12LikesNew Schumacher KF2
07-29-2016, 08:27 AM - Wikipost
|
|||
|
|||
|
08-08-2015, 06:02 PM
#436
They measure negligibly different. Minus the 2.15mm thickness of the ruler they both are 26.75mm offset, which is close to exactly one inch.
I have never measured Avid, DE or any other brands. But these AE wheels should bolt up just fine without spacers.
08-08-2015, 06:36 PM
#438
Here is a great pack for those wanting to try out the LCG shorty with the MM conversion:
http://www.promatchracing.com/prodde...rod=2S3500100C
Only 2.4 milliohm per cell and at $35 I think it is a great value. It is also a great way to shave 50-60g off your total mass too. Stock guys will love that
I am actually going to start using these as my default battery because they have more than enough capacity for 5 minutes with any motor in probably any situation, they keep the weight down low (I'll tune chassis roll elsewhere) and they let me put the extra weight saved where I want it. If that area happens to be under the battery they have 50g under lipo weights that are roughly 1mm thin. And never mind that for the price of about 1 of the big name brand's packs I could get three of these....
I am sure there are people here who will challenge this but I am willing to bet that there are very few people (if any) who could "feel" the difference between a pack with cells having IRs in the teens (millohms) vs cells having less than 5. I think its just part of the "religion" of stock racing. Disclosure: I am a stock racer most of the time. I will continue to be until my times are generally faster with more than a 17.5 / 13.5, which they are not.
A whole other discussion about internal resistance can be had about the method and the manner by which you actually measure it. It can be thorny. But this is the KF2 thread so I digress....
08-08-2015, 07:15 PM
#439
Tech Regular
Battery
I cannot speak for the actual LCG packs from LRP but the super shorty packs I have from them definitely have a higher internal resistance than some of my other standard shorties.
Here is a great pack for those wanting to try out the LCG shorty with the MM conversion:
http://www.promatchracing.com/prodde...rod=2S3500100C
Only 2.4 milliohm per cell and at $35 I think it is a great value. It is also a great way to shave 50-60g off your total mass too. Stock guys will love that
I am actually going to start using these as my default battery because they have more than enough capacity for 5 minutes with any motor in probably any situation, they keep the weight down low (I'll tune chassis roll elsewhere) and they let me put the extra weight saved where I want it. If that area happens to be under the battery they have 50g under lipo weights that are roughly 1mm thin. And never mind that for the price of about 1 of the big name brand's packs I could get three of these....
I am sure there are people here who will challenge this but I am willing to bet that there are very few people (if any) who could "feel" the difference between a pack with cells having IRs in the teens (millohms) vs cells having less than 5. I think its just part of the "religion" of stock racing. Disclosure: I am a stock racer most of the time. I will continue to be until my times are generally faster with more than a 17.5 / 13.5, which they are not.
A whole other discussion about internal resistance can be had about the method and the manner by which you actually measure it. It can be thorny. But this is the KF2 thread so I digress....
Here is a great pack for those wanting to try out the LCG shorty with the MM conversion:
http://www.promatchracing.com/prodde...rod=2S3500100C
Only 2.4 milliohm per cell and at $35 I think it is a great value. It is also a great way to shave 50-60g off your total mass too. Stock guys will love that
I am actually going to start using these as my default battery because they have more than enough capacity for 5 minutes with any motor in probably any situation, they keep the weight down low (I'll tune chassis roll elsewhere) and they let me put the extra weight saved where I want it. If that area happens to be under the battery they have 50g under lipo weights that are roughly 1mm thin. And never mind that for the price of about 1 of the big name brand's packs I could get three of these....
I am sure there are people here who will challenge this but I am willing to bet that there are very few people (if any) who could "feel" the difference between a pack with cells having IRs in the teens (millohms) vs cells having less than 5. I think its just part of the "religion" of stock racing. Disclosure: I am a stock racer most of the time. I will continue to be until my times are generally faster with more than a 17.5 / 13.5, which they are not.
A whole other discussion about internal resistance can be had about the method and the manner by which you actually measure it. It can be thorny. But this is the KF2 thread so I digress....
08-08-2015, 08:48 PM
#440
I had some track time today with the new MM conversion. I have to say I am disappointed with the results so far.
I had a experience very similar to Matt's. I started with the MM conversion with the low grip setup we were using before. I was surprised to see the amount of forward traction had increased substantially, but I had zero lateral on power grip in the turns and would spin out at the slightest turn.
I flipped the rear arms for a wider wheelbase, removed the front brace, added 56g of weight behind the motor assembly, 1' anti squat, and added slicks to the front. It would still break loose off power entering the turn or oversteer on power exiting and I would end up in the next lane over.
Should I have not flipped the rear arms and left them forward? Did removing the front brace introduce too much flex aiding in the oversteer?
Ultimately, I got frustrated. It got to a point that the small changes didn't seem to have a discernible effect. It was either loose off power or over steering on power. In between battery charges I would drive my Rb6 which wasn't helping my frustration. I have similar equipment in each running blinky. The Kf2 doesn't come close to how responsive and nimble my Rb6 is. The Kf2 was such a joy to assembly, simple to work on, and easy to adjust that I so desperately want my Kf2 to work for me.
I had a experience very similar to Matt's. I started with the MM conversion with the low grip setup we were using before. I was surprised to see the amount of forward traction had increased substantially, but I had zero lateral on power grip in the turns and would spin out at the slightest turn.
I flipped the rear arms for a wider wheelbase, removed the front brace, added 56g of weight behind the motor assembly, 1' anti squat, and added slicks to the front. It would still break loose off power entering the turn or oversteer on power exiting and I would end up in the next lane over.
Should I have not flipped the rear arms and left them forward? Did removing the front brace introduce too much flex aiding in the oversteer?
Ultimately, I got frustrated. It got to a point that the small changes didn't seem to have a discernible effect. It was either loose off power or over steering on power. In between battery charges I would drive my Rb6 which wasn't helping my frustration. I have similar equipment in each running blinky. The Kf2 doesn't come close to how responsive and nimble my Rb6 is. The Kf2 was such a joy to assembly, simple to work on, and easy to adjust that I so desperately want my Kf2 to work for me.
Last edited by Jpdanger; 08-08-2015 at 10:24 PM.
08-08-2015, 08:56 PM
#441
I still am convinced that Maizer's personal mod is what this MM conversion should have been.
08-09-2015, 07:08 AM
#442
Tech Regular
Set up
I had some track time today with the new MM conversion. I have to say I am disappointed with the results so far.
I had a experience very similar to Matt's. I started with the MM conversion with the low grip setup we were using before. I was surprised to see the amount of forward traction had increased substantially, but I had zero lateral on power grip in the turns and would spin out at the slightest turn.
I flipped the rear arms for a wider wheelbase, removed the front brace, added 56g of weight behind the motor assembly, 1' anti squat, and added slicks to the front. It would still break loose off power entering the turn or oversteer on power exiting and I would end up in the next lane over.
Should I have not flipped the rear arms and left them forward? Did removing the front brace introduce too much flex aiding in the oversteer?
Ultimately, I got frustrated. It got to a point that the small changes didn't seem to have a discernible effect. It was either loose off power or over steering on power. In between battery charges I would drive my Rb6 which wasn't helping my frustration. I have similar equipment in each running blinky. The Kf2 doesn't come close to how responsive and nimble my Rb6 is. The Kf2 was such a joy to assembly, simple to work on, and easy to adjust that I so desperately want my Kf2 to work for me.
I had a experience very similar to Matt's. I started with the MM conversion with the low grip setup we were using before. I was surprised to see the amount of forward traction had increased substantially, but I had zero lateral on power grip in the turns and would spin out at the slightest turn.
I flipped the rear arms for a wider wheelbase, removed the front brace, added 56g of weight behind the motor assembly, 1' anti squat, and added slicks to the front. It would still break loose off power entering the turn or oversteer on power exiting and I would end up in the next lane over.
Should I have not flipped the rear arms and left them forward? Did removing the front brace introduce too much flex aiding in the oversteer?
Ultimately, I got frustrated. It got to a point that the small changes didn't seem to have a discernible effect. It was either loose off power or over steering on power. In between battery charges I would drive my Rb6 which wasn't helping my frustration. I have similar equipment in each running blinky. The Kf2 doesn't come close to how responsive and nimble my Rb6 is. The Kf2 was such a joy to assembly, simple to work on, and easy to adjust that I so desperately want my Kf2 to work for me.
08-09-2015, 07:25 AM
#443
its interesting to see folks w/ trouble after the MM conversion. hopefully everyone is trying actual setup changes too-- and not just hoping that throwing on parts will fix everything
i ran my 38/62% weight KF2 on a newly redesigned layout last wednesday with pin tires. i didn't have any traction issues.
i ran my 38/62% weight KF2 on a newly redesigned layout last wednesday with pin tires. i didn't have any traction issues.
08-09-2015, 07:59 AM
#444
Attached are some photos showing the measurements with this method. The black wheel is the kit Schumacher wheel (U4365). The white wheel is an Associated #9695. Both are 2.2" rears.
They measure negligibly different. Minus the 2.15mm thickness of the ruler they both are 26.75mm offset, which is close to exactly one inch.
I have never measured Avid, DE or any other brands. But these AE wheels should bolt up just fine without spacers.
They measure negligibly different. Minus the 2.15mm thickness of the ruler they both are 26.75mm offset, which is close to exactly one inch.
I have never measured Avid, DE or any other brands. But these AE wheels should bolt up just fine without spacers.
note: 25.4mm = 1 inch
08-09-2015, 08:34 AM
#445
08-09-2015, 11:10 AM
#446
@JP - I think this conversion really does solve the biggest problem the car had before, which was the forward bite. I feel that dealing with that is mostly outside of the realm of reasonable tuning efforts and more of a design limitation. I think the problems the car has now with the MM conversion (and a needed setup freshening) are within the realm of tuning and that we should be able to get there. Keep heart!
08-09-2015, 08:29 PM
#448
Attached are some photos showing the measurements with this method. The black wheel is the kit Schumacher wheel (U4365). The white wheel is an Associated #9695. Both are 2.2" rears.
They measure negligibly different. Minus the 2.15mm thickness of the ruler they both are 26.75mm offset, which is close to exactly one inch.
I have never measured Avid, DE or any other brands. But these AE wheels should bolt up just fine without spacers.
They measure negligibly different. Minus the 2.15mm thickness of the ruler they both are 26.75mm offset, which is close to exactly one inch.
I have never measured Avid, DE or any other brands. But these AE wheels should bolt up just fine without spacers.
rear wheels backspacing:
stock: 26.62mm
avid: 27.00mm
front wheels backspacing:
stock: 16.67mm
avid: 18.17mm
roughly .4mm difference rear and 1.5mm front per side...(measuring them isnt really a science on my end either, there is some flex to average in there)
Ive been running 1mm avid spacers up front and none in the rear....
Also the overall width is different... (inside bead to inside bead, as outer width could change due to design and/or appearance)
rear width:
stock: 35.10mm
avid: 35.90mm
front width:
stock: 22.10mm
avid: 23.15mm
pretty significant differences there imo....
08-09-2015, 08:39 PM
#449
Thanks for measuring those Avid wheels. I have been wanting to try them for awhile and I was wondering about the spacing details. I think those are significant differences too.
So what are you running these days? 1/8th scale nitro? When are you going to dust off the Schumachers?????
So what are you running these days? 1/8th scale nitro? When are you going to dust off the Schumachers?????
08-09-2015, 08:45 PM
#450
Ya I like them... they stay true longer. Theyre alot thicker in the center
Ya Ive been racing alot of nitro lately, traveling for a few new brands/distributor promoting. Our local tracks have been going through alot of changes so no big deal really. Im thinking about going out saturday and running some flashlights
I pulled everything out and dusted it off tonight, change shock orings and throw it down
Ya Ive been racing alot of nitro lately, traveling for a few new brands/distributor promoting. Our local tracks have been going through alot of changes so no big deal really. Im thinking about going out saturday and running some flashlights
I pulled everything out and dusted it off tonight, change shock orings and throw it down