Go Back  R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric Off-Road
When will mid motors replace rears on all tracks >

When will mid motors replace rears on all tracks

When will mid motors replace rears on all tracks

Reply

Old 04-05-2016, 10:48 PM
  #1  
Tech Elite
Thread Starter
iTrader: (40)
 
the big rc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: portland
Posts: 2,158
Trader Rating: 40 (100%+)
Default When will mid motors replace rears on all tracks

We have an outdoor loamy track in my area, and for the past several years some of us have tried to make mid motors work. Most give up and go to rear because its just easier.

I keep thinking that there is no reason that a mid shouldn't work just as well as a rear in these conditions. Is it because we have 20 years experience in rear motor and it feels more comfortable.

Most large racing cars, mid motor works way better.

I'm curious as to what everyone thinks.
the big rc is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2016, 10:57 PM
  #2  
Tech Regular
iTrader: (23)
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 400
Trader Rating: 23 (100%+)
Default

Hopefully never!

I think as long as those loamy point and shoot dirt tracks are out there rear motor buggies will have a market.

Now how long those loamy tracks are around is another story! People seem to love the idea of racing with more traction. Expensive clay with misting systems, carpet, sauce, etc. seems like people will gravitate to the tracks with more traction then find reason to switch over to mid.

Only real loamy dirt tracks I am aware of in California are private club tracks. Even got a outdoor carpet track now!
sacmiata is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2016, 11:01 PM
  #3  
Tech Fanatic
iTrader: (11)
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Olathe, KS
Posts: 934
Trader Rating: 11 (100%+)
Default

Where I race, we have an indoor track for winter and a large, 8th scale track for outdoor. Last year pretty much everyone ran their mid motor cars outdoors. I didn't like my B5M outdoors, my RC10 Worlds Car drove better! For this year, I built a B5 to race. I imagine I'll be the only one running a rear motor car, but I don't really care. It's all about what works for you.
CTRJ is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 06:06 AM
  #4  
Tech Lord
iTrader: (77)
 
Davidka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 10,233
Trader Rating: 77 (100%+)
Default

I find it interesting that "loam" is associated with low traction. Every loamy track I've ever run on had great traction, which is why it was kept that way.

Google 1991 IFMAR Worlds to see what I consider loam conditions to be.
Davidka is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 06:47 AM
  #5  
LT
Tech Adept
iTrader: (8)
 
LT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: SAN ANTONIO
Posts: 134
Trader Rating: 8 (100%+)
Default

Personally I believe you will not be able to buy a mid motor kit a year from now. Manufacturers seem to have really figured mm out and with the current trend in tracks with super high traction there really isn't a need for rm anymore. My local track has been almost exclusively rm in the past but since the 22 3.0 hit the dirt there is only one guy left running rm.
LT is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 06:58 AM
  #6  
Suspended
iTrader: (61)
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,124
Trader Rating: 61 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by LT View Post
Personally I believe you will not be able to buy a mid motor kit a year from now.
MM is taking over.

You can make a mm car work on outdoor, it just needs the right setup, and it's a little more sensitive for tire selection.
Socket is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 07:35 AM
  #7  
Tech Fanatic
iTrader: (11)
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Olathe, KS
Posts: 934
Trader Rating: 11 (100%+)
Default

I think he meant RM. Anyway, I agree. I think the B5 is the last rear motor car we will see produced from one of the big manufacturers. I think once Associated sells out of them they will discontinue it and that will be it.
CTRJ is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 07:42 AM
  #8  
Suspended
iTrader: (61)
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,124
Trader Rating: 61 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by CTRJ View Post
I think he meant RM. Anyway, I agree. I think the B5 is the last rear motor car we will see produced from one of the big manufacturers. I think once Associated sells out of them they will discontinue it and that will be it.
I highly doubt it. They need to make a certain amount of money off of the molds, so there's not much of a future in discontinuing it, much more likely they roll it into a RTR line.

Look at the B4...released in 2003...and they STILL make it! STILL! Of course, now as a RTR car. Those molds have been cranking out parts for 13 years at a profit. This is why when people keep saying they'll roll out a new car; that's NEVER been their business model since the B4 dropped. They'll just continue to refine the current platform without pouring big money in it.
Socket is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 08:04 AM
  #9  
Tech Elite
Thread Starter
iTrader: (40)
 
the big rc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: portland
Posts: 2,158
Trader Rating: 40 (100%+)
Default

This is interesting, i never considered that no one will make a rear motor, but xray just came out with one. Hmmmm
the big rc is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 08:12 AM
  #10  
Tech Lord
iTrader: (77)
 
Davidka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 10,233
Trader Rating: 77 (100%+)
Default

I race at a typical hardpack indoor track where slicks often work. Once in a while one of the better racers breaks out his RM car and runs exactly the same times as he did with the mm car.

If the B5 RM's sales have dropped off, they'll discontinue. While they want to recoup mold costs, there's also carrying costs associated with simply warehousing and maintaining them. Eventually a smart business cuts & runs.
Davidka is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 08:13 AM
  #11  
Suspended
iTrader: (61)
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,124
Trader Rating: 61 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by the big rc View Post
This is interesting, i never considered that no one will make a rear motor, but xray just came out with one. Hmmmm
They did? Pics?

I own a Xb2 dirt, and have never seen pics of their actual rear motor car.
Socket is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 12:05 PM
  #12  
Tech Addict
iTrader: (9)
 
gogi108's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: brisbane
Posts: 607
Trader Rating: 9 (100%+)
Default

Yep , i would say rear is all but dead for competitive racing . That said i recently restored a b5r that i picked up cheap and look forward to putting it on the track at some stage to see how it is lol . Been about 2 years since going to mid so should be interesting .
gogi108 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 12:28 PM
  #13  
Tech Elite
iTrader: (1)
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Houston
Posts: 2,713
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

It all comes down to rear grip. Rear motor has more weight biased towards the rear. As long as there are tracks that have high grip that can allow less weight on the rear wheels without causing the rear to slide out and still maintain adequate forward grip, mid motor will rule. On tracks that need more rear weight to get good rear traction or setups where sliding the rear end around a corner motocross style, rear motor will be beneficial. Mid motor is not superior everywhere. Rear motor is not superior everywhere. Current tracks favor mid motor.

I never had grip issues on loamy tracks either unless they were allowed to completely dry out and get dusty. Even then, the tires if the day were very hard and the pins cut right through that dust layer in a way that modern tires don't. Mid motor could conceivably work on those tracks. Yes it was tried back then but not only has car design changed, wheel sizes, tire widths, front end kick angle, are lengths, and an understanding of tuning have all evolved. Much of the reason that it didn't work came down to a lack of understanding.

I don't think rear motor will ever truly die. It'll all depend if tracks continue to be high grip and hard or if they ever revert back to softer.
fredswain is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 12:28 PM
  #14  
Tech Elite
iTrader: (18)
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: OC
Posts: 2,116
Trader Rating: 18 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by the big rc View Post
We have an outdoor loamy track in my area, and for the past several years some of us have tried to make mid motors work. Most give up and go to rear because its just easier.

I keep thinking that there is no reason that a mid shouldn't work just as well as a rear in these conditions. Is it because we have 20 years experience in rear motor and it feels more comfortable.

Most large racing cars, mid motor works way better.

I'm curious as to what everyone thinks.
Where's the local loamy track? I love running on loam, can't believe I missed hearing about it. I ran my B5M in stock at Dave's the last 5 races of the season last year - somehow managed to TQ and win four. The car's pace was fast enough to have taken 4th in the Invitational, had I attended. And it felt great, not difficult to drive. That said, my current setup would've been a handful in mod. From what I'm hearing, several fast guys will be giving mid motor a go out there this year.
Sorcerer001 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 08:56 PM
  #15  
Tech Elite
Thread Starter
iTrader: (40)
 
the big rc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: portland
Posts: 2,158
Trader Rating: 40 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by Sorcerer001 View Post
Where's the local loamy track? I love running on loam, can't believe I missed hearing about it. I ran my B5M in stock at Dave's the last 5 races of the season last year - somehow managed to TQ and win four. The car's pace was fast enough to have taken 4th in the Invitational, had I attended. And it felt great, not difficult to drive. That said, my current setup would've been a handful in mod. From what I'm hearing, several fast guys will be giving mid motor a go out there this year.
Im talking about daves. It will be interesting to see if any of the mod guys can make it work
the big rc is offline  
Reply With Quote

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service