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Old 12-11-2002, 12:14 AM   #1
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Default Future Car

Well after all the nagging and soaring.
Here's the conclution
It seems like the belt driven car are gonna be HISTORY.
Everybody is migrating to a shaft driven car.
Here looK

Hpi prototype Is a SHAFT
LOSI Prototype is a SHAFT

I guess all other manufacture will Switch to shaft car in the future.
And BTW Brushless system is out now
the power of brushless will tear the belt alot... and you dont want to spend alot on belt rebuilding rite ?

So i guess for a beter future and stay up to date get a Shaft Car

GET TC3!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
IS fast !
Powerfull !!!!!!!!
btw Shaft system works great on Cornering Speed.

So i guess i'll be selling all my belt car from now before is too late
but i felt that Belt Car is suitable for Nitro Not Electric.
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Old 12-11-2002, 12:42 AM   #2
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hm...

i wonder why some of the best and top drivers out there (i.e.: surikarn with Tamiya TRF414MII, Brian Kinwald with Losi XXX-S, and etc. etc.) all use belt driven cars? I dont think shaft and belt really outweigh each other.

Also, brushless would tear the belts? i think a regular 6 or 7 turn mod motor is just as powerful or more powerful than a brushless motor. but that doens't tear belts? where are u getting this from.

anyway, peaches.
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Old 12-11-2002, 02:16 AM   #3
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Default Re: Future Car

Quote:
Originally posted by kilokhan
And BTW Brushless system is out now
the power of brushless will tear the belt alot... and you dont want to spend alot on belt rebuilding rite ?
If one system was significantly better, all cars would have used that system for a very, very long time. Period.

All those manufacturers marketing department need something new, to get us buying more cars. It's still just a car with a motor, four wheels and a suspension. Nothing more.

Some facts about belts and shafts:

A belt can last on a Harley.

Racing motor cycles uses a chain, instead of a shaft.

A shaft drive, are more efficient at lower speeds. Belts are more efficient at higher speeds.
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Last edited by Cole Trickle; 12-11-2002 at 02:22 AM.
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Old 12-11-2002, 04:01 AM   #4
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BTW: NO SHAFT CAR CARRIES THE CORNERSPEED OF A BELT CAR PERIOD!

Belt cars are also easier to drive because they don't have that snap acceleration tthat makes people believe belt cars are faster.
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Old 12-11-2002, 06:09 AM   #5
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Default Re: Future Car

Quote:
Originally posted by kilokhan
Well after all the nagging and soaring.
Here's the conclution
It seems like the belt driven car are gonna be HISTORY.
Everybody is migrating to a shaft driven car.
Here looK
and after these manufacturers finish making their money on shaft cars they will tell you that belts are better.......it's a very good marketing ploy..... its very amusing......
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Old 12-11-2002, 06:09 AM   #6
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I think they are all taking a leaf out of TC3's winning book though... the TC3 has won races at different level and different sort of track for the past several years around the world, anywhere there is a TC3 at the front like it or not.... and it is a 4 year old design!!!! any fancy updates in that time??? an extra hole in the sus arms!

Yes I believe belts has it merits being easier to drive and when it does spool up it is quite effiient, but you canot say it has less drag-period. The only problem with shaft drive I think is balance so it wont lose its efficiency to vibration at high speeds. I have seen a friend of mine spin his TC3 drive train without wheels and it kept going for nearly 20 seconds...

BTW Harley use belts cos it is quiter, cleaner and smoother and that is good for a cruiser (and slow) bikes like a Harley (if they could they'd probably fit a CVT tranny into it in future ) .... but because the belts stretch and need more protection from the enviroment then chains are used on fast bikes.... and why was shaft not popular in bikes... becuase the "snap" makes the bike difficult to drive - in the wet..... but thats with 2 wheels!... and they need less punch....!

If you really want to draw an analogy with race cars to race cars then there are no race cars, be it F1 or Touring or DTM or Rallye uses belts... why? power and reliability and practicality.....
As for brushless.... I think that is the way things will go.... less maintenance and costs cheaper in the long run and hence more fun.... can't wait.

BTW Yokomo's next offering could be shaft drive too!!!
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Old 12-11-2002, 06:12 AM   #7
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Default Re: Future Car

Quote:
Originally posted by kilokhan
........And BTW Brushless system is out now
the power of brushless will tear the belt alot... and you dont want to spend alot on belt rebuilding rite ?
And BTW.....My brushless system has been parked in the cupboard for over a year.......BL is OLD news!!!!!
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Old 12-11-2002, 07:06 AM   #8
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Hi, I dun drive that many RC cars to comment on different drivetrains but heres what I know abt bikes and why the fast one (eg MotoGP, SBK etc) don't use shaft ( as used but most BMW bikes)
The reason is this, torque reaction on a shaft driven bike will cause the bike to flop over when the trottle is twisted : P
Thats the last thing you want to have when the bike is leaned over and you are gassing it up after the apex with the bike still leaned over : P
Hahahah if anything on this earth needed more snap off the line, I think superbikes like the R1 or Ducatti 999 are definately not high on the list : P
Cheers

Quote:
Originally posted by sonneteer
I think they are all taking a leaf out of TC3's winning book though... the TC3 has won races at different level and different sort of track for the past several years around the world, anywhere there is a TC3 at the front like it or not.... and it is a 4 year old design!!!! any fancy updates in that time??? an extra hole in the sus arms!

Yes I believe belts has it merits being easier to drive and when it does spool up it is quite effiient, but you canot say it has less drag-period. The only problem with shaft drive I think is balance so it wont lose its efficiency to vibration at high speeds. I have seen a friend of mine spin his TC3 drive train without wheels and it kept going for nearly 20 seconds...

BTW Harley use belts cos it is quiter, cleaner and smoother and that is good for a cruiser (and slow) bikes like a Harley (if they could they'd probably fit a CVT tranny into it in future ) .... but because the belts stretch and need more protection from the enviroment then chains are used on fast bikes.... and why was shaft not popular in bikes... becuase the "snap" makes the bike difficult to drive - in the wet..... but thats with 2 wheels!... and they need less punch....!

If you really want to draw an analogy with race cars to race cars then there are no race cars, be it F1 or Touring or DTM or Rallye uses belts... why? power and reliability and practicality.....
As for brushless.... I think that is the way things will go.... less maintenance and costs cheaper in the long run and hence more fun.... can't wait.

BTW Yokomo's next offering could be shaft drive too!!!
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Old 12-11-2002, 07:30 AM   #9
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Spot on.... they are dangerous in the dry too!!!!
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Old 12-11-2002, 08:14 AM   #10
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Quote:
LOSI Prototype is a SHAFT
Where did you see that at? The only car thats doing good with a shaft drive is the TC3.

All of the other top cars are belt, and they don't have a problem keeping up with the TC3. I do agree there are benifits to each design.

-XRay: Belt
-414MII: Belt
-XXX-S: Belt
-Corally: Belt


Quote:
but i felt that Belt Car is suitable for Nitro Not Electric.
They work the same in nitro as they do in electric. For parking lot nitro racing, I would have to say shaft is the way to go. Less chance of getting pebbles and such on them. Also, fuel getting on the belts can attract dirt and dust causing problems. If you look at all the big 1/8th scale on-road cars like the Serpents, they all run belts, and I can tell you right now that the motors they run in those put out more power then a brushless system, and they hold up fine.

Quote:
I have seen a friend of mine spin his TC3 drive train without wheels and it kept going for nearly 20 seconds...
There's a guy at our track with a XRay that spins longer then any other car there, or that I have seen anywhere. Its all in how you take care of your stuff, and set up the bearings. Most people think you can just race them out of the box at the highest level. Ask any pro how much work they put into th driveline of their cars, and they will probably tell you more time then any other part of the car.

Last edited by Action-RC.com; 12-11-2002 at 08:23 AM.
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Old 12-11-2002, 08:22 AM   #11
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Yes top cars... and there are a lot of them... I was counting wins and championships over the years.... yes there are cars wining this and that but I believe consistency is with the TC3... my only gripe is it seems fragile when compared with my RCLab...
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Old 12-11-2002, 08:39 AM   #12
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Losi has another prototype?...
i thought they are not done with the xxxs GP yet...

the latest shaft car at this moment should b the tamiya evo3...
shaft car also might have the problem of torque steer...
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Old 12-11-2002, 08:40 AM   #13
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YEAH, and HPI certainly sets the trends in RC, that is why after they release their shaft car everyone will be scrambling to build a saft car that twists in half when you punch the throttle!!!LOL

Soneteer- I have yet to see a slow Harley, they use belts for 4 main reasons, easy of maintenance, it fits the powerband of the evolution engine better for street use, have you ever had a chain on a BMX snap and whale away on your calve (trust me I wouldn't want it to happen on a bmx let alone a Harley) and they listen to what their customers want!

Also TC3s win on so many levels and so freiquently because there are soo many very good drivers using them. If %50 of teh racing crowd where driving 414's don't you think it would have won the worlds championship....OHH wait a minute it did because the TC3 BROKE...LOL!!!!! But seriously then the 414 would be winning alot more on more levels.....
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Old 12-11-2002, 08:49 AM   #14
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Harley are the Rolls Royce of bikes I can agree, they use belt drive because of their smoothness and they are quiet, and they require less maintanence for their use I agree, it dont flick bike chain grease everywhere I agree.. and I love them for that (and I want one), but please don't tell me they are fast cos they aren't Its a super cruiser!

About TC3, yes they are fragile but if the car is crap then there wouldnt be so many ppl running them! If the 414m is cheaper then I agree more ppl will be running them. I run RClab (belt of course) and mine is a quick one but hell do i put serious maintenance to keep everything free and smooth...
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Old 12-11-2002, 08:57 AM   #15
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Well, I think I'll chime in on the side who said that the companies will make whatever catches our attention. They already know that simply making a car thats pretty much like what they have had for the last few years, isn't enough to get great sales. And that goes for every company.

I also agree that if either type had a significant advantage, all the companies would have switched a long time ago. I have tried both types of drive and don't see that big a difference (once the belts are broken in, that is)

Heres one thing to consider, all the fastest guys around here ran shaft for a season or two once the TC3 came out. THen they all switched to the Losi once it came out......And their still the fastest guys! They haven't gotten any faster or slower by running belt cars, they're just driving a different car at the same speed. So as far as I can tell, it really doesn't matter.

Odds are, whatever a company was using the last few seasons, they will switch to something different with their newest car. Thats the best way to draw attention to your TC these days.
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Last edited by Darkseid; 12-11-2002 at 08:59 AM.
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