54LikesRC10B4/T4 Forum
01-13-2007, 10:35 AM
#1681
Tech Regular
nobody makes a gd rear pin-retainer that makes the rear toe-in 0-deg, gdit! lol
01-13-2007, 10:57 AM
#1682
Tech Addict
Racers Edge makes blocks that add toe, up to 2deg. I believe. You could run them on the wrong side to take toe out.
01-22-2007, 01:43 PM
#1683
Tech Regular
not going to spend $15 for something that wont get it down to zero, mights well get gt2 blocks and flip them for $5 :P
01-22-2007, 03:32 PM
#1684
Originally Posted by Darkshinobi
nobody makes a gd rear pin-retainer that makes the rear toe-in 0-deg, gdit! lol
lol "gdit"?????Anyways, I tried out the GT2 rear hubs this weekend (didn't get a change to last week). And they seem to work very well, I flipped them for 1.5* toe in since I'm running on carpet. I used the regular GT2 big bearings and my old bearings on the inside. The CVD's needed two extra thin shims to eliminate play, but the big thing with the GT2 carriers is that they make the truck about 3mm (1/8") wider on each side! So you have to get rid of the nice big flat axle washers that come on the T4 to get the right width, I just left them on to get a bit more stability, and then shimmed out the front wheels a bit as well. If the axles aren't shimmed to reduce width though I think the axles will pop out of the outdrives if you running offroad. Also the GT2 rear hub camber link holes are the same height but the holes are now farther out, the inner two holes on the GT2 hubs are equivalent to the outer two holes on the T4 carriers. Also you can't adjust the wheelbase with the GT2 carriers unless you cut them down.
Ease of installation: 4/5
Fittament: 3 or 4/5 (depending on your setups)
Parts needed are:
#7932 rear hubs 1.5*
#7933 bearing crush tubes
#7368 axle shims
#7935 Bearing, .187 x .500 x .196"
The only downside I can see is that once the outdoor season rolls around for me I don't really know if 4.5* of rear toe in will work that well, but the durability I can forsee from the massive bearings is definately needed for some of the crazy 1/8th style layouts we run on up here. Mabye AE will release 0* hubs?
Last edited by WheelNut; 01-22-2007 at 03:43 PM.
01-23-2007, 05:49 AM
#1685
Tech Regular
hopefully 0-deg hubs will come out, or i can find some plastic 3-deg hubs and flip um
01-24-2007, 12:34 PM
#1688
no bus goes within 3/4 of a mile of the track, cabs cost too much (if i had enough for that every week i could fix my real car...lol)
just found a friend that i didn't know was into rc, but in the airplane type, so i have a consistent ride (trucks only race every other week here)
just got back to racing this tuesday, and bought a co27 for the main, which had alot more power then what i was running, turned out to almost hurt more, because it gave me alot more push on the carpet oval.
so dropped the front down to 40wt from 60wt just need to find 1 green cooper's front, if anyone has one and wants to trade for a plaid blue/green front lmk, ill pay for shipping.
just found a friend that i didn't know was into rc, but in the airplane type, so i have a consistent ride (trucks only race every other week here)
just got back to racing this tuesday, and bought a co27 for the main, which had alot more power then what i was running, turned out to almost hurt more, because it gave me alot more push on the carpet oval.
so dropped the front down to 40wt from 60wt just need to find 1 green cooper's front, if anyone has one and wants to trade for a plaid blue/green front lmk, ill pay for shipping.
01-25-2007, 03:32 PM
#1690
Tech Addict
iTrader: (2)
mharlow: here's what charlie perez has to say about it. he's a factory sponsored driver and gives great setup explainations. oh yeah, he's pretty fast too 
The front and rear tie rod lengths will affect your vehicle differently. On the front, 1-B (longer tie rod) will give you more steering as you exit the corner. 1-A will give you a less steering as you exit the corner and a little more as you enter the corner. To me the "A" camber link position makes the steering inconsistent throughout the whole corner. It comes in good, pushes in the middle, and then comes out hard. It is hard for me to get use to this handling but maybe it will work for you. In the rear if you shorten the camber link it will give you more side bite and less forward traction. If you lengthen it, it will give you more forward traction and less side. When the camber link is the same length, and you move whole link in or out compared to the center line of the chassis, you are changing the camber link pivot point distance as it compares to the A-arm hinge pin pivot points. This changes "Where" in the suspension travel the camber starts to change. When the camber link pivot points are close to the A-arm pivot points there is a very steady and linier change of camber as the suspension is compressed. This gives the car a very neutral and non-speed sensitive handling characteristics. When the camber link pivot pints are further away from the A-arm pivot points this makes the camber change more dramatically at the start of the suspension compression or at the end. This makes the car more finicky on corner entry and exit speed and can be harder to drive if you don't enter and or exit the corners at the same speed lap after lap. The best way to think about camber link adjustments is to break it into two different aspects. (1) Camber change magnitude and (2) Camber change path through out the suspension travel. When you add and remove washers under the camber link ball studs you are changing #1 above. When you change the camber link length or camber link position you are changing #2 above. I consider a #2 as a major change as it will usually effect the handling greatly. I consider a #1 a minor change as it usually only applies minute handling effects. 99% of the time I usually run 2-B with one washer in the front and 1-B with 2 washers in the rear and add or take away a washer here or there to fine tune.
The front and rear tie rod lengths will affect your vehicle differently. On the front, 1-B (longer tie rod) will give you more steering as you exit the corner. 1-A will give you a less steering as you exit the corner and a little more as you enter the corner. To me the "A" camber link position makes the steering inconsistent throughout the whole corner. It comes in good, pushes in the middle, and then comes out hard. It is hard for me to get use to this handling but maybe it will work for you. In the rear if you shorten the camber link it will give you more side bite and less forward traction. If you lengthen it, it will give you more forward traction and less side. When the camber link is the same length, and you move whole link in or out compared to the center line of the chassis, you are changing the camber link pivot point distance as it compares to the A-arm hinge pin pivot points. This changes "Where" in the suspension travel the camber starts to change. When the camber link pivot points are close to the A-arm pivot points there is a very steady and linier change of camber as the suspension is compressed. This gives the car a very neutral and non-speed sensitive handling characteristics. When the camber link pivot pints are further away from the A-arm pivot points this makes the camber change more dramatically at the start of the suspension compression or at the end. This makes the car more finicky on corner entry and exit speed and can be harder to drive if you don't enter and or exit the corners at the same speed lap after lap. The best way to think about camber link adjustments is to break it into two different aspects. (1) Camber change magnitude and (2) Camber change path through out the suspension travel. When you add and remove washers under the camber link ball studs you are changing #1 above. When you change the camber link length or camber link position you are changing #2 above. I consider a #2 as a major change as it will usually effect the handling greatly. I consider a #1 a minor change as it usually only applies minute handling effects. 99% of the time I usually run 2-B with one washer in the front and 1-B with 2 washers in the rear and add or take away a washer here or there to fine tune.
01-25-2007, 06:46 PM
#1691
Adam, Charlie has a good expanation of the function of the adjustments. I can add a few things in easy terms to understand also.
Since roll centers are measurments to determine the chassis' direction or movement around the suspension as it is used....
The relationship of angle in the upper link and lower arm determines the static roll center. The length of the link determines how much the roll center moves, or migrates up and down(mostly). The location of the pivot points(in or out) determines how much it migrates left and right(mostly). This is how I remember it, it has been a while since I busted out a book on suspension.
So all three things effect roll centers, the difference is how they effect it.
This is where trial and error come in since different people "sometimes" like a different feel, or "think" they feel something different at least.
When in doubt, run what the world or national champion run in their AE set up, I think they have it figured out pretty well, this is probably the reason I haven't opened up my suspension books in a while. LOL
...Jim
Since roll centers are measurments to determine the chassis' direction or movement around the suspension as it is used....
The relationship of angle in the upper link and lower arm determines the static roll center. The length of the link determines how much the roll center moves, or migrates up and down(mostly). The location of the pivot points(in or out) determines how much it migrates left and right(mostly). This is how I remember it, it has been a while since I busted out a book on suspension.
So all three things effect roll centers, the difference is how they effect it.
This is where trial and error come in since different people "sometimes" like a different feel, or "think" they feel something different at least.
When in doubt, run what the world or national champion run in their AE set up, I think they have it figured out pretty well, this is probably the reason I haven't opened up my suspension books in a while. LOL
...Jim
01-31-2007, 07:27 PM
#1692
What are the actual differences between the T4 truck and B4 buggy? It looks like they are essentially the same with the truck having longer/wider A arms & suspension.
Is the conversion easy if one wanted to go back and forth?
Is the conversion easy if one wanted to go back and forth?
01-31-2007, 07:48 PM
#1694
Originally Posted by jbrow1
T4 has a longer chassis as well I believe. Also has longer front shocks. You'd probably have more into shocks, arms, cvd's, chassis, bodies, than you would if you just bought a $100 roller off ebay or the sale forums here.