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Old 06-14-2006, 10:12 PM   #181
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Jeremy
I belive so many people are leaving this hobby because of stupid full factory Stock racers. Stock racing is supposed to be for up and coming new racers, but now there are these teams that pay for there factory stock drivers travel so that they can go out and beat up and coming racers that have to pay for all of there equipment. You know who those teams are, and i belive its complete B.S.
ok,the reason for factory drivers in stock is simple...people buy what cars are winning..therefore it is in the manufactures best interest to put there best foot foward...and let their drivers run stock...it's not that companies want to beat down on the little guy...it's just buisiness just my 2 cents
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Old 06-14-2006, 11:04 PM   #182
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"stock" stopped meaning "beginners class" probably sometime around the late 80's or so, back when Losi was producing the Revolution motor. Want some slack nowadays go enter the mod class at your local club race-- the stock/expert stock class is ultra competitive no matter where you look, and has a big turnout..... unlike mod (at least where I race).
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Old 06-14-2006, 11:17 PM   #183
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i think anyone who has won any sanctioned level stock race should move the f#$k on....
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Old 06-15-2006, 02:19 AM   #184
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Originally Posted by hobbipro
Bottom line, MONEY! I've been into R/C myself for almost 20yrs. Cars for me have always been a small part. I find myself getting back into planes (electric ones now) and heli's due to fun per dollar formula. (F+$= enjoyment), sure, with planes/heli's as with all hobbies the radio gear and stuff isnt cheep at first but after those inital items you can use the same engines, radios, and stuff for many years. Not so with R/C cars. Every other year is a new "HOT" car that costs an arm and leg, batteries that keep getting more Mah, just to name a few. Its not that you have to buy new stuff, but to keep up at the track you almost "must" have to buy the new stuff when it becomes available just to be competitive.
I really dont see this as an "spec" class or any other part of racing itself. These days its all about the $$$. If you dont believe me, just take a hard look at all the compaines making RTR stuff. You can get a pretty nice RTR for under $350, while most of us buy $400+ cars without body, tires, electrics.
I agree, I am myself in 1/8 scale hydroplanes. It is 2006
now and I am still running my hydroplane which was build in 1999! The difference is that the rc car industry improves the current car and the commercial market is bigger. We build our boats and airplanes mostly ourselves from drawings but people NEVER have build their cars theirselves because we use other materials for cars which use expensive equipment to mold, cut, form and machine rc car parts. To reduce the costs of development the manufacturer needs to sell a lot of car and parts to earn the investment back. Also the rc car world is bigger than any other part in rc world. We have races like the worlds were we see the latest parts/cars and to stay ahead of the rest we we buy the latest parts or newest cars every time! Now if you read back in this post you have read that I am still running my 1999 Miss Budweiser hydroplane. Why? Simpel: There is no such development like in cars and our boats must be identical to its larger brother even it is a boat from the past. I run myself a Yokomo SD LCG. Yokomo teammembers are currently driving the BD car. Why I am not driving it? First I don't like beltdriven cars, secondly I drive for the funfactor on my club NOT for performances for a company. Third: I am the owner of my own wallet. Fourth: IT IS NOT THE CAR THAT WINS, IT IS THE DRIVER BEHIND THE WHEEL!!
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Old 06-15-2006, 05:57 AM   #185
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I have to disagree on the point someone made earlier that RTR is a bad thing.

Me and my boys got hooked on RC cars and racing because of a RTR AE T3. My kid saved up for 7 months to buy it, then as we broke parts bashing it on the street and in alleys we were at the hobbyshop every few days. The hobbyshop had flyers for racetracks in the area. A guy at the counter put one of the flers in our bag and my kid's eyes bugged out once he read it. when we were back home..... We took our first trip to the track and my kid was hooked. We raced that T3 a few times a month, each time adding parts that the other guys in the pits told us to get to keep up, and now here we are with the three of us, me, an 8 year old and a 14 year old owning about 17 vehicles, racing nitro and electric, off road and on road.

Now we aren't the best racers, but the 14 year old has become pretty good. So good that on some club race nights he makes somewhere between 2nd and 8th in the Mains, and me and the little guy battle it out.

Here's what hooked us:

Hobbyshops advertising racing, and the shops having knowledgeable friendly employees.

Once at the track, other racers, and track owners and employees reaching out to be friendly, giving lots of advice and guiding us to be better racers, and making their tracks fun places to spend time.

The internet. Meaning forums and websites with tons of information that helps in finding parts and techniques, and forums like this place that create a community about RC and RC racing.

We've been in the hobby and racing now for over 4 years.

If I had to say what the most important factor, from above, was in keeping us in this hobby I'd have to say all the guys in the pits who were always helpful, friendly, and welcoming while we are at the track.
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Old 06-15-2006, 09:58 AM   #186
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Check this out....retail mall racing:

http://tinyurl.com/ox4cp
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Old 06-15-2006, 04:01 PM   #187
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I'm going to go to that place when it opens and use my mad r/c skills to trounce some 5 year olds.

Thats not a bad idea. I'm sure the cars will be a little on the basic side, but you gotta start somewhere.

If a local hobby store was smart, they would go to that place and try to do some cross promotional stuff. So when Timmy is ready to step up to real r/c action, he can buy a T2 - Helios - Orion powered land missle and his parents can drive him out to the middle of no where to race it against some factory pros for zero rewards. R/C COMMIN AT YA!
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Old 06-15-2006, 04:28 PM   #188
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Quote:
Where we are seeing an odd pattern emerging is the age of the drivers, either everybody's turning grey a bit younger these days or the average age is increasing quite quick

We are finding that getting youngsters into the sport is harder and harder to achieve, and not because of cost either, mainly due to an attitude where competetion is seen as being a bit old fashioned? Certainly it seems to be a case of either:-
I'm not going to do that because i'll have to compete against other people..
Or
If I'm going to do that I'll have to win or not do it..

So we're seeing an increase in young backyard drivers, a reduction in young racers, and an increase in the 'Must Win' attitude, just wondering if you're seeing the same thing or is this just a odd trait we have over here.
This is a brilliant observation and I believe spot on. The spirit of racing has changed in the youth. Must be the grey hairs keeping it alive.

1/12th scale is an amazing way to race and have fun. But I'm afraid if the surface wasn't perfect or the course easy enough racers wouldn't come. Here in Utah they like the tracks very easy. It's all about go fast. A philosophy that requires chasing battery, tire, and motor.

I have to disagree with buying the latest chassis. The right tire can offset any chassis choice. I have too many examples to cite here but I've seen this happen too many times to think otherwise.

But how can you really know the potential of the chassis when all you do is wrench all night and then race for 15 minutes once or twice a week? F1 testing drivers put in 70 km in one day. That would be 7km for us at 10th scale or 4.35 miles on your chassis. It takes us 45 minutes to run 10 miles on a circuit with at least 14 turns measuring 400' or more. So 30 minutes of testing per trip to the track? I've met too many who treasure their shelf princess to put it on the track for anything less than perfect conditions. Where did this train of thought come from? Buy a chassis, build and repair it with the greatest of care and detail, buy the best parts, and then only run the minimum? It's insanity. When was the last time you ran through a set of tires in one night? Probably not since the S3 days.

Sprint racing is lame and dying. The torch can't be passed fast enough. We have several in our club that once they raced 45 minutes they didn't go back to sprint racing. Do I feel sorry for the local track owner? No. They leave it up to the drivers to have fun and I don't blame them. Racers in general suck when it comes to helping a track survive. Sure there are the few who get it and aren't in it for themselves. So why depend on a track to have fun? I see online a group of "drifters" than run in their garage. They have videos on google video. They've added lights, fog, music, all the atmosphere... They go all out and they look like they are having a blast. I've never driven a drift car but they make it look like a blast. Now that's a club.

One more thing... Spashett and Johnson both drove a Trinity revolver forever... well past the evolution of newer parts, front suspension geometry, and newer kits ...with the unruly front end and won who knows how many races. I'll bet that if you pick any one of those drivers... and let's add Masami to the mix... give them the oldest chassis you can find, unmatched stick packs, and a crappy motor and they'll find a way to beat you and me.

This is a great thread.
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Old 06-15-2006, 04:41 PM   #189
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slcf1
...

But how can you really know the potential of the chassis when all you do is wrench all night and then race for 15 minutes once or twice a week? F1 testing drivers put in 70 km in one day. That would be 7km for us at 10th scale or 4.35 miles on your chassis. It takes us 45 minutes to run 10 miles on a circuit with at least 14 turns measuring 400' or more. So 30 minutes of testing per trip to the track? I've met too many who treasure their shelf princess to put it on the track for anything less than perfect conditions. Where did this train of thought come from? Buy a chassis, build and repair it with the greatest of care and detail, buy the best parts, and then only run the minimum? It's insanity. When was the last time you ran through a set of tires in one night? Probably not since the S3 days.

Sprint racing is lame and dying. The torch can't be passed fast enough. We have several in our club that once they raced 45 minutes they didn't go back to sprint racing. Do I feel sorry for the local track owner? No.

...
I've been monitoring this thread since it got started and I thought I'd chime in with my opinions here...

First off, I've been in this hobby for 14 years, 13 of them racing various classes, mostly 1/10 electric with a little 1/10 gas here and there. I'm usually one of the faster guys at the track, but never the fastest.

There is no number large enough to show how much I agree with slcf1's thoughts. HOW INSANE IS IT THAT WE SPEND THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS AND HOURS AND HOURS PER WEEK WRENCHING ON THESE CARS, GET UP AT 7 AM TO START RACING A NOON OR LATER, DRIVE HOURS AND HOURS TO GET TO THE TRACK, SPEND 8+ HOURS AT THE TRACK, TO SPEND A MERE 15-25 MINUTES ON THE TRACK? And why... because that's the way it has always been done? Ugh. This is the one of the reasons why I'm seriously considering selling out and quiting.

Sprint racing is WAY to intense for most people. Make absolutely no mistakes for 5 minutes while trying to control something that costs several hundred dollars and is going 200+ scale mph? That for me, is how I'd define stress. I don't want my hobby to be stressful. I want it to de-stress me. Most of the really fast guys at my track are so dedicated, so intense and so intent on winning, that I'm afraid to get to close to them on the track for fear that I might make a mistake, crash into them, then have them yell at me or even worse, get into a phyical altercation over the incident. I see people yelling at one another each and every week at my local races over something that happened on the track. Again, this is not helping me enjoy this hobby, so why bother?

The sad thing is I don't think the hobby in general will ever change to longer races as slcf1 describes. Most of the racing crowd will just keep on doing things the way they have always been done. It makes me sad that I don't live in Salt Lake City.

Last edited by cartmen34; 06-15-2006 at 04:59 PM.
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Old 06-15-2006, 05:31 PM   #190
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Heres a simple break down.
Cars that cost lots of money to run.
electric touring, 1/8th scale, truggy, 4wd mod.
Cars that provide instant results because no throtle control is required.
electric touring, 1/8th scale, truggy, 4wd mod., limited mt.
Cars that are top tier competitive for under $600.
2wd stock/mod truck and buggy, 1/12th scale, 1/10th nitro.
Cars that are a challenge to drive and require practice and time to get results
2wd stock/mod truck and buggy, 1/12th scale, 1/10th nitro.

People with money don't have the time so they invest their money. I'm sorry, but the hobby likes it when people will spend $ for results and thats how it is right now. In the end the best drivers are always going to be the ones running 2wd, however in the more expensive classes a big wallet can close a gap that is created by track time which other obligations stop. 2 years from now when lipo/brushless is fool proof and bullet proof and these newcomers learn to drive I'm sure you will see a flood of lipo/brushlesh 2wd apearing all over.
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Old 06-15-2006, 05:42 PM   #191
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Its usually quite simple, when the economy goes south
the first thing to go is toys.

When I race typically

Gas to and from race 50.00
race fee 15.00
food and drink 10.00
fuel 1 gallon (2weeks racing) 27.00

almost 100 dollars a week how many people can afford that much in disposble income? Its hard enough for me and I have a decent job.
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Old 06-15-2006, 07:23 PM   #192
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Quote:
Originally Posted by syndr0me
Sectors of this hobby are supported by people who are nostalgic for their childhood racing, and dumping piles of cash into it now since they can afford the nice things. Those people won't be around forever.

The kind of person it takes to afford and stay interested in R/C long enough to be competitive isn't the kind of person you generally find in R/C. :-(

This one is still here, b/c that's me....check out the photos from 1983!
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Old 06-15-2006, 09:03 PM   #193
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J.Filipow
This one is still here, b/c that's me....check out the photos from 1983!
J - Dude, nice shorts... Are those things Team Losi issued?
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Old 06-15-2006, 09:12 PM   #194
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J.Filipow
This one is still here, b/c that's me....check out the photos from 1983!
WOW is all I can say......
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Old 06-15-2006, 09:19 PM   #195
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DUDE! IF i showed up to the track and saw those shorts today i would pack up and leavE! LOL Just jokes!

Maybe i could post some of my Mullet shots with massive glasses! LOL oh boy the 80s
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