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Old 07-07-2006, 10:51 PM   #151
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It's definitely important that the technology mature, but that's what technology does when a company has incentive to continue developing it. As long as people are buying the motors and continuing to show interest, companies will be inclined to keep working at it. Hopefully this trend continues.

While the motors and ESC's may experience a few early problems, the technology is real, today, and it's hugely convenient to people willing to deal with a few isolated quirks. This is especially true at the club level where most racing occurs. And really, I'd be interested to hear from CS at Novak about complaints from consumers about brushless vs. brushed. The technology isn't exactly new, it's just new to this crowd, and they've undoubtedly had the benefit of learning from the pioneers before them in other fields. My washing machine has a brushless motor. :-)

But, I agree, the rules shouldn't be amended in haste as they've been in the past. There's no reason to repeat our mistakes, and hopefully the folks at ROAR understand that.

In the meantime, the grassroots movement is going to push the issue, now faster than ever with the release of this motor. Hopefully ROAR is watching this closely, because if you think it's an issue today, wait until early next year when everybody gets a 13.5T/GTB for Christmas. This isn't going away, and it isn't going to wait.
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Old 07-07-2006, 10:53 PM   #152
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Originally Posted by CarbonWorks
ROAR doesn't dictate what MOST club tracks allow or don't allow, the paying public does.
I totally agree with that and this is key to the development of out hobby. This has always been the case.

Sanctioning bodies take what is happening at the grass roots level and format/organize it into formal competition when there is enough interest to warrant it growing beyond the club/regional level.
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Old 07-07-2006, 10:56 PM   #153
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Quote:
Originally Posted by syndr0me
It's definitely important that the technology mature, but that's what technology does when a company has incentive to continue developing it. As long as people are buying the motors and continuing to show interest, companies will be inclined to keep working at it. Hopefully this trend continues.

While the motors and ESC's may experience a few early problems, the technology is real, today, and it's hugely convenient to people willing to with a few very minor quirks. Especially at the club level where most racing occurs. For me, quirks have been thermaling when I overgear. Woe is me. :-)

But, I agree, the rules shouldn't be amended in haste as they've been in the past. There's no reason to repeat our mistakes, and hopefully the folks at ROAR understand that.

In the meantime, the grassroots movement is going to push the issue, now faster than ever with the release of this motor. Hopefully ROAR is watching this closely, because if you think it's an issue today, wait until early next year when everybody gets a 13.5T/GTB for Christmas. This isn't going away, and it isn't going to wait.
Trust me ROAR is watching. There are a lot of good people at ROAR now that want to make thoughtful well planned decisions at the right time.
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Old 07-07-2006, 11:01 PM   #154
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Originally Posted by AdrianM
Trust me ROAR is watching. There are a lot of good people at ROAR now that want to make thoughtful well planned decisions at the right time.
I'm glad to hear that. It's comforting to know that the major governing body in this hobby pays attention to racer's needs, and the greater good of the hobby. No doubt, pressure from manufactures could potentially affect the decisions of a lesser organization.
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Old 07-07-2006, 11:34 PM   #155
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Originally Posted by syndr0me
I'm glad to hear that. It's comforting to know that the major governing body in this hobby pays attention to racer's needs, and the greater good of the hobby. No doubt, pressure from manufactures could potentially affect the decisions of a lesser organization.
The manufactureres want nothing but continued heath and growth of the hobby in an organized and controlled fashion. Thats good for business and good for racers/bashers. Its the vocal minority of yahoos (I bet you know a few...every track has at least one) that messes stuff up once in a while .
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Old 07-08-2006, 12:14 AM   #156
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The wave of the future is brushless. Like it or not, believe it or not. A day is coming that there will be no such thing as a brush. Almost zero maintenance and consistant performance is something that I would like to uphold. I am definatly going to be running brushless as soon as they are legal at my track.
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Old 07-08-2006, 12:18 AM   #157
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Looks like Novak's site now has news of the motor on their front page. It was oddly missing a few days ago.

Anybody know why Novak wouldn't put the newer "ribbed" can on the 13.5? All the new motors but this one are getting that can. I think I read it has more surface area and can better dissipate heat? At least it appears to have the new solder tabs.

I just wish they'd make them more pretty. No offense Novak, I love you guys, but the silver and dull purple looks kind of dated. The Reedy motors look slick though.
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Old 07-08-2006, 12:44 AM   #158
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ya, i guess making a new class wouldn't be too economical for clubs and racers, but its just so that brushless could get more exposure and hopefully better exposure. i wouldn't expect it to be a full blown class, but rather just a test class to show people where the 13.5 actually stands. heck, the 13.5t might not perform as well as some of those probuilt 27T motors, and what would the brushed people start thinking? probably that 13.5 really isn't such a threat to them and might start getting lax in their judgment about brushless motors. forcing brushless onto reluctant racers is definitely not the way to go, especially when theyre experienced racers.
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Old 07-08-2006, 01:11 AM   #159
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I know this is quite a longshot and is asking a lot from Novak, but what about having some sort of trade-in/replacement program for us 4300 owners (:raises hand: ) to "upgrade" to the new 13.5 motor, which is technically a "downgrade". I for one would be elated to see this support from Novak, seeing as this will appease those of us who may have felt left out being caught between 19T and stock classes and not having a true home.

This would help further advance Novak's position with this newly emerging product and would no doubt benefit us all. By allowing us brushless owners to easily integrate within the existing stock class (I know, I know, still speculation) I feel this would help increase turnout and allow those of us to be reminded of why we do what we do. The fun factor.

But who knows, I may just be some rambling unknown on a message board whose real intention is to get his grubby mitts on this new motor.
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Old 07-08-2006, 04:16 AM   #160
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Look ROAR knows what's going on. There is more to the story but I don't know all the facts. The major fact is Look at my signature at the bottom. Some of the ExComm( ROAR) knows what I've been doing for the last few months. It's been published in Rev-up for everyone to read(region 4). This has been my project this year to get this going here in florida.
I was wondering if any of you has ever gone to your LHS and listened to the new guys that buy r/c car or truck wants in the vechile right off the bat- "A fast Motor" not a slow motor.They can't handle what they have but they want to go faster, that's a fact. 99% of the r/c stuff sold never reaches the tracks.Out of the stuff that gets there the new guys still can't handle what they got.They have to learn first and nowadays people don't have the time to learn. They want it right now and it just does not happen that way.
These motors are here now- it's not going to go away. Stock motors are faster and will always get faster- that's competition.Look whats happend to your radios in the last few years- I don't hear anyone saying I sure like carrying a radio for each car/truck that I race at the track?Changing crystals-that's becoming a thing of the past. Now its themotor time - things are changing. Look at batteries in that last few years.
Look at the big change in the cars we drive- How many 1/10th pan cars do you see drive on the road course tracks today. Invented in 1985 died when TC was the newest thing on the block- The last big race with them was what 2001. Now they sit on the wall collecting dust.Tires- foam tires for 1/10th pan cars died (except for oval) and a new class of tires- rubber come out. Our hobby is changing and this is just one of the new changes we have to deal with.......
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Old 07-08-2006, 07:21 AM   #161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emjay
I know this is quite a longshot and is asking a lot from Novak, but what about having some sort of trade-in/replacement program for us 4300 owners (:raises hand: ) to "upgrade" to the new 13.5 motor, which is technically a "downgrade". I for one would be elated to see this support from Novak, seeing as this will appease those of us who may have felt left out being caught between 19T and stock classes and not having a true home.

This would help further advance Novak's position with this newly emerging product and would no doubt benefit us all. By allowing us brushless owners to easily integrate within the existing stock class (I know, I know, still speculation) I feel this would help increase turnout and allow those of us to be reminded of why we do what we do. The fun factor.

But who knows, I may just be some rambling unknown on a message board whose real intention is to get his grubby mitts on this new motor.
If companies let you trade you stuff when it got outdated, they wouldn't make any money. The whole point of new products is that you will buy it. Sorry, but I don't think they will be having a trade-in option.
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Old 07-08-2006, 10:48 AM   #162
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I'd be willing to pay Novak double to have one today, and to thank them for releasing this motor and taking a step in the right direction.

A good club racing class could be: stock or 13.5motor, 4200SHV or LiPo in any combination. That should get everybody pretty close, and give them all the options in the world for what they want to run.
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Old 07-08-2006, 03:37 PM   #163
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XrayFK
If companies let you trade you stuff when it got outdated, they wouldn't make any money. The whole point of new products is that you will buy it. Sorry, but I don't think they will be having a trade-in option.
I completely understand your point from a business standpoint. However, from a customer service standpoint, when Novak initially released the 4300 motor they were claiming it's performance to be similar to that of stock. Now if you look on their site, they claim the 4300 to perform like a 19T now that this 13.5 motor is to be the stock BL headliner. It's not quite misadvertising but rather a minor bit of misrepresentation.
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Old 07-08-2006, 04:00 PM   #164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emjay
I completely understand your point from a business standpoint. However, from a customer service standpoint, when Novak initially released the 4300 motor they were claiming it's performance to be similar to that of stock. Now if you look on their site, they claim the 4300 to perform like a 19T now that this 13.5 motor is to be the stock BL headliner. It's not quite misadvertising but rather a minor bit of misrepresentation.
They really did think the 4300 would be like a stock motor. They were just wrong. There was no intentional misrepresentation.
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Old 07-08-2006, 04:16 PM   #165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianM
They really did think the 4300 would be like a stock motor. They were just wrong. There was no intentional misrepresentation.
They "think" 5800 would be like a 10T mod..... not even close
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