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Losi 1/10 TEN-SCTE ARR 4x4 Short Course Truck Thread

Old 07-25-2012, 01:34 PM
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Default Which is a better setup

Which is a better setup between these two MMP with 2400KV or STOCK Losi scte ESC & 2800KV motor.
THANKS
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Old 07-25-2012, 01:40 PM
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Originally Posted by vasidudu View Post
So here is my question(eventually... Sorry for all the blabla but really felt I actually had a whole better car today... A happy dude ;-)

What would change in the actual truck behavior if I was to change from timing 10 to 0 and "replace" with punch control from 100% to 80%?
Would the whole ESC / motor / battery get hotter?

Am I better off tweaking timing or punch control?

What is the actual difference between punch control and timing? I do get both are relating to "over clocking" the whole system but I do not see the difference.

Finally, would I get the same punch going from to a 17T to 19T?
Punch control has nothing to do with "over clocking" (whatever that is?).

Punch control limits how fast the motor will spool up. The higher the punch control number the great the limit on spool up (meaning how fast the RPM can change in a given interval of time). Someone else said this before but possibly a language barrier is keeping you from understanding the meaning of our statements. I just don't know how else to say it.

IMHO, you have too big a pinion for 3S with the 2400. I run a 13 and a buddy of mine runs a 14 on the 2400 on 3S. Our motors do not get hot and our cars run just as fast as the guys with Pro4 4600 motors on 2S.
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Old 07-25-2012, 01:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Ralph289 View Post
Which is a better setup between these two MMP with 2400KV or STOCK Losi scte ESC & 2800KV motor.
THANKS
AFAIK, the two ESCs are identical. But I believe the Castle 2400 uses higher quality components (yes, I know both motors are made by Castle) and is more efficient. But the KV being lower, you need 3S to take advantage of the higher efficiency. If you are stuck with 2S, I would say use the Losi version of the motor.
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Old 07-25-2012, 01:50 PM
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Originally Posted by ta_man View Post
Punch control has nothing to do with "over clocking" (whatever that is?).

Punch control limits how fast the motor will spool up. The higher the punch control number the great the limit on spool up (meaning how fast the RPM can change in a given interval of time). Someone else said this before but possibly a language barrier is keeping you from understanding the meaning of our statements. I just don't know how else to say it.

IMHO, you have too big a pinion for 3S with the 2400. I run a 13 and a buddy of mine runs a 14 on the 2400 on 3S. Our motors do not get hot and our cars run just as fast as the guys with Pro4 4600 motors on 2S.
Thanks the info .

I will try to go to a 15 and see.

How about the timing?

Cheers,
V
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Old 07-25-2012, 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Nathanio View Post



I think 3 or 4s really is the way to go with these 4x4 SCTs imo with a lower Kv 2500-3000Kv. Lower current draw, smaller batteries can be used and should keep heat under control. 1/8th scale eBuggies/Truggies should really be 6s and not 4s in the 1600-1900Kv range as well.
Yea I'd agree with that, even with regard to 540 sized. Some of those low turn motors can draw allot of amps. imo better to go low kv and high voltage. I've got a 2s lipo 5300mah and is rated 50c. cost per watt on that battery is nearly twice the 3s 5a/h 35c.

So higher volts is more "efficient" on my wallet too
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Old 07-25-2012, 02:04 PM
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Originally Posted by nitsuj View Post
Yea I'd agree with that, even with regard to 540 sized. Some of those low turn motors can draw allot of amps. imo better to go low kv and high voltage. I've got a 2s lipo 5300mah and is rated 50c. cost per watt on that battery is nearly twice the 3s 5a/h 35c.

So higher volts is more "efficient" on my wallet too
Whats the max you can go on a 2s 40c continuous 80 burst battery? Is the pro4 4600 out of the question?
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Old 07-25-2012, 02:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Grandturk View Post
What's everyone using for Shock o rings? I'm due to replace mine. Don't really want to buy two shock rebuild kits and throw away everything but the o-rings.

I've heard some folks using the o rings from the 22 shocks. Any other ideas?
I haven't done it yet, but based on one of Caspers or maybe Chris A. posts a while back, I picked up the losi 22 low friction o-rings. However based on the thread you needed a 3.5x7x1mm or 1.5mm spacer to put in it as well. I have the parts at home, and I would double check in this thread, but I think there were

TLR5074 Team Losi Racing Low Friction Shock Shaft O-Rings (8)
TLR5096 Team Losi Racing 3.5mm Shock Shaft Limiter Set (TLR 22)
(the shim set has multiple sizes, Not sure if there is 4 of the same or just 2 in, haven't checked yet)
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Old 07-25-2012, 02:37 PM
  #37583  
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Originally Posted by vasidudu View Post
The only HUGE difference is I had set the dead band on the ESC on a very small value 0.0500s instead of 0.1000 as default >>> Much more control on start up, more punch in the mid RPM (clearing small triples not a problem). I had also smoothed the throttle curve in the soft. With the previous dead band set at 0.1000 it felt like I had no real control over how the truck would act at startup and on jumps.

What would change in the actual truck behavior if I was to change from timing 10 to 0 and "replace" with punch control from 100% to 80%?
Would the whole ESC / motor / battery get hotter?

Am I better off tweaking timing or punch control?

What is the actual difference between punch control and timing? I do get both are relating to "over clocking" the whole system but I do not see the difference.

Finally, would I get the same punch going from to a 17T to 19T?
Throttle dead band is basically how much you have to pull trigger or push brake for the esc to notice it; it will disregard smaller values as neutral. Its main purpose is to compensate for the play int the radio throttle mechanism; with a good radio it should be set low.

Timing is simply put how soon the the esc will put voltage to the coils driving the motor; generally lower values mean better efficiency and runtimes, while higher values mean more speed and even more current draw.

Punch control on the other hand limits how fast the esc reacts to throttle commands; if you pull the throttle quickly it will act as if you had pulled it slower, so it is only useful if you (like me ) have a trigger happy finger.
First I would lower the timing and playing with punch control is depending on your throttle finger.

Last but not least what do you mean by smoothing out the throttle curve? By default it is linear AFAIK.
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Old 07-25-2012, 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by mysupratoy94 View Post
Whats the max you can go on a 2s 40c continuous 80 burst battery? Is the pro4 4600 out of the question?
It depends on the capacity of the battery; you have to multiply it with the C rating to see how much current it can deliver. The Pro4 can draw up to 175Amps, so a very good 5000mAh 40c might be enough, but I would not really trust it. If you run an RX8 with that motor setting the current limiter to 60-70% would help a lot with no noticeable performance loss.
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Old 07-25-2012, 02:46 PM
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Originally Posted by dtr View Post
It depends on the capacity of the battery; you have to multiply it with the C rating to see how much current it can deliver. The Pro4 can draw up to 175Amps, so a very good 5000mAh 40c might be enough, but I would not really trust it. If you run an RX8 with that motor setting the current limiter to 60-70% would help a lot with no noticeable performance loss.
Yes I do plan on running the RX8 with that motor, thanks for the help.
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Old 07-25-2012, 03:00 PM
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Originally Posted by dtr View Post
Throttle dead band is basically how much you have to pull trigger or push brake for the esc to notice it; it will disregard smaller values as neutral. Its main purpose is to compensate for the play int the radio throttle mechanism; with a good radio it should be set low.

Timing is simply put how soon the the esc will put voltage to the coils driving the motor; generally lower values mean better efficiency and runtimes, while higher values mean more speed and even more current draw.

Punch control on the other hand limits how fast the esc reacts to throttle commands; if you pull the throttle quickly it will act as if you had pulled it slower, so it is only useful if you (like me ) have a trigger happy finger.
First I would lower the timing and playing with punch control is depending on your throttle finger.

Last but not least what do you mean by smoothing out the throttle curve? By default it is linear AFAIK.



Actually mine is not linear anymore. Looks more like a curve going up.

How about that other setting called something like punch or on power start (not sure now...). Has 3 settings: high medim and low?

Will indeed go to a 15T, switch timimg off and play with punch control.

Thx for your answer.
V
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Old 07-25-2012, 03:06 PM
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Originally Posted by vasidudu View Post
Ran with following setup:
MMP SCT 2400kv 3s 35C 17T
Track is like here.
Ran about 19/20' with throttle EPA to 80%
Timing at default on ESC 10
Punch control at 100%
Motor came out hot (will temp it next time but not worrying) as I was really pushing it (lots of wheel spinning as it is a brand new track in various ways).

The only HUGE difference is I had set the dead band on the ESC on a very small value 0.0500s instead of 0.1000 as default >>> Much more control on start up, more punch in the mid RPM (clearing small triples not a problem). I had also smoothed the throttle curve in the soft. With the previous dead band set at 0.1000 it felt like I had no real control over how the truck would act at startup and on jumps.

All in all pretty amazed at how much a little tweak can really change the way the truck handled.

So here is my question(eventually... Sorry for all the blabla but really felt I actually had a whole better car today... A happy dude ;-)

What would change in the actual truck behavior if I was to change from timing 10 to 0 and "replace" with punch control from 100% to 80%?
Would the whole ESC / motor / battery get hotter?

Am I better off tweaking timing or punch control?

What is the actual difference between punch control and timing? I do get both are relating to "over clocking" the whole system but I do not see the difference.

Finally, would I get the same punch going from to a 17T to 19T?

I do appreciate any advice or tips on this set up as I am liking it. We have no class restriction on this track and others around.

I also have a 3800kv which I have had not much time to see what the little can has in it... Keep reading good stuff about it tough.

Enjoy the day,
I did,
V
if youre running a 3s system your punch should not need turned down a ton.

when you run a 2s 3800 youll want the punch to be at 30% or less.

punch allows the truck instant acceleration, 'punch control' is reducing the acceleration.

if you put in the 3800 just try the timing at 0 and punch at 30 to start and see the difference. it's all about finding what you like.
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Old 07-25-2012, 03:23 PM
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Originally Posted by vasidudu View Post
[/B]

Actually mine is not linear anymore. Looks more like a curve going up.

How about that other setting called something like punch or on power start (not sure now...). Has 3 settings: high medim and low?

Will indeed go to a 15T, switch timimg off and play with punch control.

Thx for your answer.
V
I haven't played with that setting, but from the description here you should only play with it if you do not like how it starts from a dead stop.
I see your point with smoothness of the throttle curve; I think of smoothness as how well the motor speed follows my finger.
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Old 07-25-2012, 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by dtr View Post
I haven't played with that setting, but from the description here you should only play with it if you do not like how it starts from a dead stop.
I see your point with smoothness of the throttle curve; I think of smoothness as how well the motor speed follows my finger.
Yep, that's exactly what I was after, along with the dead band feature.

For the throttle curve, I transformed it from its original linear shape to a more curved one. Same for the brake curve.

All in all, this changed a lot for my driving style. I like to approach an obstacle and go over just with a blip. Before changing these settings, the truck would not have been as controllable 1) just before the jump and 2) once in the air. And basically from a dead stop. Considering the added weight of the 2400 and 3s. I think I am going to increase that curve a little more with a 15T though.

Should timing be then left at default (10) and then I could start tweaking punch control?

What's the word on that?
Best,
V
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Old 07-25-2012, 05:36 PM
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Just bought another roller today, time to start all over again. Hopefully tlr does not come out with a version of this truck or ill be pissed... lol! Has anyone heard anything about tlr coming out with a version of this truck? I don't see what they could do besides selling it with optional parts already on the truck? FEEDBACK PLEASE!!!!!!!
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