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Old 07-22-2006, 07:58 AM   #1
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Default Drill test on Li-po

have a look ,even holds it in he`s hand just to show some of you out there
Li-Po is coming on in leaps & bounds

http://www.pfmdistribution.com/Apogee_Puncture_Test.wmv

saw the thread about jeff cruffs accident & some guy`s saw it as a anti Li-Po showing

i go & get a NiMh exploding video if you want

i have been using the peak Li-Po (1 pk) no probs run it flat in pratice charged up no probs with a 35.00 charger that does NiCad.NiMh,Li-po,, use it all the time
outdoors ,indoors ,race for 5 mins top up go back out , top speed is not what the peak Li-Po is about ,it is the fact you only need 1 pack for the whole day ,no matter how many heats you have 4 heats or 12 heats pack gets enough energy in it to fully race with no probs ,does not need to be fully charged for it to perform
no discharging, no traying

95.00 (peak Li-Po) + 50.00 (charger) total 135.00 to fully race with
just get it passed by BRCA board ,then no more cell wars

Disclaimer
just my thoughts in loud , not in cement
but i do race with a peak Li-Po pack in 27t & 19t class
cars it`s been in
yok SD ,Yoke LCG ,tamiya Evo4, Cyclone
Peak Li-po & 27t class
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Old 07-22-2006, 08:22 AM   #2
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Colin, only one problem, that's NOT a "conventional" LiPo battery! It's Li-Mn chemistry (Lithium Manganese)! You get current "LiPo's" approved, then what? Then Li-Mn, then what? ......and so on......and so on.....

Suggest that you may want to read this as well: http://www.pfmdistribution.com/files...Guidelines.pdf which has to be signed as agreed before they will sell you a pack.......

Even though these cells have a discharge rating of 20C, continous use at 20C will reduce their life to around 50 cycles - this is the manufacturers information.....that doesn't make them any cheaper than running any other rechargeable cell, in fact it's probalby more expensive, especially if your ESC doesn't have a configurable low voltage cutoff as if you run them below 3.0v per cell under load, they will vent and flame up next time they are charged - again, manufacturers own information..... I think I prefer NiMH........

Last edited by modeltech; 07-22-2006 at 09:07 AM.
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Old 07-22-2006, 08:42 AM   #3
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its actually the lithium which is the dangerous part of the cell, so doesnt matter if itis LIPO or LIMN
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Old 07-22-2006, 08:58 AM   #4
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Actually the chemistry makes a huge difference to both the cells voltages and it's inherent safety and environmental characteristics!
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Old 07-22-2006, 11:37 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by modeltech
Colin, only one problem, that's NOT a "conventional" LiPo battery! It's Li-Mn chemistry (Lithium Manganese)! You get current "LiPo's" approved, then what? Then Li-Mn, then what? ......and so on......and so on.....

......
it will go on & on & on like it allway`s does
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Old 07-22-2006, 11:50 AM   #6
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by the time the speedo get`s down to 3.0v you won`t have any steering before that the servo would of stopped working

my MRT goes down to 4.8v before shutoff & i ran my Peal Li-Po down really flat dowm aldershot awhile ago
no prob`s with recharging ,also happened @ sidcup indoor trying to see how many race`s i can do on one charge in 27t (2.5 race`s) before suddenly slowing ,acted like a closely matched pack C-cells really (all went @once)

Mike
how can running one pack of Peak Li-Po be dearer then having 4 packs of NiMh cells & discharge tray & charger , Also for 4.50 you can get a voltage cutoff gadjet(adjustable) to go between speedo & batt ,Heli & plane boy`s use these all the time
airplane boy`s have charger`s which are only 60.00 which are all fancy & dancing one`s
not one of them 140.00 c-cell one`s

still we can dream of this
mainly got for the pratice time @ tracks , you never use your best packs for pratice (i don`t) so that`s another 2-3 pks sitting there
peak one charge up week before your very rushed pratice time & all you have to worry about is your car working ( & one eye on batt ) just incase

My Harry had a NiCad go in on he`s charger

disclaimer
Racing is a Dnagerous sport ,do so at your own risk
Or wrap your self up in cotton wool & don`t bother
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Old 07-22-2006, 11:59 AM   #7
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Quote:
especially if your ESC doesn't have a configurable low voltage cutoff as if you run them below 3.0v per cell under load
Not per pack.....per cell!
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Old 07-22-2006, 12:27 PM   #8
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Mr Jolly, do you REALY think that charger manufacturers and LiPo cell suppliers will let you think you can get away with a 40 charger??? Also, two cells make up a LiPo pack, there is an option for 'matching' to.

The way I see it, if someone 'wants' to go LiPo racing in practice, that is at their own risk, if they lose control of their car, their BRCA insurance (not applicable to Mr Jolly) will be null and void, as you will be using equipment not recognised by the governing body.

There is also a mirriad of cheap cells and cells not capable of coping with the rigours of RC Cars, so then you would have to go down the route of homologating say, Team Orion/Peak cells and not others. If and when you allow LiPo, how do you ensure, as an RD, that a competitor that is using LiPo is running equipment that has the voltage regulation/cut-off for LiPo??

Also, has anyone actualy done a head to head with LiPo and NiMH, but the LiPo ballasted up to make the minimum weight?
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Old 07-22-2006, 12:49 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DA_cookie_monst
Mr Jolly, do you REALY think that charger manufacturers and LiPo cell suppliers will let you think you can get away with a 40 charger??? Also, two cells make up a LiPo pack, there is an option for 'matching' to.
The only person I know who's used LiPo packs (not the orion one but for micro cars) used a charger he got second hand for 25. Just like a 40 NiMH charger doesnt cause the cells to catch fire or explode, a 40 LiPo charger is unlikely to as well.

That's not to say I'm all in favour of Lipo batteries. I had my best micro NiMH cells short in the car a few weeks ago with no warning (pack had been fine for 6 months and most of that race...), and if I hadn't been near a fire exit and been able to shake them out of my car they could have exploded. They were way too damaged to risk resoldering, with acid coming out of a couple and having got hot enough to melt the cell heatshrink and solder joints between every single cell and battery bar! All cells currently used in rc are dangerous if used wrongly, so like with current cells - surely if they're treated well the risk is very low? I'm not suggesting there's no risk when using Lithium based cells, but maybe the concern about them is a bit over the top . Aren't LiPo cells used fine in rc helicopters, micro cars and mobile phones without a problem?
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Old 07-22-2006, 01:50 PM   #10
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This is a little off topic, but I have to ask... Do you people read what you've typed before you hit "submit"? I know I'm a pretty bad grammar/spelling nazi, but it gets to be quite annoying after a while with all of the elementary errors that are put on display for everyone to see.

Sorry, had to say something.

On topic... Every battery type in radio control is dangerous. One of the guys at our local track had a NiMH cell explode that sounded like a 12ga. shotgun blast. And it blew a hole in the wall right behind where he would have been sitting. The case of the cell was on the floor on the other side of the wall.

So to believe all of these scare tactics propogated by NiMH manufacturers and matchers is just ridiculous. Their products are just as dangerous as Li-Po and more dangerous than Li-Mn.

Once more of the matchers and manufacturers see that we've spoken with our pockets and the demand for Lithium cells has skyrocketed, then everyone will be praising how efficient and safe THEIR Li-Po packs are. So they can grab part of the market share.

Most of the hype is political and financial. Give it time and we car guys will be using Lithium based power almost exclusively like the fly boys do.

Until then, however, www.voodoocells.com Stick em' with voltage.

Just my .02

Tony
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Old 07-22-2006, 02:47 PM   #11
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I would be happy with seeing a 'real world' test of them, and a broad spectrum of what is out there. I have seen all the 'swap cells over but the cars weighs far less' tests, but just one where they ballast the car out and see how the cells respond etc...
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Old 07-22-2006, 04:12 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DA_cookie_monst
Mr Jolly, do you REALY think that charger manufacturers and LiPo cell suppliers will let you think you can get away with a 40 charger??? Also, two cells make up a LiPo pack, there is an option for 'matching' to.

The way I see it, if someone 'wants' to go LiPo racing in practice, that is at their own risk, if they lose control of their car, their BRCA insurance (not applicable to Mr Jolly) will be null and void, as you will be using equipment not recognised by the governing body.

There is also a mirriad of cheap cells and cells not capable of coping with the rigours of RC Cars, so then you would have to go down the route of homologating say, Team Orion/Peak cells and not others. If and when you allow LiPo, how do you ensure, as an RD, that a competitor that is using LiPo is running equipment that has the voltage regulation/cut-off for LiPo??

Also, has anyone actualy done a head to head with LiPo and NiMH, but the LiPo ballasted up to make the minimum weight?
back to back ;;yes me
all ballested up to make car 1512g (lot`s of lead too)
And since the airpplane guy`s & helicopter guy`s are NOT being stiched to buy the matched cells in Li-Po or fancy chargers
DA
you must trusting in company`s you know , not all of them want to rip you off , coz they know buyers will vote with there feet
i`m all for change ,weather it`s good or bad , But there are alot of guy`s that don`t like change from the old stuck in the rut way`s to `newer` way`s
weather it`s better or not (god know`s , But try to find out

there is actually 4 cells 2 series 2 parallel
why would you match them when they are so closely done now , unlike c-cells

BRCA could just pass the peak/orion one just for starters
Big powerfull power tools now have LI-po in ,when you are using hammer drill with 12" drill to go through concrete , that draws amps buy the bucket load & the worker makes them go flat then recharges

any way just talking not forcing
My Li-Po has done about 15-18 race`s so far & still charges up to just over 5000mah

Disclaimer
getting out of my depth now (bottling it ) so can`t post much more

BRCA ins re;use of Li-Po
aldershot get round it as do barham ,as do brooklands (in bike`s) hell they just had world champs there with BRCA backing
explain that one
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Old 07-22-2006, 04:22 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RcCzarOfOld
This is a little off topic, but I have to ask... Do you people read what you've typed before you hit "submit"? I know I'm a pretty bad grammar/spelling nazi, but it gets to be quite annoying after a while with all of the elementary errors that are put on display for everyone to see.

Sorry, had to say something.


Tony
coz we are English we speak da lingo & word it like nothing else
can i book a evening grama session please
forums are taken with a pinch of salt though;; yes /no ??

back to topic
what`s that !!! oh yeah Li-Po
top speed is not what it`s all about , it`s the punch is really good (but then the IB42`s are far better then the IB 36`s & that changed in about 2 month`s over xmas), also charge it up bung in car & just top up after every race that`s it
simple
oh i forget UK guy`s don`t want simple things j/k
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Old 07-22-2006, 04:22 PM   #14
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I guess thats my sceptical nature, re: matched cells. I just can't see ANY of the big battery firms sitting back and watching the small guy also take a large slice of the market. Maybe not in the next year, bet I would bet a penny that one company will find a way of matching them, then they will ALL follow suit.

What was the comparison, all ballasted up with half a ton of lead Colin>
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Old 07-22-2006, 04:25 PM   #15
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here`s a pic of my cyclone up to weight (bar 20g) still farting about with it
add 100g for shell
Attached Thumbnails
Drill test on Li-po-betty-001.jpg  
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