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Old 08-08-2019, 02:45 PM
  #286  
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Originally Posted by wtcc View Post
I know for you guys it must look as if I am sitting endless weeks in front of my computer drawing the car, but I assure you that is not the case. I am glad if I have two hours of creative time per week.
No need to explain yourself, a modern life is a busy one. I'm just glad for whatever you share of your creative process.

Let me share a personal thing I know we all have in common; it is a lack of spare time. Between everything I have to achieve as a husband and father, I might get a spare fifteen minutes a day to move my projects to the goals I have set.

You do you, take your time and enjoy your process.

Now back to work!
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Old 08-08-2019, 03:27 PM
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glad I could help even if it was only tangential. I have a better understanding of the motion now so a few of my questions were cleared up. my previous post was long to provide some basic background to some concepts that any further attempts for me to clarify could further confuse but I’ll try.

Begin re-explanation
a damper is a spring that only applies a force when there is velocity. the amount of force created is directly related to the area of the piston or flap, orifice (leaks), viscosity. Set leakage and viscosity equal and whatever value you choose because they are irrelevant to the concept Im talking about. with a rotary damper the area of the flap is the same clockwise as it is counter clockwise. thus the “velocity spring” or force that is applied is the same in both directions. lets call it 1lb of damper in both directions because both sides of the flap (area) is the same. so whether it has 1 large vane or 4 smaller vanes the summed area equals 1 pound or kg of force in either direction.

in a piston damper the area is different on the blind side versus the rod side. the rod subtracts from the area of the piston on one side and it does not on the other side. second concept-the force applied to the rod in compression and rebound creates an exact displacement. 1lb of compression force creates 6mm of travel. 1.1 lb of force in rebound creates 6mm of return travel. or 1 lb of return force creates 5.5mm of rebound travel. this inequality does not happen with a flap or rotary because the flap has equal area on both sides. a piston does not unless its a double rod. i touched on the same concept from 2 or 3 directions but its just 1 concept. your heave damper will travel a different distance for the same force in both directions. by the same logic the damping force will be different in both directions.
End re-explanation

WTCC you have a very nice flap design that if adapted to the revised heave system will create equal damping force in both directions.

as a side note a single flap will need the same area as a 4 flap rotary with the same leakage and flow. But you have lengthened the flap which will increase the torque through leverage. The other thing I was curious about... did you look at the area you needed at that new length? The advantage of the pure rotary is the surface area of 4 flaps shorter in length creating a smaller circle....Im guessing because im too lazy to run the math on the increased length that is required on a single flap minus the increase leverage you have from moving some force farther away creating more torque.

Last edited by Bry195; 08-08-2019 at 06:31 PM.
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Old 08-11-2019, 11:55 AM
  #288  
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It is not just the torque, that will be interesting to see how it will make the car behave, but also the higher speed, because my flap will have a higher angle change than that of the Awesomatix in comparison. From my side it is all just fun and a big experiment. I am no engineer, I am not calculating with viscosity and flap length. I just try to make sure I have no collisions and it will move mechanically

I found time in the night to solve my heave damper problems. The front suspension has hardly any space left to fill with more components. With some skill and luck I could implement two more arms for the heave damper kinematic and drew a new damper end to have no heave damper effect if the suspension is unloaded or under load on one side only.







The damper end now is more complicated than I want it to be with one joint on the arm and another ball bearing assembly on a rail. Any ideas to reduce the complexity here are very welcome. I for myself couldn't come up with anything better

Other than that, I think I completed the car as I had imagined it on a functional view. Again I will let the arrangement sink in some more days...
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Old 08-11-2019, 07:36 PM
  #289  
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Id hire you. You are doing this because you want to. In my book that is the best kind of Engineer.

im a little lost in the perspective you use but can you get to the preload adjustment on the leaf spring?
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Old 08-12-2019, 06:21 AM
  #290  
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Default the spirit of our hobby!

Kevin, I readt the whole post and I think you're doing an awesome job.
Of course you have skills and time to do it, but anyway your passion is impressive.
Today, most of rc people prefer to spend a lot of money to buy the last kit, the last motor, the last esc, etc... "Buy", not build.
They are missing the point of rc car. Even if you are not an engineer (I suppose you are, btw :-D) you can build, test, "arrange", modify and play with parts in order to create YOUR rc car.
Look at the main events pics gallery: everything has same equipement, same layout, same option parts, same wiring scheme. No one "dares" anymore.
It's not a matter of money. Certain "crazy" projects are more expensive that a new fresh Yokomo or Xray kit, but that isn't the point.
I think you repesent the spirit of our hobby. Congrats!

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Old 08-12-2019, 08:27 AM
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@jakelamotta: Thank you for all the kind words! CAD and 3D print give new possibilities for "normal" R/C car hobbyists. I also wish the car sector would have more builders like we see with the plane guys.

@Bry195: Here you go -->

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Old 08-12-2019, 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted by wtcc View Post
@jakelamotta: Thank you for all the kind words! CAD and 3D print give new possibilities for "normal" R/C car hobbyists. I also wish the car sector would have more builders like we see with the plane guys.

@Bry195: Here you go -->
With all of the focus on spring progression maybe an adjustable cam shaped preload. Its hard to see but it looks like a screw in the vertical position could be blocked by the heave system. An adjustable cam with a horizontal screw might allow you to get to the adjuster from inside of the chassis.

I think they call it an eccentric hub. But use a progressive radius like an egg or a cycloid curve.
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Old 09-21-2019, 07:51 AM
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I just want to give a short update of the project: Nothing new did happen

I had to deal with a lot of work related stuff. The little free time in between was used to let some steam of on track. With a friend I made trackdays at Bilsterberg and the Nürburgring Nordschleife. My little "fridge" got some updates and now is much faster in corners
Here some non-RC-related pictures of my little racer:








Right now, I also have my characteristic R/C-mood low. It is not easy I guess the enthusiasm for R/C will return for the indoor season...
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Old 10-17-2019, 03:07 PM
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Hope your downtime is recharging your batteries
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Old 10-17-2019, 03:21 PM
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Lol, Dan. Im sure Kevin has something up his sleeve.

I just trying to get parts together, lol.

Slow and steady
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Old 11-08-2019, 12:35 PM
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My brain evaluates random problems all day long and this is one that bubbled up with a potential solution. But it may have more things to think about, its too early to tell.

if you could turn the front wheels in the opposite direction of the rear you can control ride height and weight distribution. Reality is that they wont turn in the opposite direction but offsetting the rpms between the front and rear a little should do the same thing. If the awesomatix front wheel drive system would bolt on to the rear wheel drive I would attempt to create a master slave curve to experiment with controlling weight. So thats 2 motors what about 4?
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Old 11-23-2019, 09:29 AM
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Time to continue

Today I prepared the files for the 3D-print. It took several hours to arrange and connect all parts to get a good print and save a little money. Now that this is done Shapeways can do its work The downside on this v3 version are the increased costs. The 3D-printed-parts alone are around 25% more expensive compared to v2...




The next step will be the preparation of the cfk parts for the mill.
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Old 11-23-2019, 09:37 AM
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Originally Posted by wtcc View Post
I just want to give a short update of the project: Nothing new did happen

I had to deal with a lot of work related stuff. The little free time in between was used to let some steam of on track. With a friend I made trackdays at Bilsterberg and the Nürburgring Nordschleife. My little "fridge" got some updates and now is much faster in corners
Here some non-RC-related pictures of my little racer:
Right now, I also have my characteristic R/C-mood low. It is not easy I guess the enthusiasm for R/C will return for the indoor season...


You and I have similar taste. Just mine has 2-less doors



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Old 11-23-2019, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by JoeyE View Post
You and I have similar taste. Just mine has 2-less doors
Nice! Some infos of the specs and track experience please
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Old 11-24-2019, 04:06 AM
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Well, well... my motivation seems to recover.

I prepared the data for the carbon parts. The v3 is definetly the most complex geometry I created in my R/C "career".
A lot more carbon parts are needed and the droop plates get pits to incorporate the roll damper housings.


Part arrangement:








Curves for the dxf/dwg export:

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