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A decent cheap shaft drive car touring car. Where did they all go?

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A decent cheap shaft drive car touring car. Where did they all go?

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Old 07-25-2019, 07:17 AM
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Could be a simple as the brands saw the sales numbers. I wasn’t around when the shift from shaft to belt took over. But a brand could easily see what was selling. The shaft, tub design was left for the RTR world. Awesomatix did build and amazing looking car, it’s still on my want list. But they soon switched to belt as well.
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Old 07-25-2019, 07:29 AM
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Shaft drive has better acceleration? That.. is interesting to me. Now that I sit down and think about it, it seems sane... You're also looking at fractionally less frictional losses. Belt whipping and the extra drive interface have some meaning too.

Hmm.....
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Old 07-25-2019, 07:39 AM
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You lose a minimum of 1% pr gear pair. So belts is no worse than gears for transfer.. and you do not get the torque from the spinning shaft.
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Old 07-25-2019, 08:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Nerobro View Post
Shaft drive has better acceleration? That.. is interesting to me. Now that I sit down and think about it, it seems sane... You're also looking at fractionally less frictional losses. Belt whipping and the extra drive interface have some meaning too.

Hmm.....
Torque steer was what I have always heard why everyone moved to belt driven. Shaft worked on lower powered motors, VTA was once run by mostly TC4 from what understand. It’s was more noticeable with lower turn motors. And since changing motor to move up in class was once a thing. That was before I crossed into racing side.
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Old 07-25-2019, 09:04 AM
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Originally Posted by MatsNorway View Post
You lose a minimum of 1% pr gear pair. So belts is no worse than gears for transfer.. and you do not get the torque from the spinning shaft.
well, belts have one more interface than gears do. "each interface" has that hit. Belts have two pulleys for each end. Each belt to pulley interface has the torque hit. While a shaft only has the spur, and bevels. The belt has The spur, and four pulleys. Even single belt setups have the tension wheel that will add belt bending friction.

Originally Posted by Billy Kelly View Post
Torque steer was what I have always heard why everyone moved to belt driven.
I'm so accustomed to low rpm and low power cars, I never considered that.
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Old 07-25-2019, 09:09 AM
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I think it also has to do with what was trending or winning at the time that these manufacturers released their updated models - at least on the racing side. I have a sneaking suspicion that if it starts winning, we may see a bunch of cars updated with mid-motor mounts and even sized belts... Despite the fact that Iím pretty sure that design was used about 10 years ago?

On the casual side of the market, it may just come down to cost. I would imagine that a decent shaft design with mating gears would have to cost more to produce than a pair of belts and a few pulleys? Especially if they factor existing belt sizes into the design.
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Old 07-25-2019, 11:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Nerobro View Post
If it is, why are the cheapest cars shafties? TT01, TT02, Kyosho, Vattera, Traxxas, LC Racing... I can't accept that answer.
And aren't these ones between 100 and 200 $?
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Old 07-25-2019, 11:54 AM
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They are! But the TT01, TT02, are all fixed links. Traxxas is the same, and I believe kyosho and vattera are un-adjustable as well.

That... isn't what i'm looking for. If you're going racing, you should have a few shock tower positions, some ability to change camber, and toe, and reasonable ranges of gear ratios.
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Old 07-25-2019, 12:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Nerobro View Post
They are! But the TT01, TT02, are all fixed links. Traxxas is the same, and I believe kyosho and vattera are un-adjustable as well.
That... isn't what i'm looking for. If you're going racing, you should have a few shock tower positions, some ability to change camber, and toe, and reasonable ranges of gear ratios.

TT02 Type S kit is what you are looking for my guy. $120 with 416 style suspension and can be done up more when you are ready.
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Old 07-25-2019, 12:17 PM
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The most important reason, why shafties are not as popular as belties, is, that these chassis are more heavy. If you compare for example TRF419XR and TB Evo 7 (both box stock) 100-150g weight difference make a huge difference from the point of view of competition.

It is therefore in the nature of the matter that belt cars are more competitive than shaft cars, even though they would be more efficient.

And winner cars are buyer's cars...that's it.
I love shafties, because they are more sophisticated - technical wise.
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Old 07-25-2019, 12:26 PM
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That chassis is such a kludge. :-/ you need spacers and special blocks to get the pins on the chassis, and you can't adjust sweep, pro or anti-dive. It also doesn't come with a sealed diff, or a spool. WTCC reports that while tamiya makes a sealed diff for the platform, it's pretty trashy. I also find the diffs kinda delicate. I've ripped out the pinions on my TT02b at least four times.

It is "an" answer though.

Originally Posted by Tom1977 View Post
The most important reason, why shafties are not as popular as belties, is, that these chassis are more heavy. If you compare for example TRF419XR and TB Evo 7 (both box stock) 100-150g weight difference make a huge difference from the point of view of competition.

It is therefore in the nature of the matter that belt cars are more competitive than shaft cars, even though they would be more efficient.
I feel like the weight is addressable. Overall weight at least. I'm not sure about CG.. And with the smaller physical space of moving bits.. perhaps a better, lighter, chassis could fit around that.

... but maybe not. pinions see a lot of force. that means the gearboxes need to be strong. While belt cars only see "pull"
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Old 07-25-2019, 12:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Nerobro View Post
That chassis is such a kludge. :-/ you need spacers and special blocks to get the pins on the chassis, and you can't adjust sweep, pro or anti-dive. It also doesn't come with a sealed diff, or a spool. WTCC reports that while tamiya makes a sealed diff for the platform, it's pretty trashy. I also find the diffs kinda delicate. I've ripped out the pinions on my TT02b at least four times.

It is "an" answer though.


I feel like the weight is addressable. Overall weight at least. I'm not sure about CG.. And with the smaller physical space of moving bits.. perhaps a better, lighter, chassis could fit around that.

... but maybe not. pinions see a lot of force. that means the gearboxes need to be strong. While belt cars only see "pull"
So it sounds like if said racer doesn't want any shaft cars listed then drop the $$$ and get a A700 and get everything desired.. There is only so many options lol....

Some folks love the TB Evo 6 / TB05 platform with the help of a Exotek conversion kit as well. None of them will be cheap cheap in the long run.
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Old 07-25-2019, 01:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Nerobro View Post
They are! But the TT01, TT02, are all fixed links. Traxxas is the same, and I believe kyosho and vattera are un-adjustable as well.

That... isn't what i'm looking for. If you're going racing, you should have a few shock tower positions, some ability to change camber, and toe, and reasonable ranges of gear ratios.
You can buy adjustable links if so desired. But Iíve never considered them needed of the Traxxas, Vaterra or Apex. Honestly think once in the 20 racedays I did, think I made one adjustment to one of my Touring cars.
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Old 07-25-2019, 01:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Billy Kelly View Post

You can buy adjustable links if so desired. But Iíve never considered them needed of the Traxxas, Vaterra or Apex. Honestly think once in the 20 racedays I did, think I made one adjustment to one of my Touring cars.
You can. But that misses the point. when you start accessorizing the crap out of a kit, you quickly blitz your way up into xray and awesomatix territory. And some things you just can't retrofit in.
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Old 07-25-2019, 01:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Nerobro View Post
You can. But that misses the point. when you start accessorizing the crap out of a kit, you quickly blitz your way up into xray and awesomatix territory. And some things you just can't retrofit in.
Not necessarily. Thereís a difference between whatís needed and wanted. Some just want shiny bit when a plastic part would work just fine.
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