15Likessoft or stiff setting in low traction track
03-29-2018, 04:02 PM
#16
If it's a clean low grip surface not crazy hot, going stiffer is the way to go. Generate more mechanical grip with higher roll centers, stiffer springs, softer oil more rear toe, more camber gain etc just to name a few. Once you are on a high grip surface with an average temp like mentioned you want the car to let the suspension do a lot of the work. Lower roll centers and less camber gain, less rear toe, even throw some front arm sweep, thicker shock oil, softer springs, less camber gain etc. This applies to a spec tire as well, these are the differences that can separate 3,4-6 tenths from the top to the bottom in a spec class.
Not to mention Droop having a major roll on both ends as well. How you want the car to weight transfer on or off power where you need it and know when to make the changes you desire to get the car planted.
my spare .02
At the end of the day you have to be able to drive your car bang on.. but test the methods many long time racers use and the Rc force will show you the way
Not to mention Droop having a major roll on both ends as well. How you want the car to weight transfer on or off power where you need it and know when to make the changes you desire to get the car planted.
my spare .02
At the end of the day you have to be able to drive your car bang on.. but test the methods many long time racers use and the Rc force will show you the way
03-30-2018, 02:29 AM
#17
If it's a clean low grip surface not crazy hot, going stiffer is the way to go. Generate more mechanical grip with higher roll centers, stiffer springs, softer oil more rear toe, more camber gain etc just to name a few. Once you are on a high grip surface with an average temp like mentioned you want the car to let the suspension do a lot of the work. Lower roll centers and less camber gain, less rear toe, even throw some front arm sweep, thicker shock oil, softer springs, less camber gain etc. This applies to a spec tire as well, these are the differences that can separate 3,4-6 tenths from the top to the bottom in a spec class.
Not to mention Droop having a major roll on both ends as well. How you want the car to weight transfer on or off power where you need it and know when to make the changes you desire to get the car planted.
my spare .02
At the end of the day you have to be able to drive your car bang on.. but test the methods many long time racers use and the Rc force will show you the way
Not to mention Droop having a major roll on both ends as well. How you want the car to weight transfer on or off power where you need it and know when to make the changes you desire to get the car planted.
my spare .02
At the end of the day you have to be able to drive your car bang on.. but test the methods many long time racers use and the Rc force will show you the way
1. "If it's a clean low grip surface not crazy hot, going stiffer is the way to go." Why?
2. "Generate more mechanical grip with higher roll centers, stiffer springs," Isn't it less grip by using higher RC and stiffer springs?
3. "Once you are on a high grip surface with an average temp like mentioned you want the car to let the suspension do a lot of the work." Why?
4. Isn't it should always use thin oil with soft spring and thick oil with stiffer spring?
03-30-2018, 07:38 AM
#18
Thanks for your reply. Try to understand your theory:
1. "If it's a clean low grip surface not crazy hot, going stiffer is the way to go." Why?
2. "Generate more mechanical grip with higher roll centers, stiffer springs," Isn't it less grip by using higher RC and stiffer springs?
3. "Once you are on a high grip surface with an average temp like mentioned you want the car to let the suspension do a lot of the work." Why?
4. Isn't it should always use thin oil with soft spring and thick oil with stiffer spring?
1. "If it's a clean low grip surface not crazy hot, going stiffer is the way to go." Why?
2. "Generate more mechanical grip with higher roll centers, stiffer springs," Isn't it less grip by using higher RC and stiffer springs?
3. "Once you are on a high grip surface with an average temp like mentioned you want the car to let the suspension do a lot of the work." Why?
4. Isn't it should always use thin oil with soft spring and thick oil with stiffer spring?
2 / 3 The higher roll center will help generate grip as the car isn't rolling so much and actually make the car more aggressive on a low bite surface (More initial traction entering the corner to point). With the springs same thing if you have a soft spring on low bite it will not generate the traction like a harder spring would to the tire. Once high bite comes around harder springs are to edgy and can cause the car to traction roll putting to much heat or action into the tire. Low roll center on a low grip surface may help in the middle to exit of the corner for some but usually going higher roll center will have a better effect and really help make the car come alive and not just cruise around the track.
4. Low bite for shock oil would be thinner as preferred to get the car to react but with stiffer spring to generate the traction. High bite you want to slow the movement down with a thicker fluid but a softer spring to accommodate
Again just my .02
03-30-2018, 10:53 AM
#19
Tech Adept
1. Generate heat into the tires
2 / 3 The higher roll center will help generate grip as the car isn't rolling so much and actually make the car more aggressive on a low bite surface (More initial traction entering the corner to point). With the springs same thing if you have a soft spring on low bite it will not generate the traction like a harder spring would to the tire. Once high bite comes around harder springs are to edgy and can cause the car to traction roll putting to much heat or action into the tire. Low roll center on a low grip surface may help in the middle to exit of the corner for some but usually going higher roll center will have a better effect and really help make the car come alive and not just cruise around the track.
4. Low bite for shock oil would be thinner as preferred to get the car to react but with stiffer spring to generate the traction. High bite you want to slow the movement down with a thicker fluid but a softer spring to accommodate
Again just my .02
2 / 3 The higher roll center will help generate grip as the car isn't rolling so much and actually make the car more aggressive on a low bite surface (More initial traction entering the corner to point). With the springs same thing if you have a soft spring on low bite it will not generate the traction like a harder spring would to the tire. Once high bite comes around harder springs are to edgy and can cause the car to traction roll putting to much heat or action into the tire. Low roll center on a low grip surface may help in the middle to exit of the corner for some but usually going higher roll center will have a better effect and really help make the car come alive and not just cruise around the track.
4. Low bite for shock oil would be thinner as preferred to get the car to react but with stiffer spring to generate the traction. High bite you want to slow the movement down with a thicker fluid but a softer spring to accommodate
Again just my .02
Interesting discussion.
03-30-2018, 11:58 AM
#20
It's sounding better in my head then how I am describing certain things, but maybe someone else will chime in to the path I am mentioning 
03-30-2018, 12:13 PM
#21
Suspended
1. Generate heat into the tires
2 / 3 The higher roll center will help generate grip as the car isn't rolling so much and actually make the car more aggressive on a low bite surface (More initial traction entering the corner to point). With the springs same thing if you have a soft spring on low bite it will not generate the traction like a harder spring would to the tire. Once high bite comes around harder springs are to edgy and can cause the car to traction roll putting to much heat or action into the tire. Low roll center on a low grip surface may help in the middle to exit of the corner for some but usually going higher roll center will have a better effect and really help make the car come alive and not just cruise around the track.
4. Low bite for shock oil would be thinner as preferred to get the car to react but with stiffer spring to generate the traction. High bite you want to slow the movement down with a thicker fluid but a softer spring to accommodate
Again just my .02
2 / 3 The higher roll center will help generate grip as the car isn't rolling so much and actually make the car more aggressive on a low bite surface (More initial traction entering the corner to point). With the springs same thing if you have a soft spring on low bite it will not generate the traction like a harder spring would to the tire. Once high bite comes around harder springs are to edgy and can cause the car to traction roll putting to much heat or action into the tire. Low roll center on a low grip surface may help in the middle to exit of the corner for some but usually going higher roll center will have a better effect and really help make the car come alive and not just cruise around the track.
4. Low bite for shock oil would be thinner as preferred to get the car to react but with stiffer spring to generate the traction. High bite you want to slow the movement down with a thicker fluid but a softer spring to accommodate
Again just my .02
Usually I stay out of setup threads because everyone has different experiences but this guy hit it on the head and I am not sure people will take him seriously. Everything he said in this post is what I found to be true while getting ready for asphalt nats last year in which I tq'd two rounds of Modified qualifying.
03-31-2018, 12:55 AM
#23
For me, theoretically soft = less pressure on tire, but for a longer period of time. Hard = more pressure on tire, but for shorter period of time. Hard might work on low grip because of more pressure on tire to generate more grip.
03-31-2018, 12:37 PM
#24
For proportional spring and roll bar rates, which means the front to rear stiffness is the same even if the rates are softer or stiffer, peak pressure on the tires will always be the same. You got that reaction time right, where a stiffer sprung car will get to that peak sooner than a softer sprung one.
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
