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Old 07-09-2007, 04:46 PM   #1456
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Originally Posted by GymBeam View Post
why would you need to specify a 90% capacity for, because the ICE will "peak" one it reaches 8.4V @ 0.10a
I think he recommended it as an additional safety measure. This way if due to a random glitch the charger does not stop properly it will cut off before it gets too far.
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Old 07-09-2007, 04:56 PM   #1457
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You can't really cycle LiPo's like you cycle out a NiMh cell/pack. Well, you can but the numbers will not be very good. I don't think they like a high current constant discharge.

My 3200 works fine on the track and that's all that matters for me.
Isnt High current cosntant amp draw, what gives your car the top speed along the straight you need?

not knocking it but looking at the discharge curve, i cant see how the 3200 lipo can match up to IB3800, let alone 4200WC's, unless one was to run the car 200gram lighter
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Old 07-09-2007, 05:04 PM   #1458
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Here is a page from the trakpower information PDF with 30a curves.
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Team Orion 3200mAh Race Spec LiPo-lipo.jpg  
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Old 07-09-2007, 05:20 PM   #1459
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Are you oval racing with this thing? I know oval guys stress over every last penny when it comes to graphs and things. I've been running them for a while now, and honestly, I don't feel down on power. Gear up a tooth and wheel it.
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Old 07-09-2007, 05:40 PM   #1460
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My 3200 also came with the case split like yours. you could easily pull them apart and see inside. I just pressed fairly hard on the half's and the tape stuck really well after that.

Don't discharge you lipo pack any more, you don't need to. Just charge and run it!
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Old 07-09-2007, 05:44 PM   #1461
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thanks for that pic. i do agree with the LiPo discharge curve.

But the IB4200 Curve just isnt representative of a good IB pack. at 100sec its already at 6.25v? and only total 6.13Avg voltage?

and look at 110sec the IB discharge curve starts going up, that normally happens when the IB pack has been left sitting around unused for months on end, and IR has gone up.

I do agree though that the lipos do have better voltages near the tail end. thus giving better run time.

my opinion, the Orion3300's great for bashers and people who want maintenance free playing, and those who dont have to worry about weight limits or balancing the car, but for racers who want voltage, Nimhs are much better.
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Old 07-09-2007, 07:15 PM   #1462
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my opinion, the Orion3300's great for bashers and people who want maintenance free playing, and those who dont have to worry about weight limits or balancing the car, but for racers who want voltage, Nimhs are much better.
The voltage thing really only matters when comparing the two directly, and is NiMH's only merit, if you want to call it that. If you're racing in a mixed environment, and the track is flexible enough to let you play with different batteries, you can probably get away with shedding a few ounces too, which more than makes up for anything you might lose with a little voltage. Also, the voltage game means a lot less in mod than it does stock and 19T, especially in places like off-road. Some classes value run time over voltage, which LiPo has in spades. In truth, the only place it may be at a disadvantage is in stock and 19T sedans with old weight limits in place. That's not the majority of racing these days.

Also, people have pointed out that the safe cells Orion uses are relatively low on the voltage side compared to others. You could experiment with the TrakPower/Enerland cells, or the MaxAmps/UnknownChineseOrigin cells for more voltage, perhaps, though likely giving up some safety and cycle life in the process.
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Old 07-10-2007, 06:35 AM   #1463
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I've done my first cycle on the Lipos....

I'm a bit concerned about the numbers....

I charged them up and then did a discharge cycle.

Charger Settings 20 amps, 6.6V cut off.

My results for the Orion 3200 was, DIS 2272mah, 6.955v Average Voltage, 33 IR


(For reference Comparing this to my IB3800 Pack i got

Dis 3021mah, 7.260v Ave Voltage, 30 IR)
Check out this info from the Platinum thread regarding comparing lipos during low amp discharging: http://www.rctech.net/forum/showpost...postcount=1144
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Old 07-10-2007, 10:19 AM   #1464
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Here is a page from the trakpower information PDF with 30a curves.
I have to agree with Gymbeam. That IB graph is TOTALLY wrong. IB cells are really bad with one cell (or more) being bad right out of the box BUT if you get 6 cells that are good or even average then the discharge curve is WAY better then what is shown on that graph !
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Old 07-10-2007, 11:29 AM   #1465
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I have to agree with Gymbeam. That IB graph is TOTALLY wrong. IB cells are really bad with one cell (or more) being bad right out of the box BUT if you get 6 cells that are good or even average then the discharge curve is WAY better then what is shown on that graph !
Cool, so I'll keep buying IB cells every month to maintain that slight advantage that only matters to top 3% national level drivers and professional bench racers.

I like knowing what I have, every run, every cycle, every 100th cycle. Stay off the boards two less times a run and you more then made up for that graph.
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Old 07-10-2007, 11:53 AM   #1466
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Cool, so I'll keep buying IB cells every month to maintain that slight advantage that only matters to top 3% national level drivers and professional bench racers.

I like knowing what I have, every run, every cycle, every 100th cycle. Stay off the boards two less times a run and you more then made up for that graph.
Take a look at this from the link that linger had provided: http://www.slowflyer.ch/downloads/tn06003v2.pdf

In figure 1 they show the pack capacity and voltage per cell charted from over 200 cycles with a Kokam 4800 mAh 3S1P pack. Flat as a board for over 200 runs. Imagine buying a pack and knowing you are going to get the same performance out of it for 200 runs as opposed to hmmm....10 maybe. The testing was done at nearly 60 amps as well.

Last edited by kuzo; 07-10-2007 at 12:10 PM.
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Old 07-10-2007, 12:03 PM   #1467
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Originally Posted by kuzo View Post
Take a look at this from the link that linger had provided: http://www.slowflyer.ch/downloads/tn06003v2.pdf

In figure 1 they show the pack capacity and voltage per cell charted from over 200 cycles with a Kokam 4800 mAh 3S1P pack. Flat as a board for over 200 runs. Imagine buying a pack and Knowing you are going to get the same performance out of it for 200 runs as opposed to hmmm....10 maybe. The testing was done at nearly 60 amps as well.
It's unfortunate that LiPo is being judged on its voltage vs. NiMH, but that's what's going to happen. I'd say the answer is to shed a few oz to make up for it if you find yourself having trouble.
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Old 07-10-2007, 02:18 PM   #1468
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Originally Posted by jag88 View Post
I have to agree with Gymbeam. That IB graph is TOTALLY wrong. IB cells are really bad with one cell (or more) being bad right out of the box BUT if you get 6 cells that are good or even average then the discharge curve is WAY better then what is shown on that graph !
sure, for like 10-20 runs, then it's a $60 dollar practice pack..
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Old 07-10-2007, 02:19 PM   #1469
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Originally Posted by GymBeam View Post
Isnt High current cosntant amp draw, what gives your car the top speed along the straight you need?

not knocking it but looking at the discharge curve, i cant see how the 3200 lipo can match up to IB3800, let alone 4200WC's, unless one was to run the car 200gram lighter
I can't think of a single class that has a constant current draw. A huge oval might get close.

In any case, all I'm saying is that I don't think that the LiPo cells like a constant discharge rate like the NiMh cells do. I would rather let the lap times tell the story than a discharge curve.

Power {(amps X voltage)-Efficiency} is what gives you that speed on the straight. Less voltage and you need more current. More voltage and you need less current.
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Old 07-11-2007, 01:39 PM   #1470
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Did not know where else to put this but here is an Orion charger and a Novak 4.5 amp power supply. Got tired of carrying around a bigger power supply the the charger.
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Team Orion 3200mAh Race Spec LiPo-dsc00881.jpg   Team Orion 3200mAh Race Spec LiPo-dsc00882.jpg   Team Orion 3200mAh Race Spec LiPo-dsc00883.jpg  
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