How long before this technology can be used at a track?
09-30-2010, 10:29 PM
#17
Get real, go back to the early 90's when you payed $80 for a 1200mah battery that you could run once a day if you wanted it to live, meaning you had to have 4 packs to get through the day if planned to practice at all. Then run zero practice laps before the race because you were lucky to make a 4 min. main with a mod motor that would be as fast as a modern day 27t. Still gonna tell me lipos are crappy.. you must be young......
But hey, thanks for the lesson sonny-boy.
I'm still waiting a a good leap in battery technology, sure we have better tech then what we once did, but so we should, its been 30 odd years, and that's no reason to think we have some reached the pinnacle of battery evolution,quite the opposite,we have been lead down a dead end.
We do have smaller longer lasting batteries but they are as volatile as ever, if they do become unstable they are hard to extinguish, they don't have amazing run times, they still take a fair amount of time to charge, and they die when the voltage runs past their "safe" point.
All in all pretty damn crappy.
09-30-2010, 10:40 PM
#18
You need to remember that as battery technology evolved, so did the power hungry requirements of the fast setups that a lot of us run. Go run a new LiPo in your old Super Champ and see how far beyond 5 minutes you get.
I'm not really sure what you expect? You obviously don't have a clue as to what's going to be the next technology, yet claim LiPo is so "crappy". Get out there and come up with the next big thing if you are so unhappy with the current products.
I'm not really sure what you expect? You obviously don't have a clue as to what's going to be the next technology, yet claim LiPo is so "crappy". Get out there and come up with the next big thing if you are so unhappy with the current products.
09-30-2010, 10:41 PM
#19
36, and I started with a Tamiya Super Champ in about 83, running a 6v plastic encased hump-back battery.Took 15 minutes to charge and I ran in 5 minute races,
But hey, thanks for the lesson sonny-boy.
I'm still waiting a a good leap in battery technology, sure we have better tech then what we once did, but so we should, its been 30 odd years, and that's no reason to think we have some reached the pinnacle of battery evolution,quite the opposite,we have been lead down a dead end.
We do have smaller longer lasting batteries but they are as volatile as ever, if they do become unstable they are hard to extinguish, they don't have amazing run times, they still take a fair amount of time to charge, and they die when the voltage runs past their "safe" point.
All in all pretty damn crappy.
But hey, thanks for the lesson sonny-boy.
I'm still waiting a a good leap in battery technology, sure we have better tech then what we once did, but so we should, its been 30 odd years, and that's no reason to think we have some reached the pinnacle of battery evolution,quite the opposite,we have been lead down a dead end.
We do have smaller longer lasting batteries but they are as volatile as ever, if they do become unstable they are hard to extinguish, they don't have amazing run times, they still take a fair amount of time to charge, and they die when the voltage runs past their "safe" point.
All in all pretty damn crappy.
Lipo's are a modern marvel in mobile power technology. It's the stepping stone to fuel cells which are just around the corner, but you can bet your bottom dollar they'll be more "volatile" than lipos of today.
09-30-2010, 10:55 PM
#20
You need to remember that as battery technology evolved, so did the power hungry requirements of the fast setups that a lot of us run. Go run a new LiPo in your old Super Champ and see how far beyond 5 minutes you get.
I'm not really sure what you expect? You obviously don't have a clue as to what's going to be the next technology, yet claim LiPo is so "crappy". Get out there and come up with the next big thing if you are so unhappy with the current products.
I'm not really sure what you expect? You obviously don't have a clue as to what's going to be the next technology, yet claim LiPo is so "crappy". Get out there and come up with the next big thing if you are so unhappy with the current products.
I'm quite aware that run time has improved, though at a very slow rate of progress, and no, I'm quite comfortable as a consumer rather then a developer and view your "you create it then" comment with the disdain it deserves.
If I ignore the knee jerk pointless component of your post (which is near all of it) I'll answer your question you almost managed to ask.
I would like..
Shorter charge times (a few seconds)
Longer run times (hours)
Stability
Sure its going to be few years away, Let hope though at the very least the next evolution gets rid of the inherent problems in lipo tech.
Would have to run some pretty mild gearing to make that happen. Until then I think MaxAmps has some 13,500mah lipos you can run around with and a 5c charge rate isn't bad. Just need a charger capable of 65amps!
10-01-2010, 12:26 AM
#22
Tech Apprentice
I think it's phenominal that we have batterys capable of delivering hundreds of amps continuously. When I tell some people, who have an electrical background, their jaw drops at the figures. Some of us drive RC's that are more powerful than some combustion engines and in a package that weighs less than 8lbs. 
10-01-2010, 07:04 AM
#23
I thought this was already being developed. I'm surprised no one mentioned it yet!
(Oh, just found out I can't post links yet 'cause I'm new, so...)
dubya dubya dubya dot speedpassion dot net/us/aboutus.asp
Maybe someone can repost this link.
(Oh, just found out I can't post links yet 'cause I'm new, so...)
dubya dubya dubya dot speedpassion dot net/us/aboutus.asp
Maybe someone can repost this link.
10-01-2010, 07:52 AM
#24
The problem with the technology isn't so much the battery tech but the overall demands the system puts on them. It's very much like PC's. Every day they get faster/more efficient but each day the software becomes more bloated and requires more resources to run.
Same with cell phones. 4G is right around the corner. Promisses to delievery 10x the bandwidth. Guess what, apps will be rolled out that are so much more demanding, the system will be taxed just like it is today.
Things move along incrementally. It's not like fuel mileage for vehicles has moved along particularly quickly. My 85' civic from my college days got like 52mpg. How we doing today...????
If you think Lipo sucks today. Charge up your old Sanyo 2200 cells and try running that in your 1/8 buggy or truggy and tell me Lipo sucks. While it's not ideal, it's no where near the PITA some make it out to be.
Volatile - maybe, but everything you own runs on one including the cell in your pocket, your laptop, and cordless drill in the basement. How many really blow up in uWhat we do to them from an application standpoint is what makes them volatile, not so much the technology.
Same with cell phones. 4G is right around the corner. Promisses to delievery 10x the bandwidth. Guess what, apps will be rolled out that are so much more demanding, the system will be taxed just like it is today.
Things move along incrementally. It's not like fuel mileage for vehicles has moved along particularly quickly. My 85' civic from my college days got like 52mpg. How we doing today...????
If you think Lipo sucks today. Charge up your old Sanyo 2200 cells and try running that in your 1/8 buggy or truggy and tell me Lipo sucks. While it's not ideal, it's no where near the PITA some make it out to be.
Volatile - maybe, but everything you own runs on one including the cell in your pocket, your laptop, and cordless drill in the basement. How many really blow up in uWhat we do to them from an application standpoint is what makes them volatile, not so much the technology.
10-01-2010, 08:45 AM
#25
sigh.
I'm quite aware that run time has improved, though at a very slow rate of progress, and no, I'm quite comfortable as a consumer rather then a developer and view your "you create it then" comment with the disdain it deserves.
If I ignore the knee jerk pointless component of your post (which is near all of it) I'll answer your question you almost managed to ask.
I would like..
Shorter charge times (a few seconds)
Longer run times (hours)
Stability
Sure its going to be few years away, Let hope though at the very least the next evolution gets rid of the inherent problems in lipo tech.
I'm quite aware that run time has improved, though at a very slow rate of progress, and no, I'm quite comfortable as a consumer rather then a developer and view your "you create it then" comment with the disdain it deserves.
If I ignore the knee jerk pointless component of your post (which is near all of it) I'll answer your question you almost managed to ask.
I would like..
Shorter charge times (a few seconds)
Longer run times (hours)
Stability
Sure its going to be few years away, Let hope though at the very least the next evolution gets rid of the inherent problems in lipo tech.
LiPo is plenty stable. Fires are extremely rare. The problem isn't the battery, it's our demand for performance. If we limited current draw they'd operate just as reliably as cel phone batteries. Good luck getting racers on board with that though.
Our advances are limited by other industries. R/C is too tiny to drive innovation in real battery technology so we must wait for other, larger industries to reach these innovations for us.
10-01-2010, 08:58 AM
#26
To me this would kill this hobby and take the fun out of it. Using different batteries and tuning the car is half the fun and take away any competitive edge you might have over anyone else. Everyone would be on the same level power capacity wise. This would be ideal for laptop computers and cellphones.
10-01-2010, 10:22 AM
#28
i predict a cancer risk, please keep it away from kids until 20 years go by.
10-01-2010, 01:34 PM
#29
You could have #1 and #3 fairly easily. #2 is decades away if ever attainable. Lithium is the most energy dense battery chemistry available (anywhere). To achieve charge times in the seconds you'd be talking about capacitors, not batteries and their discharge capability would be a huge safety hazard to people (instead of lipo fires you'd have racers falling dead from cardiac arrest).
LiPo is plenty stable. Fires are extremely rare. The problem isn't the battery, it's our demand for performance. If we limited current draw they'd operate just as reliably as cel phone batteries. Good luck getting racers on board with that though.
Our advances are limited by other industries. R/C is too tiny to drive innovation in real battery technology so we must wait for other, larger industries to reach these innovations for us.
LiPo is plenty stable. Fires are extremely rare. The problem isn't the battery, it's our demand for performance. If we limited current draw they'd operate just as reliably as cel phone batteries. Good luck getting racers on board with that though.
Our advances are limited by other industries. R/C is too tiny to drive innovation in real battery technology so we must wait for other, larger industries to reach these innovations for us.
And I agree with all of it, Hopefully when I'm old and near dead I'll check on the state of the RC scene and see what power source is being used.
10-01-2010, 02:34 PM
#30
You and I have already been around a long time in this game (we started about the same time). I'm pretty happy with where we are power-wise today. While the hobby was at a stand-still for 20 years, the last 5 have seen some real advances (lipo and brushless). I use 1 motor per car and have for the last 3 seasons now and 1 battery per car which I replaced early last season. I still have the drawer of brushed modified motors I used to use. I even keep a few in my pit-box to show people the stuff we used to run. Anybody remember the Trinity "Pure Gold" 18T double from 1987?