R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 02-15-2007, 11:47 PM   #706
Tech Legend
 
Wild Cherry's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: TRCR Modified Driver
Posts: 22,595
Default

I was a bit concerned bout running these 3200`s to low ...


Though if they need a cut off device, it must be easy to go to low..


On the track however it quit easy to feel the pack beginning to drop off and it is time to pull off....

If you do , I`m getting 7.25 or better....
__________________
Any driver can copy a great set up, a Champion however will steal it .
If Jesus returned as a Rc car he be a Rc10 B5M
George W. Cherry
Wild Cherry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2007, 09:07 AM   #707
Tech Addict
 
MrBlack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: OC
Posts: 746
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BP SHADOW
My issue is that no one out there is making a lipo with specs similar or identical to Orions. How would you do this? I wanted to mandate that the only legal Lipo be the Peak/Orion because of the techability. That got shot down, yet the same group were b itching because of the safety issues.
Yes there is a hige difference in cell quality for Li-Po's and yes there are still some very dangerous cells being sold out there and they are usually the cheapest. With Li-Po as I have said in the past you definately get what you pay for. Our Li-Po's are definately not the cheapest on the market and I garauntee other brands make more profit per battery then we do. We also spent about a year doing R/D before we even began production instead of saying instead of taking a cheap cell and putting a shiny label on it. Tamiya has made Our Li-Po exclusively legal for one of their TCS classes and maybe this will be a good example going forward.

Note* Here is where I get preachy so many of you may want to skip this part: We are feeling very strong these days that the R/C world needs to have manufacturers step up and take some responsibility and elevate the quality and usability of the products. Our hope is that consumers will see this and start supporting the quality brands rather then those that simply put a sticker on somebody elses product without any investement in research to turn a profit. Consumers have the most power and when they choose to buy the cheap version they hurt themselves more so then they will ever know. I am not saying you should always buy the most expensive brand as this angle is also abused, but I would suggest doing a lot of research on both the product and the company that stands behind it before you make any purchasing decision.
__________________
TEAM ORION - AVIONICS - KYOSHO - KO PROPO - PEAK

"Racing is about the journey not the destination if it wasn't it would simply be called Arriving"

"The solution is people need to spend more of their efforts on promoting and finding more people to race with, rather then a personal quest to form a class that they can win at."
MrBlack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2007, 09:49 AM   #708
Tech Fanatic
 
SlamMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 847
Default

I've got a couple questions for you MrBlack. I'd like to propose the use of LiPo batteries for the upcoming outdoor season at the local club. What types of rules would you suggest we set to keep things fare and more importantly safe. Also, what are the unsafe things that we make sure people avoid doing to their batteries, particularly the batteries Orion sells. Should we limit the use of LiPo to certain brands or those with hard enclosures?

While I'm pretty confident in the safety of the Orion LiPo stuff an incident would set things back quite a bit at the local club.

We all appreciate you taking the time to communicate directly with your customers on a regular basis. Thanks!
__________________
Michael H

OnRoadColorado.com
Colorado On Road RC Club
SlamMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2007, 10:23 AM   #709
Tech Apprentice
 
steve a.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Goose Creek SC
Posts: 78
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Send a message via AIM to steve a. Send a message via MSN to steve a.
Default

what my club has said is run li-po at your own risk. The ones that are running li-po's myself included know that if something happens its our own fault and we also are running the team orion li-po's. I know my club doesn't have any quams about li-po but right now our regular turnout is 10 to 15 guys and we are only running 2 classes off-road and touring (truggy & buggy off-road gas, mod, and stock all in the same class on-road) Issues with former club business but we are starting to get back to racing thank goodness
__________________
Starcar Vice President come check us out
www.starcarrc.com
steve a. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2007, 10:34 AM   #710
Tech Legend
 
Wild Cherry's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: TRCR Modified Driver
Posts: 22,595
Default

Common joke right now at my track when my Advantage charger chimes it finish charging ....

LOOK OUT !

She`s gona blow !!!.....


Bad joke I know ...
Just showing how bad racer`s are being misinformed ...
__________________
Any driver can copy a great set up, a Champion however will steal it .
If Jesus returned as a Rc car he be a Rc10 B5M
George W. Cherry
Wild Cherry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2007, 12:54 PM   #711
Tech Fanatic
 
SlamMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 847
Default

I believe many people are afraid of marshaling an exploding car. Albeit unlikely, we should take measure that this doesn't happen.
__________________
Michael H

OnRoadColorado.com
Colorado On Road RC Club
SlamMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2007, 01:22 PM   #712
Tech Master
 
sportpak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Ft Wayne, IN
Posts: 1,314
Trader Rating: 26 (100%+)
Default

Mandate people buy quality batteries. If people are buying junk and blowing up, all of them will be hard to convince. I'm spear-heading LiPo at my local track starting after this winter season. I've had it with Nimh. So I'm buying two of these batteries and showing people how well they work and how durable they are. It only takes one local idiot to sour people that don't have anything but an opinion in the first place. I had a MaxAmps lipo and it was awesome. Too bad it didn't have the hardshell case. That spooked people at my track. I look forward to using these in my BK2 this summer and my "still make believe" JRXS type R next fall.
__________________
-Tamiya TA05-R - Tamiya M05 - Summit Raceway Ft. Wayne, IN

www.summitrcraceway.com
sportpak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2007, 03:06 PM   #713
Tech Lord
 
syndr0me's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: 5280 Raceway
Posts: 13,141
Trader Rating: 32 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SlamMan
I believe many people are afraid of marshaling an exploding car. Albeit unlikely, we should take measure that this doesn't happen.
What if you just show up and race? I mean, would someone actually tell you "no," or would they just sneer and give you a hard time? Most tracks want people to race, ya know? There hasn't been a single report of an Orion pack doing anything more than puffing up and letting out a little smoke, and only when they're grossly mistreated.
syndr0me is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2007, 03:11 PM   #714
Tech Addict
 
Iceracer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 656
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

1. What will result in a lipo going into combustion?
2. Is it as simple as just running it down too far then recharging it?
3. Can we be assured of safe charging with certain chargers?
4. How foolproof is charging with a lipo charger? What safeguards are built in?
5. Will a crash of an RC car result in a lipo battery fire?
6. Will a short in the wiring cause a lipo to combust?
7. Are there any warning signs as to when a battery is going to burn up?
8. What is the worst case scenario? A small smoldering fire? Flames shooting in every direction? Toxic smoke? An explosion? What are we dealing with here when things do go bad.

I think these are the kinds of questions we need authoritatively answered before we can deal with the safety concerns surrounding lipo batteries and get them into widespread use in competition. I'm hooked on them for RC flight, and wouldn't waste a dollar on NIMH for an airplane, other than possibly a receiver pack in a nitro plane. Its the maintenance issues with NIMH and their rapid demise that makes me interested in lipo power.
Iceracer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2007, 03:12 PM   #715
Tech Lord
 
syndr0me's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: 5280 Raceway
Posts: 13,141
Trader Rating: 32 (100%+)
Default

Maybe if people see the product shots of the new Losi with the Platinum battery in it, or the fact that the new Schumacher's bulkheads are designed specifically to fit the square Platinum pack they'll ease up a little bit with the "fear." It's pretty widely used and accepted now days, with no incidents to speak of. Some reputable car manufacturers are pretty clearly on the bandwagon.

But that's Orion's cells. There are some cheap, dangerous LiPo's out there. I agree that tracks that allow LiPo should mandate that you use quality, proven batteries that have a good safety track record.
syndr0me is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2007, 03:15 PM   #716
Tech Lord
 
syndr0me's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: 5280 Raceway
Posts: 13,141
Trader Rating: 32 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iceracer
1. What will result in a lipo going into combustion?
2. Is it as simple as just running it down too far then recharging it?
3. Can we be assured of safe charging with certain chargers?
4. How foolproof is charging with a lipo charger? What safeguards are built in?
5. Will a crash of an RC car result in a lipo battery fire?
6. Will a short in the wiring cause a lipo to combust?
7. Are there any warning signs as to when a battery is going to burn up?
8. What is the worst case scenario? A small smoldering fire? Flames shooting in every direction? Toxic smoke? An explosion? What are we dealing with here when things do go bad.

I think these are the kinds of questions we need authoritatively answered before we can deal with the safety concerns surrounding lipo batteries and get them into widespread use in competition. I'm hooked on them for RC flight, and wouldn't waste a dollar on NIMH for an airplane, other than possibly a receiver pack in a nitro plane. Its the maintenance issues with NIMH and their rapid demise that makes me interested in lipo power.
The problem with those questions is that it's a moving target. The answer would be different depending on whose LiPo you're using. The cheap batteries that are causing spectacular fires are giving the good, safe batteries produced by Kokam a bad name. As such, it's impossible to give a definitive answer to those questions for all LiPo. And it's certainly not fair to use the lowest common denominator (cheap cells) since the safe cells are entirely different.
syndr0me is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2007, 03:48 PM   #717
Tech Addict
 
Iceracer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 656
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by syndr0me
The problem with those questions is that it's a moving target. The answer would be different depending on whose LiPo you're using. The cheap batteries that are causing spectacular fires are giving the good, safe batteries produced by Kokam a bad name. As such, it's impossible to give a definitive answer to those questions for all LiPo. And it's certainly not fair to use the lowest common denominator (cheap cells) since the safe cells are entirely different.
I agree, and that's why it would be best if a manufacturor made a statement of faqs about their product(s).
Iceracer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2007, 03:58 PM   #718
Tech Champion
 
Davidka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 9,936
Trader Rating: 77 (100%+)
Default

To be fair, these "bad batteries" are probably the irresponsibility of a company. They are probably being over rated and over loaded. Used for their intended purpose these batteries would've probably been fine. Cel phone and computer batteries are not charged and discahrged at high currents so they are always going to be more reliable that RC applications. This was true of NiCd and NiMh too.
__________________
"I have no idea what you're talking about, so here's a bunny with a pancake on it's head."

In mind and body, we're all heading towards old age. It is slower to go by bike.
Davidka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2007, 04:07 PM   #719
Tech Elite
 
Joel Lagace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 2,628
Trader Rating: 4 (100%+)
Default

Who thinks that once say ROAR says legal tomorrow and all racers go lipo that all the issues we have with nihm will return with lipo as the batteries hit 100$ as you will be able to put club,racer.team versions and all the voodoo we doooo with nihm will return with matching and equilizing ect...... Do current lipo racers(not bashers) really think that it will stay simple as it is today, once everyone starts to race them?

I know right now its all love as u charge em racem forget em, but once they start to really get exploited during competative racing... Doesnt anyone think that all this plug and play hype is gonna turn into ya plug and play if u bash(current stickpack non matched nihm user) and spend spend spend to maintain race version lipos like racers do now with nihm?

As i see it if all things are being equalrice,safety,voltage,run time the only long term differance would be weight savings right? This in the wake of racing bodies trying to slow cars down with less voltage would going to lighter cells actually speed the cars up?


Just sniffing out lipo scene, watching taking notes ....not ready to jump in now.... From the total lack of track side or forum discussions at our club i dont see my self needing to do the switch any time soon.

What are current life spans? What will they be once the manufactures push to produce better voltage then there competators(aka like nihm matching)
__________________
"Without Rules its just Backyard Bashing!"
www.rcottawa.com
Joel Lagace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2007, 04:48 PM   #720
Tech Elite
 
mtveten's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,668
Trader Rating: 27 (100%+)
Default

Joel,

I think anyone who claims LiPos will stay unmatched simple packs like they are now is naive at best.

As more companies switch over to LiPo they are bound to look for and find ways to improve pack performance through some kind of cell processing & matching. Just like NiCd & NiMh batters LiPos will continue to evolve and grow in voltage, capacity, and discharge capability.

Where I see the long term advantage of LiPo is in the reduction in weight, maintenance equipment, required # of race packs and their ability to hold their peak performance level longer. Put simply the new tech batteries will help combat the increasing race cost.

Mark
mtveten is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
NIP Team Orion 3200Mah Lipo Race Pack limbohz R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 0 05-30-2008 10:36 AM
Peak 3200mah carbon spec lipo aus jd 2703 Australia For Sale/Trade 8 04-23-2008 09:12 PM
Team Orion Carbon Edition 3200mAh LiPo squearl R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 7 03-11-2008 06:35 AM
Team Orion Carbon Edition 3200mAh lipo batteries dido41 R/C Items: Wanted to Buy 3 07-26-2007 04:10 PM
2 Team Orion Carbon Edition 3200mAh LiPo Batteries CCristo R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 1 05-04-2007 11:48 AM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 03:01 PM.


We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net