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Understanding F1 Tuning: Letís break it down

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Understanding F1 Tuning: Letís break it down

Old 03-19-2018, 12:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Tim Neja View Post
Okay -- okay-- you CAN teach an old dog new tricks!! I LEARNED today that drag brake is my friend in F1!! You can't get these pigs to turn like a 1/12 scale car!!! So drag brake at least on asphalt is a necessary evil!! With help from Rocket Rob-- I took 1/2 second off my lap times by dialing in my Tekin Pro ESC with DRAG BRAKE!! WHODA THUNK!!?? FN Cuda and others are RIGHT!! Drag brake works for F1 and my WGTR car!!
The key is to just get it to the point where the rear starts to break loose. This takes some testing and does vary depending on grip levels. I have used it since 1992 in all forms of rc I have been involved in.
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Old 03-19-2018, 05:31 AM
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Her is another step than can be taken on slippery tracks. If your radio has it you can use the ABS function for the push brake. Figure that out and you can get down into tight corners from high speed straights right on your line without wagging the tail.
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Old 03-19-2018, 07:00 AM
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Originally Posted by old_dude View Post
Her is another step than can be taken on slippery tracks. If your radio has it you can use the ABS function for the push brake. Figure that out and you can get down into tight corners from high speed straights right on your line without wagging the tail.
Yes, but it WILL increase the braking distance required. I.e. you'll have to brake sooner.

There is no free lunch.

Mark C
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Old 03-19-2018, 07:19 AM
  #154  
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Jus making sure I'm understanding you guys correctly.
Your settings the MAX brake on the esc to 100% and setting the drag brake on the transmitter? Now, what if the esc also has a drag brake setting. Do you set that to 0% so it doesn't enterfere with the transmitter????
Originally Posted by ixlr8nz View Post
The key is to just get it to the point where the rear starts to break loose. This takes some testing and does vary depending on grip levels. I have used it since 1992 in all forms of rc I have been involved in.
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Old 03-19-2018, 08:30 AM
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Originally Posted by XrayAllDay1 View Post
Jus making sure I'm understanding you guys correctly.
Your settings the MAX brake on the esc to 100% and setting the drag brake on the transmitter? Now, what if the esc also has a drag brake setting. Do you set that to 0% so it doesn't enterfere with the transmitter????
NO!! I have a Tekin Pro OLD Esc and it has a drag break setting in it!! I"m setting the drag brake there--then with my trim--I can dial in as much or as little push brake as I want also. So for now, I've set my drag brake in the ESC to where it turns in really well--but my push brake will give me even more braking--and I set that so it gets max braking without getting the rear tires loose. Simple eh??
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Old 03-19-2018, 10:31 AM
  #156  
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Originally Posted by Tim Neja View Post
NO!! I have a Tekin Pro OLD Esc and it has a drag break setting in it!! I"m setting the drag brake there--then with my trim--I can dial in as much or as little push brake as I want also. So for now, I've set my drag brake in the ESC to where it turns in really well--but my push brake will give me even more braking--and I set that so it gets max braking without getting the rear tires loose. Simple eh??
Max brake just enough to not lose it if pushed full, I'm at about 60% or so.
Then again, after setting the esc with just enough drag brake to turn in just past the fastest corner I adjust the trim between throttle and brake, middle being neutral, toward brake to dial in the last few inches of turn in according to conditions for each particular heat and almost never have to think about using push brake except for emergency/panic situations
You know, old dogs, reaction times and just plain laziness.
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Old 03-19-2018, 10:38 AM
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Originally Posted by XrayAllDay1 View Post
Jus making sure I'm understanding you guys correctly.
Your settings the MAX brake on the esc to 100% and setting the drag brake on the transmitter? Now, what if the esc also has a drag brake setting. Do you set that to 0% so it doesn't enterfere with the transmitter????
No, use the Drag brake function on the ESC. But on older or not so good esc's, you can use the radio throttle trim to add/reduce drag brake even during the race with the actual brake set high. Normally though the actual brake, I don't use much unless I am going to have a crash. This is usually set pretty high however.
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Old 03-19-2018, 11:23 PM
  #158  
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Dang I'm a crackhead!!! Thanks everyone.
Originally Posted by Tim Neja View Post
NO!! I have a Tekin Pro OLD Esc and it has a drag break setting in it!! I"m setting the drag brake there--then with my trim--I can dial in as much or as little push brake as I want also. So for now, I've set my drag brake in the ESC to where it turns in really well--but my push brake will give me even more braking--and I set that so it gets max braking without getting the rear tires loose. Simple eh??
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Old 03-20-2018, 04:56 AM
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Originally Posted by scirocco14 View Post
Yes, but it WILL increase the braking distance required. I.e. you'll have to brake sooner.

There is no free lunch.

Mark C
Actually I tune it to provide more maximum brake but by pulsing the brakes at a tuned rate and amount you reduce the distance to stop in a straight and controlled line. If you have your push brake perfect and you apply it perfectly you could stop faster. Just like a drag brake setting it improves your consistency on certain layouts. I only use this setting in extreme cases. 99% of the time it is turned off but on certain layouts and surfaces it will help.
If you do an in depth read on ABS systems in full size cars you will find that a pro can stop a car faster without ABS about 50% of the time. No pro can stop a Tesla faster than anyone else. But those are feedback systems. Our only feed back is to observe, tune and try again. When it is right it is tough to beat but again only when the conditions dictate it.
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Old 03-20-2018, 06:56 AM
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Originally Posted by old_dude View Post
Actually I tune it to provide more maximum brake but by pulsing the brakes at a tuned rate and amount you reduce the distance to stop in a straight and controlled line. If you have your push brake perfect and you apply it perfectly you could stop faster. Just like a drag brake setting it improves your consistency on certain layouts. I only use this setting in extreme cases. 99% of the time it is turned off but on certain layouts and surfaces it will help.
If you do an in depth read on ABS systems in full size cars you will find that a pro can stop a car faster without ABS about 50% of the time. No pro can stop a Tesla faster than anyone else. But those are feedback systems. Our only feed back is to observe, tune and try again. When it is right it is tough to beat but again only when the conditions dictate it.
I agree with you, but it takes a lot of time and effort to tune the ABS to get it to work that well on the ESC. Most of the guys I meet at the track don't even know or understand what the various settings on the radio can do for them. Most of them don't use 10% of the what the radio can do.
EPA, Expo, Dual Rate, ABS, ATL... it goes on and on.

But if it helps, go for it. I'm a manual braking kind of guy.

Mark C
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Old 03-20-2018, 09:10 AM
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Originally Posted by scirocco14 View Post
I agree with you, but it takes a lot of time and effort to tune the ABS to get it to work that well on the ESC. Most of the guys I meet at the track don't even know or understand what the various settings on the radio can do for them. Most of them don't use 10% of the what the radio can do.
EPA, Expo, Dual Rate, ABS, ATL... it goes on and on.

But if it helps, go for it. I'm a manual braking kind of guy.

Mark C
I am pretty tech savvy but it took a call to my radio manufacturer to get the low down on the settings. The manual was not helpful at all. It does take time to tune but once done all it takes is a little more fine tuning when I activate it.
You are correct, most people overbuy their radio equipment with features that they will never use. They also jump at the latest and greatest again with things they will never use. I see it all the time and I work with anyone that needs it and is willing to accept the help.
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Old 03-20-2018, 05:47 PM
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What chassis is better shepherd Velox f1 or vbc Racing lightning fx
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Old 03-20-2018, 06:04 PM
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Well since I've built the VBC recently and have been driving it I'm partial to it. Easy to build, and I like the simple design. The car seems to handle very well, I"m still getting up to speed with it on asphalt--getting more steering dialed in and getting it to rotate through the corners well. But it's a solid platform with some nice things--like the rear motor pod links mount to the upper battery brace so the car chassis is narrower and doesn't drag the edges. I moved the rear body mounts off of the front link--and remove the battery hold down widgets and the body mounts go there. Then it's easy to use an O ring to hold the battery in.
The front end is robust--I"ve managed to smack a few things over the past three weeks with the car and the ONLY think I've broken is a Serpent front wing!! Once I loctited all the bolts -- nothing has vibrated loose since. Very good car--very reasonably priced!! I use and recommend!!
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Old 03-25-2018, 10:46 AM
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An update on the VBC car. Yesterday at Cal Raceway I was able to get the car handling REALLY well! I've gone to the brass front bulkhead which put a lot more weight up front. I also went to the lightest front springs I could find and a stiffer shock spring. The car handling is much better with the new weight distribution. Then, after finally getting the car handling I changed the gearing to pick up the speed and mid-range and the car came alive!! It's really easy to drive, but now rotates into and through the corner much better. It looked like and felt very easy to drive and lap times were among the fastest of all the cars. Very consistent and smooth---qualified within 4 seconds of TQ!
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Old 03-25-2018, 02:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Ethan13x View Post
What chassis is better shepherd Velox f1 or vbc Racing lightning fx
Shepherd is much cleaner design.
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