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Old 10-13-2005, 05:59 PM   #1
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Default Help with decding on some electronics for stock truck racing...

I hate to be such a noob, but here goes...

im just getting back into the electric scene and im looking to race quite a bit...

I just picked up a t4 with a lrp QC1 and a monster stock motor.... the car also came with 2 fantom matched 3300s and one 3000... all are around 1.15v...

did my first race with the car at socal last friday. signed up for novice, but got bumped to intermediate b/c i was the only person to sign up for novice. qualified 3rd out of 11 trucks in both qualifiers and then placed 2nd in the main. for the first qualifier, i used a unmatched sanyo 3600 sport pack that i disassembled and made into a horizontal pack (not sure what it is called, but not stick pack). i have 2 of these... used 1 in the qualifier, then used one of the fantom 3300s in the 2nd qualifier... for the third i used a fantom 3300 pack that was accidentally overcharged by me when i used peak lockout and it was already charged... so it didnt quite have the punch of the others and was slower.... I really wasn't paying attention at the difference in the packs because it was during the middle of a race, but I'm not sure if there is really much of a difference between the unmatched 3600 Sanyos and the 3300 matched GPs...

i have a really old Tekin BC112C charger that i have from my elec days long ago... it has the updated h30 software, which is supposed to charge NiMH batteries but it doesn't have the latest h31 software which supposedly gets rid of some of the bugs in the h30 software. I also have a multiplex LN-5014 which charges NiMH, NiCD, Li-Ion, and LiPo.


My questions are:

Are these charters sufficient for racing? I've read that the Tekin often false peaks, which is why it is nicknamed "false peakin Tekin" I haven't read very much about the multiplex, because it is a new. It has been false speaking on me quite a bit now, and I will often have to hit the start button two to three times in order to get a full charge.

I'm looking to get a better charger, but I don't have a bottomless wallet. I'm looking for something at least under $130 or so that can do NiMH really well. I just got outbid on a APS Dyno-Charge S3 on eBay. Having a dyno would definitely be a plus, but is it really needed for racing? I have two 12v DC power supplies with 8A each, so power supply is not a problem.

I also just picked up a used team cobra Pro comm lathe to do some cuts on my stock motors.


I was also looking at a new battery packs. Are the pro-match racing IB 3800s any good? Also, while the difference between 1.18v, 1.19v and 1.20v really be that noticeable on the track?


So basically my questions can be summed up to be, what kind of electronics should I be looking at for intermediate, local club, stock truck racing? It doesn't really seem like the electronics really matter that much, because I was running really old matched battery packs and newer unmatched cheap batteries on a cheap charger, but I would still like to know what would be good for me, since I do plan on upgrading anyways.



Thanks,
Erik
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Old 10-14-2005, 12:18 AM   #2
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I've got a Multiplex LN5014 as well and works great for racing. Really you just need a charger that will peak your batteries reliably and has an adjustable charge rate, peak voltage adjustabilty is nice though too. If your not racing at a high level and are still new that charger will be fine. You may want to pick up an equalizing tray (Novak makes a really nice one) to maintain your batteries. As far as batteries go, basically you just want to get the packs with the highest numbers you can afford. SMC is one trusted brand that makes some nice packs at a good price. I've heard nothing but good things about Pro-match as well though. The IB3800's are generally regarded as teh best cells out there right now. You can get some GP3300's at great prices right now though too since most matchers are fazing them out, and the 3300mah capacity is still way more than enough for stock racing.
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Old 10-14-2005, 12:22 AM   #3
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thanks for the help...

so it seems like i should stick with my chargers and just get a good equalizing tray and batts...

the 3300s dont have as high average voltage #s as t# really matter that much?
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Old 10-14-2005, 02:01 AM   #4
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For stock run time doesn't matter, since you can get over 10 minutes from a pack anyway. Voltage and internal resistance are what affect the power/torque output of your motor. The higher the voltage the more speed, and the lower the internal resistance (I/R) the more torque.
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Old 10-14-2005, 09:45 AM   #5
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thanks for explaining this to me....

so what does a equalizing tray do that is so magical?

thanks
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Old 10-14-2005, 11:13 AM   #6
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I run Buggy, and Sedan. Got into it cheap and upgraded my stuff from there. Right now I would say Novak GTX speed control, Trinity Monster Pro, or P2K2 Pro motors, LRP Pulsar 2 Charger, and a Novak Smart Tray are the norm for electronic choices. For batteries I like Fusion Power - Matched - Somewhat Inexpensive - Can Buy in 3 Pack Specials. Here are my reasons: My friend fried two LRP Quantums back to back :-( Went to a GTX and hasn't looked back. Monster Pro's offer higher RPM's, and lately SoCal has been running long straights on the track. Look for numbers on the can that show the highest Efficiency then Wattage of atleast 65+. LRP Pulsar 2 is really good if you can't afford a CE CFX. Shop matchers and pricing and you'll see what I mean about the Fusion packs. Just resolder the tabs where you connect the power leads, as they tend to pop off with offroad. Keep in mind SoCal is an extremely competive track to race. These are only my opinions on electronic choices, but I have my reasons. Just have fun, and practice, practice, practice.
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Old 10-14-2005, 11:31 AM   #7
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cool beans...

ill stick with the QC1 right now until it goes...

the LRP Pulsars.... are the extra features on the 2 really needed over the 1?
  • the 1 can go 1-8A, 2 can go 1-10A... the 2 has stored profiles...
  • 2 has discharge 1-10A cutoff 3.6 to 7.2V... 1 has 10A discharge cutoff 3.6 to 6.9V...
  • 2: PCS-3 Peak Capacity System 1: PCS-2 Peak Capacity System...
  • 2: 2.0-7.2 14A output for motors... 1: 2.0-7.2 9A output for motors...

those are all the differences... is it really worth the extra dough?



also, on the batteries... promatch racing is definately cheaper than fusion...
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Old 10-14-2005, 11:39 AM   #8
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Just saw your post on what an equalizing tray does. Here is a brief explanation. Each cell might be manufactured the same but they will all have there own characteristics. Matchers buy large volumes of batteries, and test each cell to read the properties. They then assemble the packs for sale based on each packs numbers, and performance. An equalizer matches each cells voltage after a run to say .9 volts, and it basically trys to keep the consistency of the packs intact. I am sure someone on here could delve deeper into the topic, but I have seen my equalizer take some unmatched packs and equalize them. Side note: I would never Dead Short a pack = 0.00 Volts. I did this to these pack, and it killed them all. From what I have read on the net it is a 50/50 gamble to do this. Just equalize to 0.9 Volts and you'll be good to go.
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Old 10-14-2005, 11:46 AM   #9
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thanks... i just picked up a matched pack from promatch...

IB3800, 1.18+V, 470+ runtime, assembled w/ deans connector for $41 shipped...
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Old 10-14-2005, 01:49 PM   #10
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The only possible issue with the pulsar 1 might be the motor run function, as some motors might draw too many amps. All the electronics you mentioned are great racing stuff. You might as well run the QC1 until it dies.

One word of caution with the Novak tray. When trayng a pack, you want to make sure all of the contacts are clean and working. Otherwise, some of the cells will be discharged completely while others won't, which could damage the pack on the subsequent charge. I also like that integy tray, which takes down the cells at about 30 amps (or so it claims)

I think you made a great purchase with those promatch ib3800's. The cells are improving, and pretty darn cheap for the performance. You will not notice the difference between 1.18, 1.19, and 1.20 cells, as all the ib's seem to have a good amount of punch. Welcome back to electric off-road! Socal is a great place.
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Old 10-16-2005, 04:32 PM   #11
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thanks for the help and the advice...

I picked up a Trinity Absolute Zero tray which uses bulbs down to .85v each cell and then it has some LEDs to show other stages of the discharge if you go beyond that...

i already have an Integy Reactor 30 discharger that came with the t4 package on ebay, so i can discharge down to 5.5 v or so at 30 amps and then throw it on the tray...

as far as chargers go, ive narrowed down my options to the Orion Advantage, LRP Pulsar, or Duratrax Ice...

some of the integy's are probably pretty nice, but i havent really checked them out much...
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Old 10-17-2005, 01:59 PM   #12
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as far as the chargers you've narrowed it down to:


I own both the original LRP pulsar comp as well as a Duratrax ICE charger.

I love both chargers but I will say that the ICE's profiles are a wonderful thing. The pulsar 2 has I think three profiles which is nice (mine being original has only one profile) The ICE has 10. That means you can simply have all of your batteries (ie: 3300's, 3800's, rx packs, tx packs, nicd's, etc) all loaded into memory whereas the LRP you would need to reset the settings to the appropriate values before charging.

As far as peaking.. I really like the ICE's temp sensor as it puts another bit of safety into charging. If you goof or you have a possible bad cell at least you know the ICE will detect the temp's and stop charging before damage occurs. Either charger though is excellent for charging and I've had very very few false peaks and if so it's usually due to my aged batteries. My race packs work fantastic every time on either charger.

Never used the orion so I have no input on that charger..

Enjoy and have fun!
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Old 10-17-2005, 02:11 PM   #13
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thanks.. looks like ill be looking harder at the ice
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