels and nothing else. It is water soluble. Most mechanic hand cleaners have changed to this base. It bothers me only as much as peeling an orange does. None at all. There are other similar products. I have a quart of pure orange oil that is used to clean up after pets. Usually you dilute it with water but full strength it is the same as sticky out.
John

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Old 03-14-2007, 07:18 PM   #1007
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Hey John, My I Force comes with a complete IRS large D-ring axle and diff with 2 different diff hubs and is capable of being set up for 190, 200, and 235. According to the instructions, anyway. I just got it today and have only started prepping things for assembly. I'm going to try the 190 width first. I have a really neat Tamiya LC 70 Courage LMP body on the way,and it is 190. But I will probably try the others as well. It is a really nice kit.

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Old 03-14-2007, 07:38 PM   #1008
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Bob-Well then I have to put a recommend sticker on that I-force. When You get time, see if there is a way to set the front end to 212-214 mm. Maybe it just needs a couple new small holes in the graphite. Now don't drill yours, I am just curious. If you can, then I'll change to a highly recommend for a wide car. I like the looks of the car and the extra hubs sure make it a good value. Those hubs are pricey. That 212 mm is the width that fits the available wide bodies well.

Here is a link to a pic of that body. Tamiya LC70. Those rear wheel tubs may not be wide enough for a 1/10 pan foam tire. I heard a suggestion to narrow the foam tire by truing away the inner portion. Tell us what you find out.

John

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Old 03-14-2007, 08:13 PM   #1009
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John, Here are a couple of pics of the front of the chassis, it has 2 wheelbase settings, and the small holes on the inside of the black cf pieces are for width adjustments. They bolt to the small holes inside the slots for width, and keeps the width intact should you "bump" something.
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Pantoura, 1/10 Pan Car, 2S LiPo, Brushless, Tips and Tricks.-im001372.jpg   Pantoura, 1/10 Pan Car, 2S LiPo, Brushless, Tips and Tricks.-im001373.jpg  
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Old 03-14-2007, 08:37 PM   #1010
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Bob- Nice pics thanks. People will be much better informed when we get done. It would be nice for a lot of people if it would easily change to a standard wide pan car 235mm wide at the back and 212 wide at the front. Let me study the pic a bit. Are the slots only for clearance on the heads of the 8 x 32 screws or do the big screws actually hold the slot on a bevel underneath? Does it look like you can get 4 separate front widths. What are they? you can measure once you get the front end assembled with tires on.
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Old 03-14-2007, 10:26 PM   #1011
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i thought someone said the darkside only goes out to 225mm wide?
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Old 03-14-2007, 10:29 PM   #1012
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I saw that post. If there is two right hand rear hubs it is likely one is wide and one is narrow. I don't think IRS makes a mid size right hand hub for road cars. I have to think that 225 applied to the front. Bob is going to set us straight. He needs some assembly time.
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Old 03-15-2007, 07:08 PM   #1013
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OK, John, here's the scoop on the front end. In stock form, Associated dynamic front end, It ranges from 183mm to 200mm not quite the 212 you were looking for, but if you use that new front end you're working on, isn't it wider? Here's some pics of it mocked up. hope it does some good.
Attached Thumbnails
Pantoura, 1/10 Pan Car, 2S LiPo, Brushless, Tips and Tricks.-im001379.jpg   Pantoura, 1/10 Pan Car, 2S LiPo, Brushless, Tips and Tricks.-im001375.jpg   Pantoura, 1/10 Pan Car, 2S LiPo, Brushless, Tips and Tricks.-im001378.jpg  
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Old 03-15-2007, 07:18 PM   #1014
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the black pieces aren't designed to stick out like "wings" (like john's original aluminum extentions)?
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Old 03-15-2007, 07:45 PM   #1015
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Bob-Thanks a bunch. One more request if you don't mind. The rear end with the wide right hand hub. Just put this on the axle with some tires and slide that left hub as far as you can while having a reasonable amount of the axle stuck in the left hub. Measure the width. Maybe the 225 number is coming because the axle is not quite long enough. A wide axle would cure that.


My front end does make my narrow car wide. I am looking into production. I am going to go through one more prototype and see if I can tidy it up a bit.

TallyRC-the chassis looks wider in the front than my Pantoura. That is why I hoped it would reach out farther than 200mm. Bob maybe you could take a picture of the top with the car wide. I'll take a look at the bottom pic and the top pic and see if there is an easy fix to go wide. I know you are going to run narrow, but the wide public needs to know. Thank you for your time. That car looks realy nice with the lettering and color that it is.
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Old 03-15-2007, 07:48 PM   #1016
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Nope, see the smaller holes just to the inside of the slots? those are used for small screws and nuts to lock the front suspension in place. There are 4 predrilled widths available and 2 wheelbase settings. Rather efficient setup to me.
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Old 03-15-2007, 08:05 PM   #1017
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OK, here is top view narrow, wide. rear axle wide diff hub, narrow diff hub. axle is just about 1/8" in from being flush on the outer side on the left. you might squeak another 1/8 to 3/16" but I think you'd really be stressing the end of the axle. The narrow measure is 208, wide is 216
Attached Thumbnails
Pantoura, 1/10 Pan Car, 2S LiPo, Brushless, Tips and Tricks.-im001380.jpg   Pantoura, 1/10 Pan Car, 2S LiPo, Brushless, Tips and Tricks.-im001381.jpg   Pantoura, 1/10 Pan Car, 2S LiPo, Brushless, Tips and Tricks.-im001382.jpg   Pantoura, 1/10 Pan Car, 2S LiPo, Brushless, Tips and Tricks.-im001383.jpg   Pantoura, 1/10 Pan Car, 2S LiPo, Brushless, Tips and Tricks.-im001384.jpg  

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Old 03-15-2007, 08:09 PM   #1018
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out side to outside on the front of the chassis is 106mm
I have a question for you, John, have you ever tried or considered trying the BSR radials for a pan? They use them on outdoor ovals, asphalt and concrete.

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Old 03-15-2007, 08:43 PM   #1019
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Bob. OK thanks. The chassis would need to be about 120 mm wide at the front to go 212 with the stock associated suspension. It is not. The Car would probably need a wide pan car rear axle and a wide road pan car right hub (non offset pod) plus spacers and an extended pinion to go 235 mm at the back. Your wide hub (or the narrow one) is probably custom made for Darkforce.
The good news is that an adaptor similar to the stock one could be made with plain graphite plate or G10 plate with simple tools and a countersink to space that front end out another 12 mm or so. This has been such a mystery and nobody would give a straight answer. Thanks. It would be similar to the wings I made earlier to make my car wide but would only stick out just a little from the edge. They would be flat and simple which would be better than the ones I made. The Associated 8 x 32 screws in the suspension lower arm would be 1/2 covered by the edge of the chassis. An extra set of 8 x 32 screws would help hold the outside edge of the adaptor to the slots. Some adjustment would be available if you copied the same design as the Darkforce adaptor and just made it wider on the outside ends. I just note this for the guys that want to buy wide.

The same type of plain flat adaptors can also be made for the Pantoura to make it wide. Same rear axle mods.

I have not tried the BSR tires. The ones I have work so well I hate to spend the money to test. When they run out again, I'll give them a test.

I am hoping you can remove a set of spacers and go narrower than 208 at the back.
John

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Old 03-15-2007, 09:52 PM   #1020
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Hey John, I just wanted to again apologize if I sounded arrogant with my correction of one of your posts. I must say that this is a very cool project of yours. Also, Im loving that thing you and Marty are working on.
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