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Old 03-18-2006, 11:36 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by Sean T Guy
And as for a comment about motor manufacteurs making motors that self destruct after only a couple of runs , well , now I do believe I have heard it all LMFAO X 2. Are you really believing that a motor manufacteur would be that stupid to kill its own sales with a motor that did that , LMFAO again...
Dude as you WELL know, at top level people will do anything if they think it would give them an edge.... guess you forgot about the 36' motors that were legal, and I think some even done 40', they also removed so much of the stack, leaving basicaly enough at the top and bottom and a little in the middle to wrap the wire around..... then to save weight, they were drilling the shit out of the armatures to.... then the commes got skimmed low to get a motor that was hot to trot, and I mean HOT, but they were good for a meeting and most if you were lucky. Oh, and this was when stock motors ran sealed enbells, so people invested in special lathes to skim through the endbell.

This started all around the late 80's and early to mid 90's when they still ran stock in buggies at RRCi events, fortunately that has gone now, the era of silly stocks. Only thing I would want to see now is ballraces allowed in the motor, otherwise happy with the regs.

Do many of the tuners opt to wind their own arms these days, or are they buying pre-wired arms from the source?
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Old 03-18-2006, 11:40 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by jakeburns
Importers should not be direct to public sellers, they are cutting out the model shops who keep this sport running. The importer who sells to the public is taking a cut of the profit twice, and they are not even lowering their prices because of it.

Importers should import, and sell to shops, shops should sell to public.
I think the big importers don't have a license to sell to the public anyway. Its only the smaller ones that do.
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Old 03-18-2006, 11:53 AM   #63
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Originally Posted by i.a.s
they asked what motor i was looking for and they would try and help still waiting though guess they cant find a shop that could sell one over the counter
Well, they have offered, so did you tell them what motor your were looking for?

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Originally Posted by Sean T Guy
Does anybody remember the quads when they were legal , then they werent , then they were. BRCA are a joke IMO.
Yes, I do. It was the Demon version - a whole bunch of the arms were found to be short on the stack. They were pulled off the list until the problem was sorted and then they were put back on the list. Don't see how the BRCA are a joke, if anyone is it would be the manufacturer who can't get one simple measurement right
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Old 03-18-2006, 12:05 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by MR JOLLY
that woud be a suprise if one of them came on here & stuck he`s neck out & took all this flack
with merciless in this mood he be murdered
You know me Colin i'm a nice bloke, I wouldn't kill anyone that didn't DESERVE it
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Old 03-18-2006, 12:43 PM   #65
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Merciless..........Rod.......Nice bloke........Never heard all them words in the same sentence before
All top drivers will do all sorts to win races , no matter what cost , Nothing new there then!
30---40 motors well if thats what floats their boat , let them use them. They can only use 1 at a time. If they cut comms to a minimum , hey thats fine as long as I aint paying they can smoke them all they like. I cant see why this upsets anyone , they play and they pay.
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Old 03-18-2006, 02:22 PM   #66
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Oh come on this is rediculous, this is about the 4th thread in recent time that has turned into a TS slagging, haven't you lot got anything better to do. I wish you would get your facts straight before you go sticking things on forums. I am quite willing to take pm's off anyone wishing answers on things and will answer genuinely and openly.

TS has an online shop and also sell through ebay at the min as circumstances with some shops changed and it is a good outlet for the product. The price difference is made up in postage if you add it together it comes to the same as retail. I know the figures these motors are imported for and is it fair for a shop to want to make 60-70% of the net profit of one of the motors imported into the UK while the importer only get the remaining 30%.

Can't you just stop the bitterness and the slating for god sake its ruining our sport and making the hobby for beginers look like a bunch of bickering old women.

Its gone to far now.

Some of you seem to think you know the facts about everything, just think about what you post and whether you can back them up with the names of people who supplied you the 'facts'

GET A MIRROR AND AV A WORD WITH YOURSELVES
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Old 03-18-2006, 02:59 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by sam_smith
Some of you seem to think you know the facts about everything, just think about what you post and whether you can back them up with the names of people who supplied you the 'facts'
Then what are the facts, please enlighten us???? By the way, i haven't been aiming anything directly at anyone, nor has most of the people on this thread, it has been mostly general...

Quote:
Originally Posted by sam_smith
The price difference is made up in postage if you add it together it comes to the same as retail. I know the figures these motors are imported for and is it fair for a shop to want to make 60-70% of the net profit of one of the motors imported into the UK while the importer only get the remaining 30%.
Please give figures, as i see it, the importer imports for his price, usually sells to the shops at trade, they then sell to the public be it via mail order or in the shop. So there are 3 prices, the price to the importer, the price to the shop and the price to the punter. If the importer sells direct to punter selling at the price the shop would charge then they are cutting out the middle price and making all the profit?

Crude example, motor sold to importer for 10, sold on to shop at 12, shop sells at 14. Importer makes 2, shop makes 2. Cut the shop out importer buys for 10 and sells for 14, importer makes 4, and shops die cause they have nothing to sell. Punter have nowhere near them to buy stuff, and regions die???
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Old 03-18-2006, 03:40 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by DA_cookie_monst
Dude as you WELL know, at top level people will do anything if they think it would give them an edge.... guess you forgot about the 36' motors that were legal, and I think some even done 40', they also removed so much of the stack, leaving basicaly enough at the top and bottom and a little in the middle to wrap the wire around..... then to save weight, they were drilling the shit out of the armatures to.... then the commes got skimmed low to get a motor that was hot to trot, and I mean HOT, but they were good for a meeting and most if you were lucky. Oh, and this was when stock motors ran sealed enbells, so people invested in special lathes to skim through the endbell.

This started all around the late 80's and early to mid 90's when they still ran stock in buggies at RRCi events, fortunately that has gone now, the era of silly stocks. Only thing I would want to see now is ballraces allowed in the motor, otherwise happy with the regs.

Do many of the tuners opt to wind their own arms these days, or are they buying pre-wired arms from the source?

How about the 45 deg 27T we used in the mid 90s ?
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Old 03-18-2006, 03:45 PM   #69
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We should just go 23t like the Japs and be done with they produce some excellnt drivers
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Old 03-18-2006, 04:17 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jakeburns
Crude example, motor sold to importer for 10, sold on to shop at 12, shop sells at 14. Importer makes 2, shop makes 2. Cut the shop out importer buys for 10 and sells for 14, importer makes 4, and shops die cause they have nothing to sell. Punter have nowhere near them to buy stuff, and regions die???
I agree....if that is how it is but its more like the importer pays 10 (for example as this way off) retail price is as you have said 14 but a shop only expects to pay 11 so they can make 3 therefore squeezing the importers for everything they can, now I know this is business but is that fair?

I meant my post to stop this so PM if you want to contiue the convo as this isn't the place to do it.

Anyways back to the proper thread........It is a shame that if this co27 is going to be legal by ROAR standards then we dont get the choice to run this new technologyy under BRCA rules but as we always get from the people off raceshat 'if you want to change it go to the AGM' - What about we get a big group to agree a new rule, propose it and then vote it in ourselves as the AGM doesnt have enough go to it to over rule a majority of about 25-30?
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Old 03-18-2006, 04:34 PM   #71
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Sounds like democracy working there Sam, it don't take much, just getting off your collective butts and being pro-active.
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Old 03-18-2006, 04:40 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DA_cookie_monst
Sounds like democracy working there Sam, it don't take much, just getting off your collective butts and being pro-active.
Just wondering but do you have "I LOVE THE BRCA" tattooed on your forehead ??
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Old 03-18-2006, 04:49 PM   #73
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Sam : reason why the importer takes les sprofit is they work on higher flow of stuff. Because the shops sell a lot less than the importers they need to have a higher profit per item otherwise they'd die.

I think it's ok for small distributors to sell direct because you have to start somewhere; but they have to make a point into getting their stuff through shops and develop that branch to a point where they can stop selling direct. However the retail price should at the least be the same both ways o make it fair for the shops.

Also, if small/new distributors want to develop their acticity and get their stuff through the shops their stuff has to be BRCA legal otherwise BRCA would simply kill their business hence why there are brands that are not really available in any model shop that are legal.

just my 0.02

PS : is it me or this thread is slipping out of its initial subject, aka CO27 not being legal ?
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Old 03-18-2006, 04:51 PM   #74
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Originally Posted by Sam_Smith
I agree....if that is how it is but its more like the importer pays 10 (for example as this way off) retail price is as you have said 14 but a shop only expects to pay 11 so they can make 3 therefore squeezing the importers for everything they can, now I know this is business but is that fair?

I meant my post to stop this so PM if you want to contiue the convo as this isn't the place to do it.

Anyways back to the proper thread........It is a shame that if this co27 is going to be legal by ROAR standards then we dont get the choice to run this new technologyy under BRCA rules but as we always get from the people off raceshat 'if you want to change it go to the AGM' - What about we get a big group to agree a new rule, propose it and then vote it in ourselves as the AGM doesnt have enough go to it to over rule a majority of about 25-30?
How about instead of having an AGM at a stupid date at a stupid place we have an AGM for each class at the end of the last round, where a majority of the racers who are actually racing that class will be present
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Old 03-18-2006, 04:53 PM   #75
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Wanker

No, but they serve a purpose, I don't have the time to sort out the problems inlaid in the BRCA, so I accept the system as it is and how you change it, I am however actively involved in the Weksh Region in off-road where I to and a few others got fed up of how things were, but instead of moaning, we are moving things slowly into the 21st century.

In the end, you can't moan so loudly about a rule (homologation in your case) and then shrug your shoulders about doing something about it, even if you propsed a rule change, it got seconded and then rejected, that at least would earn you the right to complain, but until then, and I know it sounds like Racechat, we are all members, you don't have to join, but when you do, you accept the rules as is. and that includes the procedure for changing them.

It may surprise you, but I think in the way that the BRCA treat the Touring Car community is pretty poor to be honest, only ever interested in a National scene and not to do with the regional level. But then, that is something we are changing in the WRCA.
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