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TLR 22 Racing Buggy Thread

Old 06-09-2011, 09:56 PM
  #7501  
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Looking for some toe block advice:
Switched from the stock 4.0 lrc to the 3.5 lrc and like it was said before, the car seems to rotate more in the middle to end of the turn so it seems a lot looser on a outdoor loose track. Just not sure what to try. Shoud i try the 3.5 hrc to see if its better than 4.o or should i try 4.0 hrc to see. Could go back to stock just wondering if there would be something better. I guess the question is what would i notice with changing from lrc to hrc as i would imagine the amount of toe would have the same effect either in hrc or lrc.

Also what role does antisquat play in rear end rotation? if any? Thought of lowering it from 2.5 to 1 or o for outside.

Other than that i have been running the evans setup. ANy help would be great.
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Old 06-09-2011, 10:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Corey Bernardo
22/84 and or 23/84

I like to use a bigger spur to push the motor further back....
Looking at amain.com, I don't see an 84-tooth specifically for the 22. Can I use one for the XXX-CR (like part # LOSA3985) or something else?
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Old 06-09-2011, 10:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Dog Runner
Looking at amain.com, I don't see an 84-tooth specifically for the 22. Can I use one for the XXX-CR (like part # LOSA3985) or something else?
Yes, the xxx series spur gears are the same.
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Old 06-10-2011, 12:25 AM
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Originally Posted by dbracn
Looking for some toe block advice:
Switched from the stock 4.0 lrc to the 3.5 lrc and like it was said before, the car seems to rotate more in the middle to end of the turn so it seems a lot looser on a outdoor loose track. Just not sure what to try. Shoud i try the 3.5 hrc to see if its better than 4.o or should i try 4.0 hrc to see. Could go back to stock just wondering if there would be something better. I guess the question is what would i notice with changing from lrc to hrc as i would imagine the amount of toe would have the same effect either in hrc or lrc.

Also what role does antisquat play in rear end rotation? if any? Thought of lowering it from 2.5 to 1 or o for outside.

Other than that i have been running the evans setup. ANy help would be great.
Maybe try moving rear hubs forward soften up the rear shocks little weight... Lots can help it has at our track.
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Old 06-10-2011, 07:51 AM
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Originally Posted by dbracn
Looking for some toe block advice:
Switched from the stock 4.0 lrc to the 3.5 lrc and like it was said before, the car seems to rotate more in the middle to end of the turn so it seems a lot looser on a outdoor loose track. Just not sure what to try. Shoud i try the 3.5 hrc to see if its better than 4.o or should i try 4.0 hrc to see. Could go back to stock just wondering if there would be something better. I guess the question is what would i notice with changing from lrc to hrc as i would imagine the amount of toe would have the same effect either in hrc or lrc.

Also what role does antisquat play in rear end rotation? if any? Thought of lowering it from 2.5 to 1 or o for outside.

Other than that i have been running the evans setup. ANy help would be great.
If you are on a very loose track and are searching for rear end stability, the 4.0 LRC (stock) toe block is the one to use. You ask what you would notice going form the lrc to the hrc... your immediate difference would be a slightly looser rear end due to less roll at the rear of the car.

Anti-squat, combined with front droop, affect how much traction you develop at the rear of the car ON-throttle. So if the rear end of your car is loose when getting back on the throttle at the end of a corner, drop your antiquat closer to 0, and add a little droop in the front (remove limiters, un-turn shock eyelets). Also, run a larger spur gear to push the motor farther back.
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Old 06-10-2011, 08:35 AM
  #7506  
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Originally Posted by dbracn
Looking for some toe block advice:
.
I tried the 5-degree LRC with 0 anti-squat, hubs forward, and 1A camber link with zero shims on the outer hub and 3mm under the inner ballstud. I know this is a departure from the Evans setup people are using, but I'm liking it. It feels very locked down. Give it a try maybe.
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Old 06-10-2011, 08:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Cpt.America
If you are on a very loose track and are searching for rear end stability, the 4.0 LRC (stock) toe block is the one to use. You ask what you would notice going form the lrc to the hrc... your immediate difference would be a slightly looser rear end due to less roll at the rear of the car.
I wonder why people are going with HRC with mid mounts then....
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Old 06-10-2011, 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by hacker
I wonder why people are going with HRC with mid mounts then....
I would guess that on carpet you are trying to get the rear end to rotate as much as you can. The HRC in my experience does not hurt fwd bite just allows the rear end to rotate through the corner more. So with mid motors giving more steering as the goal is getting the rear end to rotate under extreme traction conditions I could see HRC being popular for those types of tracks. Now if you are running mid motor in less then ideal conditions LRC might be better to help lock in the rear end of the car since traction is not ideal and you don't have the weight back there to help.
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Old 06-10-2011, 08:55 AM
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You want a higher roll center with a mid motor car than a rear motor. You will not end up with the same setups with each motor orientation. In fact not much at all would be the same between them if done properly.
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Old 06-10-2011, 09:03 AM
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can somebody post corey's set up sheet again please. I saved the first one but its blank. Don't have the patience to go through and find it again.
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Old 06-10-2011, 09:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Cpt.America
If you are on a very loose track and are searching for rear end stability, the 4.0 LRC (stock) toe block is the one to use. You ask what you would notice going form the lrc to the hrc... your immediate difference would be a slightly looser rear end due to less roll at the rear of the car.

Anti-squat, combined with front droop, affect how much traction you develop at the rear of the car ON-throttle. So if the rear end of your car is loose when getting back on the throttle at the end of a corner, drop your antiquat closer to 0, and add a little droop in the front (remove limiters, un-turn shock eyelets). Also, run a larger spur gear to push the motor farther back.

The BIGGEST thing I want to point out inthe above statement and what you are asking is the capitals he used ON THROTTLE. These will not have as much of an effect off throttle, off throttle you are better moving hubs, changing links, shock package changes...FYI
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Old 06-10-2011, 09:53 AM
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Originally Posted by hacker07
The BIGGEST thing I want to point out inthe above statement and what you are asking is the capitals he used ON THROTTLE. These will not have as much of an effect off throttle, off throttle you are better moving hubs, changing links, shock package changes...FYI
correct.. Off-throttle rear traction is done differently.. typically with front kick up and rear droop.
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Old 06-10-2011, 11:23 AM
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More droop. I'm interested in getting more droop in the front. Has anyone removed the limiters in the front shocks? I believe I've read on here that it's not recommended.

I've also read about unscrewing the front shock bottoms two turns.

advice?
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Old 06-10-2011, 11:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Casper
I would guess that on carpet you are trying to get the rear end to rotate as much as you can. The HRC in my experience does not hurt fwd bite just allows the rear end to rotate through the corner more. So with mid motors giving more steering as the goal is getting the rear end to rotate under extreme traction conditions I could see HRC being popular for those types of tracks. Now if you are running mid motor in less then ideal conditions LRC might be better to help lock in the rear end of the car since traction is not ideal and you don't have the weight back there to help.
This is very much true. The Schumacher mini pins tires we run are very grippy on carpet and I generally fight with a push as soon as I hit the apex and coming out of the corner. I had new tires on the rear last night and I'm running 3.5 HRC block and could probably go to 3.0 HRC. We compensate by running the car stiffer than you would on dirt or clay. I'm running pink or red springs in the rear on the outer position in rear tower, long wheelbase, etc.

Opposite of many things mentioned here already for gaining traction when exiting a corner. Last night I tested with 0 degree castor blocks with the 25 degree kickup shim and although it did feel like it had more steering exiting the corner I lost ALOT of steering entering the corner. I was down to an orange spring, 22.5 wt oil and 56x4 pistons. I prefer the 5 degree blocks for now. I actually may even go back to 10 degree blocks with 20 degree kickup as I haven't tried that since the first night with the car.
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Old 06-10-2011, 11:51 AM
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Originally Posted by elas
More droop. I'm interested in getting more droop in the front. Has anyone removed the limiters in the front shocks? I believe I've read on here that it's not recommended.

I've also read about unscrewing the front shock bottoms two turns.

advice?
For the rear you can un-thread it two turns.
for the front i would stick to the 2mm under the piston any less and it seems to make the car harder to drive. When i first built the kit i forgot to put any shims in the front shocks so ive tried it both ways
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