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Old 07-26-2005, 12:40 PM   #106
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Can you say with absolute resolve, that I was treated fairly by the rest of that committee?

Homer,

Fairness requires that either there is no bias or that the bias has (or can) be set aside to make a reasonable decision.

Did some members on the committee have a bias against you? I believe they did. Did some members have a bias toward you? Absolutely. Was it split down the middle? I don't think so.

Homer, you are a controversial guy. Always have been, always will be. I asked you several times, during the time the committee was working, to tone things "down a notch." Did the bias against you have more to do with your controversial nature than the quality of your track? Yes.

But the crux of the issue here is about you and ROAR, not the committee.

You posted several times on the Starting Grid about your dissatisfaction with ROAR. What did you get in return? An invitation to put your name in for a committee. When you did, you actually got put on a committee. Not a committee that measures the weight of jock straps, the Fuel Off-Road Committee. It is my understanding (someone correct me if I am wrong) that Rick Wilson placed you on the committee with the enthusiastic support of Dawn. This happened just weeks before the committee had to make a decision about the Nats. This was because that committee had become very lax and needed new members.

As a result, Rick and Dawn supported you for the committee. They knew at the time (I didn't and I don't think many others did) who had placed bids for the Nats. Do you REALLY think that Rick and/or Dawn would want you on the committee just to sabotage your chances? I didn't then and don't now.

I know for a fact that Dawn supported you to several individuals when it wasn't popular to do so. That is why it is so difficult to accept Mike's understanding of their conversation. I am NOT saying that he is not telling the truth, I believe he misunderstood her.

Internet petitions, backroom deals, lies and inuendo will not get Dawn out of ROAR. Dawn Sanchez has always done what she feels is best to support the hobby.

Has she flown off the handle? Yup. Has she participated in mindless, dribbling arguments that have not done anyone any good? Yup. Has she been baited into these arguments because her buttons are easy to push? Yup.

The only thing I ask those of you who seem to have personal issues with her is; remember there is a fine line between passion and lunacy. Dawn is very passionate about RC, maybe too passionate due to the responses she gets. The hobby would be much worse without her.
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Old 07-26-2005, 01:21 PM   #107
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"Homer, don't blame Dawn for you not getting the Nats. If she did try to "sway" someone (and I am not saying she did) it didn't work. The Nats went to the best facility and if you want to blame someone, blame me."


or Homer could blame himself.....
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Old 07-26-2005, 02:03 PM   #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by losi jon
"Homer, don't blame Dawn for you not getting the Nats. If she did try to "sway" someone (and I am not saying she did) it didn't work. The Nats went to the best facility and if you want to blame someone, blame me."


or Homer could blame himself.....

He did read the second to last post he put up.......
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Old 07-26-2005, 02:15 PM   #109
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As stated whats done is done. I take full responiblity for my actions. I will deal with whatever flack I get from it. Controverisial, lunancy and passioniate big words for little cars.

I do not blame Dawn for me not getting the nats. I blame Dawn for not telling me the truth on several occasions not only related to the nats. If she can live with her actions, so can I. There will be a day when all this madness is over. Who will be left standing.......

Dave from an earlier post you said Dawn didn't try and sway your vote. Being you were one of the ones voting against me I can see why she didn't
try and sway you. You were already there.

I've heard several times the race went to the best place. How do we know that? What makes were the race went any better than it would have been coming here. Please do explain.
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Old 07-26-2005, 02:21 PM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Homer Allman
As stated whats done is done. I take full responiblity for my actions. I will deal with whatever flack I get from it. Controverisial, lunancy and passioniate big words for little cars.

I do not blame Dawn for me not getting the nats. I blame Dawn for not telling me the truth on several occasions not only related to the nats. If she can live with her actions, so can I. There will be a day when all this madness is over. Who will be left standing.......

Dave from an earlier post you said Dawn didn't try and sway your vote. Being you were one of the ones voting against me I can see why she didn't
try and sway you. You were already there.

I've heard several times the race went to the best place. How do we know that? What makes were the race went any better than it would have been coming here. Please do explain.
When he does explain, make sure it's not the "in the middle of nowhere" excuse. I figure you go somewhere to race, not to take in an amusement park or shop at Saks while doing so. If you have whiney kids and a wife, leave 'em at home.
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Old 07-26-2005, 02:33 PM   #111
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A way to measure a facility is to not only judge the actual track by itself, but you include everyone who is involved with operating and maintaining the races, at the track and away form the track as well. A track without the people who operate it is just that, an empty track with no capabilities. K&M is a great example of why ROAR held the mod nats twice within 5 years of each other, the organizers put on a great race, the track itself is not the best nor is the building it is in, but the race went on without problems both times and everyone could relax and enjoy the race without getting caught up in drama that is surrounding it's members. Just my opinion of tracks.
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Old 07-26-2005, 02:37 PM   #112
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So are you saying the the people associated with my track suck and are useless when it comes to puttting on a race. Let's get back to Dave's post. Why was one better than the other. The ballis in your court Dave.
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Old 07-26-2005, 02:51 PM   #113
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you said:
"Dave from an earlier post you said Dawn didn't try and sway your vote. Being you were one of the ones voting against me I can see why she didn't try and sway you. You were already there."

When in fact, I said:
"I was on the committee and yes the committee was deadlocked and I was on the side of the Tiltyard."

Homer, yet another example of how you selectively twist things. Just because you say it doesn't mean it is true.

To answer your question.... MARIACHI BANDS made it better! If you would have had them, I would have voted for you.


Your Friend,
Mariachi Dave
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Old 07-26-2005, 02:53 PM   #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Homer Allman
So are you saying the the people associated with my track suck and are useless when it comes to puttting on a race. Let's get back to Dave's post. Why was one better than the other. The ballis in your court Dave.
Gee Homer, way to push the comment I made into a truely negative direction, which it was never ment to mean. I am just saying, you contribute a lot to your facility, you own it, you build it, you live within walking distance of it. How you act everywhere will always directly reflect on your facility, like it or not.
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Old 07-26-2005, 02:56 PM   #115
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Dave so you have no real answer, but yet you use this, it went to the right place, all the time. What did they have that I didn't?

Tol I hope so.
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Old 07-26-2005, 02:57 PM   #116
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Oh my God! If no one blames anyone for anything, why won't this thread sink to the bottom of the forum!

ROAR needs work!

Homer needs to let it go!

Mabey if everyone would work on their own problems rather than someone elses, this thread would just dissapear. ROAR does need some major upkeep, we know that, and Homer does need to learn when to quit, but what everyone here is guilty of is pointing out the flaws of others instead of making progress. ROAR needs to learn from their mistakes, and make sure the past doesn't happen again, and Homer needs to leave the past where it is and concentrate on what is happening around us. Who the hell cares about swaying votes, or breaching security! The point is, change the passwords, find a more secure alternative, and deal with the officials who are wreckless with their authority. Both sides of this argument could benefit from this if only they would look at their own mistakes, instead of dwelling on the mistakes of others. Dawn needs to stand back and take a good long look at what can be done to prevent these issues from reoccuring, and Homer needs to step back and realize that what happened is written in stone, and no amount of posts will undo the past, all they can do is bring about change to prevent it from happening again. If ROAR would stop being so stubborn and communicate with everyone on a personal level, this wouldn't have happened. If Homer hadn't acted irresponsibly, this could have been solved in a more civil manner. Both sides need to stand back and take notes, it's not a he-said she-said deal, it's a learning experience.

Bottom line, ROAR stop taking peoples money, stop being so detached, get on the ball and stop playing around with people. Excuses lead to angry and confused people. No consumer/member based orgonization would last more than 2 weeks if they kept on making excuses for themselves. Fix the problems, and get on the same page. Deal with the people in your orgonization whose objective is not for the common good of the orgonization, and if there are any questions, don't wait and see if someone will complain, deal with it immediatly, if it means suspending a member of a comitee because you are unsure of their intentions, then that's what should happen. It isn't a personal vendeta, just a security measure to preserve the integrity of the orgonization. Plus, it leads to a lot less headaches down the road. Although I respect ROAR, it is looking like revisions are going to need to be made.

Homer, I'm sure your track is an excellent place to race, and someday I might race there myself, but if a vote is cast and you lose, it doesn't always mean that the voting was rigged to favor your opponent. It's not 3RD grade anymore, I'm sure it was more than a popularity contest, although I can not be sure. Take the answer you get, and if you don't like it, voice your opinion, but don't take justice into your own hands by handing out personal information, and entering a secure forum just to try and start something. Mistrust is the child of dishonesty. Instead of blaming ROAR for being biased, do your best to make your track the place for next years events. Take their response as advice. Rather than complain because there may have been a conspiracy, try and make your track better, so that next year you will have a better chance at getting nationals.

If I seemed to favor one side over another I appologize, I just call them as I see them, and if I got any facts wrong, I do appologize, but it is a lot for an outsider to keep track of. Also, please keep in mind that I am an outsider, and I know nothing about anyone involved on a personal level, so if any of this is offensive, it was not meant to be. I just thought that instead of everyone pointing fingers, everyone could be taking notes. Just my opinion, please don't hold anything against me.
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Old 07-26-2005, 02:59 PM   #117
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Default At the time I called her to get the phone number, I can tell you that she made absolu

Dave that was from you earlier.
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Old 07-26-2005, 03:12 PM   #118
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Platinum great post. I did work to improve my track this year. I hope it showed. We'll see if the work I did really makes a difference or if I'll just be pushed to the side again.

I've tried to help ROAR out many times only to get kicked in the teeth.

Let's try this one and see how you guys would like. it.

Oh Homer come join our committee,

Homie says ok, I want to help.

Two days later, Homie you must leave the committee because we are deciding on rather you get the race or not and we do not want you to see what we are saying about you.

SO in a matter of days I was in and out of the committee.
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Old 07-26-2005, 03:25 PM   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Platinum_Racing
Oh my God! If no one blames anyone for anything, why won't this thread sink to the bottom of the forum!

ROAR needs work!

Homer needs to let it go!

Mabey if everyone would work on their own problems rather than someone elses, this thread would just dissapear. ROAR does need some major upkeep, we know that, and Homer does need to learn when to quit, but what everyone here is guilty of is pointing out the flaws of others instead of making progress. ROAR needs to learn from their mistakes, and make sure the past doesn't happen again, and Homer needs to leave the past where it is and concentrate on what is happening around us. Who the hell cares about swaying votes, or breaching security! The point is, change the passwords, find a more secure alternative, and deal with the officials who are wreckless with their authority. Both sides of this argument could benefit from this if only they would look at their own mistakes, instead of dwelling on the mistakes of others. Dawn needs to stand back and take a good long look at what can be done to prevent these issues from reoccuring, and Homer needs to step back and realize that what happened is written in stone, and no amount of posts will undo the past, all they can do is bring about change to prevent it from happening again. If ROAR would stop being so stubborn and communicate with everyone on a personal level, this wouldn't have happened. If Homer hadn't acted irresponsibly, this could have been solved in a more civil manner. Both sides need to stand back and take notes, it's not a he-said she-said deal, it's a learning experience.

Bottom line, ROAR stop taking peoples money, stop being so detached, get on the ball and stop playing around with people. Excuses lead to angry and confused people. No consumer/member based orgonization would last more than 2 weeks if they kept on making excuses for themselves. Fix the problems, and get on the same page. Deal with the people in your orgonization whose objective is not for the common good of the orgonization, and if there are any questions, don't wait and see if someone will complain, deal with it immediatly, if it means suspending a member of a comitee because you are unsure of their intentions, then that's what should happen. It isn't a personal vendeta, just a security measure to preserve the integrity of the orgonization. Plus, it leads to a lot less headaches down the road. Although I respect ROAR, it is looking like revisions are going to need to be made.

Homer, I'm sure your track is an excellent place to race, and someday I might race there myself, but if a vote is cast and you lose, it doesn't always mean that the voting was rigged to favor your opponent. It's not 3RD grade anymore, I'm sure it was more than a popularity contest, although I can not be sure. Take the answer you get, and if you don't like it, voice your opinion, but don't take justice into your own hands by handing out personal information, and entering a secure forum just to try and start something. Mistrust is the child of dishonesty. Instead of blaming ROAR for being biased, do your best to make your track the place for next years events. Take their response as advice. Rather than complain because there may have been a conspiracy, try and make your track better, so that next year you will have a better chance at getting nationals.

If I seemed to favor one side over another I appologize, I just call them as I see them, and if I got any facts wrong, I do appologize, but it is a lot for an outsider to keep track of. Also, please keep in mind that I am an outsider, and I know nothing about anyone involved on a personal level, so if any of this is offensive, it was not meant to be. I just thought that instead of everyone pointing fingers, everyone could be taking notes. Just my opinion, please don't hold anything against me.

I quoted this because everyoen needs to read it TEN TIMES!

That post summed up everything.

Make this an oppurtunity to move forward, not dwell on the past.

Homie- Man I wish you had every NATIONAL there is, off-road , onroad, gas and Elec. But do remember this there is only 1 national per class every year and 300 tracks that want it......
be thankful that you have had a national before and WILL have one again! You are hosting other races that if things keep going COULD be BIGGER than a ROAR national! Hint RC Pro Series!
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Old 07-26-2005, 03:27 PM   #120
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Ummmm, maybe they decided to go with the other track because they didnt want the same drama to come down at a race that has come down since. You seem to be in the middle of drama constantly

Example, Tol points out how the staff of K&M make a not the best facility a great place to race and you take it as an attack on your track.

And it is normal practice for someone who has a vested interest in a non-profit committee decision to be dis included from all discussions pertaining to such decisions. I would be more concerned if ROAR let you in on those discussions.
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Last edited by Jack Smash; 07-26-2005 at 03:36 PM. Reason: My wording may have come off as a personal attack and that certainly wasn't what I intended.
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