Wild Cherry

Tekin

Its works on ours so its your fault it don't work on yours is not a very technical response.....

Charlie

I think Tekin publicly claimed that the Havoc Pro SC was not "Strong" enough to run your motor.......

That's not the case. It's "technically wrong" at a minimum. There was some sort of an issue, but it was "not" a lack of power handling.

So, Kettle, meet the Pot, Pot meet the Kettle.

I love the Internet. My email address is [email protected] and I'm glad to chat with anyone about anything in regards to this or any topic directly related to Novak product performance or capabilities. I pride our tech support with being strait forward and to the point on all topics.

Raman

iTrader: (94)

By your own admission, perhaps you should pick up a Novak controller and do some further testing prior to coming into this thread and calling Novak unprofessional. As an owner of both Novak and Tekin products, you are the one coming across as unprofessional, because it does not look like you have thorougly done your home work.

NovakTwo

http://www.rctech.net/forum/electric...ml#post9794589

can i use this motor(pro4 4.5t) with an Novak havoc pro sc esc??

NO, it would thermal in minutes.

So I guess you have to use tekin esc then. Why can't you use the novak esc

10-18-2011, 09:56 AM/TY@TEAMTEKIN: It's the turn rating, I'm pretty sure the Havoc isn't rated for 1 and 2 turn motors, just as we don't allow the RS/RSPro to run them either.
you need 1/8th speedo the thing just draws a ton of amps

I know it's recommended to use an RX8 with these, but I can't afford both a new motor and ESC right now.

Can I run one of these on my Novak Havoc Pro?
Sure you can, but it may only last for two laps.

11-23-2011, 07:18 PM/RANDY PIKE: I wouldn't do that...sorry.

Anyone? I know my Havoc Pro will not work. Just want to see what other esc options work with the Pro4.

12-02-2011, 08:45 AM/TEKIN PREZ: All of those esc's tend to make the Pro4 and T8 motors run hotter then when used with a Rx8. They work, but just saying...

I have to agree. I tried the Pro4 - 4000kv with my very new Havok Pro SC and I wasn't overly impressed. I couldn't get great speed without bumping up the timing into the 30% range which then made everything run hot and would activate the Havok's thermal protection while the motor got into the 150 degree range. I stumbled on a used RX8 that same night and it made a huge difference! Phenomenal speed and both esc and motor in the 105 degree temperature range. Durango 4wd SC.

12-03-2011, 09:01 AM/TEKIN PREZ: It is not just a marketing claim to get you to buy Tekin. We want you to get the best performance possible from the motor. With 1/10 motors the differences are more subtle, but with the 4pole motors the differences are significant.


Then there is the claim that you "must use a 1:8 controller" with the Pro 4

old&slow

iTrader: (2)

Tekin it seems you have come into someone elses yard and have started throwing stones.

Sure it is always welcome and appreciated to come with usefull and informative info that we all appreciate and can learn from to further grow our hobby and allow your industries to prosper , but we have yet to see any such info from you . Just the" it is all your fault "postings.

Sure each of you mfg ,design and build your products first and foremost to function to the level you have set for your product with your own components and then maybe some even look to verify compatability with other vendors offerings. It seems like such a small industry with so few offerings in each catagory that it would make sense for all to do these tests.

The real standard of committment to the hobby and to its customers and other vendors in this small industry is the follow up that comes when a issue is found. All of the major players in this esc / motor game has had /have major issues with thier offerings at one point or another. Just read the threads for each of them on this fourm

Novak was informed of the issue and quickly went out and activly reaserched the issue, identified the issue with both theirs and the other vendors product, and then created and shared a fix to offer to both yours and their customers a option to run these products problem free.

We have seen nothing like this from tekin. Yes ,you know of issue , you have not even by your own account gone out and tested your motor with their esc to try and identify the issue. It does not seem like it would be a large investment to go out and buy one esc and test in your facility to try and locate the issue. You have yet to modify( or even admit that your motor could be modified )your product to be more compatable with what is out on the market. You have just sat there and said it works with ours ,yours must be inferior. Then even had the disrespect to throw in a below the belt, punk ass jab about it not being a free downloadable fix. At least they have done the due diligence to create a fix , you have not even offered to find a fix to offer with your uber great hot wire. Great customer service to your customers who have these combos that are showing the issues. Really shows your where vested commitment is directed ... your bottom end fiscal results

Novak has shown a true commitment to their customers and yours, and a true commitment to the hobby in trying to find a cure with a compatability issue. Compatability issues that have plauged the e-power sector in the years past which has been one of the main issues of the slower growth of e power in earlier years. A commitment to solve a potentially expensive situation for someone with both these costly components. Your customer as well as theirs remember? They too could have rested on their laurels and simply stated as your actions have shown "go buy a different compnent" ours works with ours must be a bad part by them.

So kudos to Novak for their due diligence in this issue and well maybe a lesson to tekin on what real customer service and commitment to the hobby is really about .

O&S

P.S.

I run both novak and tekin and castle.

I have a havok pro sc x drive / ballistic 550 4.5 in my sc 10 4x, one of the most smoothest running combos I have driven.

I run a castle mmm/2650 in a losi 8ight buggy that i run on large out door tracks that is simply a brute with power and has been a model of dependability in the 2 yrs that i have had it minus the fans.

I also have a rx8 / ballistic 8 combo in my indoor prepped 8ight that is very close to being as smooth as a combo as the 1/10 scale havok and is probably as close to being the perfect indoor combo as I have been able to use.

So I have had nothing but good luck with all 3 of the "biggies" and really dont hold any prejudices towards any of the vendoors

jamr1130

iTrader: (120)

Originally Posted by Tekin Prez View Post
We simply do not see anything in our testing, but we are not using your controller.

Let me first state that I am both a fan of Novak and Tekin products. I fly no banners exclusively.
+1 on Ramn post.
I don't know if I was the 1st to post this issue on this thread but I know that I had exchanged a number of posts and pms with NovakTwo about it. After that NovakTwo was good about updating their findings on it. Ultimately Novak picked up a Pro4 motor to test the esc and came up with a fix of a new brain board for the new Havoc x-drive esc. Regardless if some like or dislike the fact of having to buy, exchange their esc for a new esc as a fix the fact is Novak addressed the issue and made changes to their product to help those wanting to run the Pro4.

I was also going to post on the Tekin Pro4 thread but searched and saw that others had posed this issue. The only responses I read were short like "...it will thermal" or "...I wouldn't do that" or something to the effect of it would be best to use the RX8 as it is a perfect match to the Pro4. Not one answer of anyone looking further into it. But now TekinPrez has the time to post a few rather lengthy defensive posts on this thread because his feathers got ruffled over wording "noisy signals" in Novak's findings. Hell they didn't say the Pro4 was an inferior product and it won't work too bad move on. Novak found what they believe to be the issue and fixed their own product to adapt. Kudos on Novak. I know I can't expect a company to have to check their competitor's equipment functionality with their own. But Novak did with the Pro4 as there was a known issue.

snellemin

iTrader: (16)

I own a bunch of motors and a few good and not so good ESC's. After reading all this crying about the Pro 4 not working with one ESC only(Novak), I went ahead and installed the Pro4 Wye 4600kv motor to older 1/10 ESC's.


First the Pro 4 is nothing magical compared to my other 2 and 4 pole 540 size motors that I have.
Second the 2 Delta wound Pro4 motors don't need timing. And if you do use it, only use 5 degrees. Otherwise you just end up overheating your equipment.

I stuck the Pro4 4600 in the RCM CRT.5, geared 46/17. ESC was the old 1/10 ZTW ESC and a old school Quark SSB. Timing was set at normal. I was able to creep with the motor with the sensor enabled. That tells me that Novak just need their firmware tweaked to run the 4 pole motor properly, when an old Chinese ESC can work the motor. Novak fixed the issue with a hardware change and not a simple firmware tweak. So the issue was bigger and more costly for Novak to be compatible with a simple 4 pole 540 sensored motor that isn't any different from an old school sensored 1406 Aveox. Lesson learn for Novak.

I also own the 4 pole Ballistic 8 motor, and it's superior to the Tekin when it comes to build quality. Novak heavy duty sensor board is also a lot better compared to anybody else on the market right now. I know this, because I take nearly all my motors and esc's apart to see if my money was well spent.

Novak has a a variety of 1/10 brushless esc's and Tekin just 2 dated ones. Tekin can make the RSPRO work with their Pro4 motors with just a new case design, but instead opt to just bank on their easily manufactured RX8. Or maybe they have something in the works and keeping in low.

So both Tekin and Novak have their pros and cons, when it comes to certain hardware that they put on the market.

escman

I only made changes to the firmware, no hardware change! I have implemented this change in the GTB II firmware also.
Adnan

mattnin

iTrader: (44)

I've been running a Tekin Pro4 4000kv with a GTB2. After 6 minute main the esc comes off at 95f and motor 145f using a 12t pinion in a SCTE. The GTB2 is an impressive little speed control. I've had no issues running the 4 pole and it is a sportsman spec rated esc. Here is a link to my build with my GTB2 & Pro4 3300kv and 4000kv experiences . http://www.rcshortcourse.com/forum/l...-rtr-scte.html

macdude

iTrader: (6)

I have not seen this. I run the T8 motor with a Mamba Pro and will not run it in sensored only mode. It just gets too hot. And there is significant performance drop. Run times are reduced and keeping the whole system cool is a problem.
This summer I tried to help a couple of guys out that were trying to run their 4x4sc10's using the pro4 motor and mamba pro. Each fried 2 mamba pros before switching to the LRP esc. They had no luck with these either as they also fried. They ended up with a RX8 because they couldn't figure out the problem. At the time I had not thought about sensored only being a problem. But they were running in sensored only mode. If the signal is noisy and it is causing the esc to fire the wrong sequence then that explains why they had so many problems before switching to the rx8. And if it happened to only one esc then maybe it's some other issue, but to have 6 escs die trying to run your motor..... its probably a motor design problem.

Mxer59

iTrader: (114)

I have also ran a pro4 motor, paired it with a mmp. Nothing but issues so I just went back to Novak in my opionion Novak is the most reliable Esc and motor I have ever ran, Mamba I have fried two Esc, Tekin my Esc just died after 2 weeks. I plan on switching my buggy as soon as there 1/8 Esc realesed

Team RTS

iTrader: (1)

Wheres Tekin now?

mrbirchum

iTrader: (1)

I finally got the Pro4 4600 hooked up with my new Havoc with Xdrive. Big thanks to Novak for working with me on getting an updated ESC after I reported my problems with this combo. Also had to get a replacement motor from Tekin. One or the other caused both sensor boards to go up in smoke. Tekin's return process was OK, but their paperwork seems a little less user friendly than Novak's.

This doesn't seem too customer friendly to me. Quoting from their website, italics are theirs not mine:

Any items sent in without the proper documentation/information will not be serviced. We will not contact you and ask for the required paperwork or for information requested that you leave blank. Items sent in incorrectly will be held as unclaimed property for 60 days before being considered abandonded (sic)

Anyhow, I ran this Ford engine/Chevy transmission combo on the street tonight, and I have to say that Pro4 has some serious cojones. Truck was super fast, and brakes were stop-on-a-dime quick. After playing around for about 7 minutes of mostly wide open, the motor temped at about 100, while the ESC was more like 120. Battery drain seemed a bit higher than my Ballistic 550 5.5.

Running in the street means nothing compared to the track, but so far so good. I'm guessing this combo will be quicker, but hotter and with less battery life than the Ballastic on the track.

FWIW, I tested with an SC10 4x4 with 13/62 gearing, no timing, 60 degree outside temp.

escman

When we ran a Mamba Pro with the Pro 4 motor in our engineering lab we saw very high current draw also, normally that setup should have been half that current level.
Thanks for the information.
Adnan

escman

Our speed control should never damage the sensor board.
The three hall input on the esc are very low power inputs and they are not able to source much current to do any damage.
The red power wire that supply the hall sensor is current limited, the likely hood of esc causing damage to the hall sensor is low. When we see damage to the sensor in our motor it's typically caused by one of the coils making contact with the sensor circuit board and that only happens if you smoke the motor.
Anytime a motor does draw a that high of current and one has to be very careful not to damage the batteries.