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Old 01-31-2014, 07:48 AM   #13546
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solar D771 is a good budget servo...only like 17$ on hobbypartz
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Old 01-31-2014, 07:57 AM   #13547
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Thanks!! I was asking for the mid motor 3 gear configuration but i can see it just to be the opposite of your configuration! I like those direct connections to the battery, are these really safe to use?
Bullet connectors to inboard lipo plugs are safe as ekt said as long as you don't plug them in wrong.

If your ESC placement allows, on the side of the lipo, not inline with the lipo...
Make the wires just the right length to plug into the correct ports. That way one is longer than the other and the short one can not possibly reach the wrong port. That's how I wire mine and I use all black wires with no poitive marking... don't need it.
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Old 01-31-2014, 07:58 AM   #13548
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solar D771 is a good budget servo...only like 17$ on hobbypartz
And that one would be better than this stock in the dex210?

Because i play like 1:30 hs with this buggy total time and just going up and down the street whit out anything strange and the things fries itself... I guess i got a really bad dex210... (the motor was my fault but we can put it in the troubles list too)
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Old 01-31-2014, 08:37 AM   #13549
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Bullet connectors to inboard lipo plugs are safe as ekt said as long as you don't plug them in wrong.

If your ESC placement allows, on the side of the lipo, not inline with the lipo...
Make the wires just the right length to plug into the correct ports. That way one is longer than the other and the short one can not possibly reach the wrong port. That's how I wire mine and I use all black wires with no poitive marking... don't need it.
Thanks thats a good advice! I like the all black cables look! While bigger the AWG rating the better the cables? Or there are different for different applications...??
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Old 01-31-2014, 08:44 AM   #13550
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12awg is more than enough, I use 13awg. These don't pull nearly as much amperage as say a 4wd SCT that needs the thicker wires.
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Old 01-31-2014, 08:46 AM   #13551
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The problem I have with MM4 is the weight shift. It gets worse with increasing power. A 4 gear setup can pick the front wheels up pretty easily. The certainly makes it a bit more difficult to steer when under power coming out of a corner. With an MM4 setup, you really need to coast through a corner or go very gently on the throttle until you are most of the way through it. I do all of my braking for a corner before I even turn. By the time I start turning, I'm back on the power again. This isn't point and shoot driving either. MM3 allows me to do that easier.

When you let off the gas and hit the brakes, MM4 will transfer weight forwards more abruptly in that instant you hit the brakes. This unloads the rear tires faster which decreases your braking power and hurts a little bit of your rear grip. Hit the brakes hard after you've turned the wheel on an MM4. The rear end will come out faster than it will on an RM car.

Once you understand that the important thing for making traction is weight on the wheels, you'll learn how to move the weight around so you can make the car handle like you need it to. You need a certain amount of weight on your tires. Too much is just as bad as too little. A rear motor car as a consequence of it's layout, has more weight on the drive wheels than a mid motor car does. It is this sole fact that allows RM cars to have more rear grip. About 67-69% or so of the total weight is on the rear wheels on an RM car. With the motor hanging behind the rear axle centerline, it acts like even more due to leverage. An MM car has about 62-63% or so on the rear wheels with the random car hitting 65%. This few percent difference may not seem like much but it makes a world of a difference in grip.

That added weight in RM is typically so much that we try to counteract it somewhat. The opposite rotation of the motor helps with artificial weight shift and running antisquat also resists artificial weight shift as well. With MM however, in MM4, this weight shift from the motor rotation is being relied upon since there isn't enough static weight back there. This gives good straight line forward grip for acceleration but at the expense of shifting weight off of the front tires which are used for steering. On power acceleration is more difficult as a result. People still like to run antisquat to counter this. I prefer to run MM3. You don't get the artificial weight shift as in MM4 mode so on power steering is maintained at a higher level. By having the proper amount of rear weight, but inside the wheelbase of course, there is now enough forward traction. I also run no antisquat which helps. Under braking there isn't as dramatic of a rear end unloading so braking and corner entry are improved.

Yes you can tune out the on power understeer on an MM4 setup. You'll sacrifice off power turn in though. Yes you can tune out off power turn in problems in MM4 but you'll sacrifice on power corner exit. MM4 is all about chasing your tail because it isn't addressing the fundamental problem of static weight. It relies on aritifical weight transfer to compensate.

I know the guides state which setup to use and when but the one thing they fail to mention is static weight. That is the missing piece of the puzzle and the least understood. There's a good reason why the new B5M has a full saddle (square) pack run all the way back against the motor while the B5 has the same pack moved forwards in the center. Yes the B5M is run as MM4 but they certainly seem to be zoning in on the fundamental issue.
I totally agree with you on MM4 or RM4 and the weight shift is more pronounced. On power you tend to lift the front wheels more, so on RM4 I move the short pack all the way forward and run addition 45g lead up front. The more grip I have, the more I move the shorty back. The less grip, the more forward I run the pack. I know it sounds backwards, but in reality, the more weight in rear, the more the car wants to rotate like a pendulum.

For a MM4, I tend to run the pack all the way back. Not to fond of placing the ESC up front, I rather have it on the side pods, which provides better balance. Since we can't put in saddles, the next best thing is to move the electronics there.

I don't run full pack, as it makes the car heavier and more sluggish, and more likely to wipe in the turns cause of the added weight and time it needs to complete the weight transfer.
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Old 01-31-2014, 08:54 AM   #13552
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Fred, have you posted any pics of your chassis? I know you said you've made your own. I'd be interested to see what you came up with.
I thought I took pictures of it but I only found one. It was of the bottom showing how I did the nose cut from the original chassis. Only the base chassis was done at this time. I'll try to get more pics later but for now this is all I've got.
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Old 01-31-2014, 08:59 AM   #13553
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12awg is more than enough, I use 13awg. These don't pull nearly as much amperage as say a 4wd SCT that needs the thicker wires.
Thanks again! I'm buying all these things online now... I will give the D771 a try and see what happens... What size of heat shrinkable tube do i need for 12AWG?? I can use some black and some red and make all the markings just in case someone uses the car and make things explode :P
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Old 01-31-2014, 10:38 AM   #13554
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And that one would be better than this stock in the dex210?
yes it is a great price for what you get
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Old 01-31-2014, 11:01 AM   #13555
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Thanks again! I'm buying all these things online now... I will give the D771 a try and see what happens... What size of heat shrinkable tube do i need for 12AWG?? I can use some black and some red and make all the markings just in case someone uses the car and make things explode :P
Not sure, I don't use shrink tube on the wires.

Does your battery pack have wires coming out of it? Or just ports to plug the bullet connectors into (like the picture that you commented on a page or two back)?

The gauge of the wire does not mean the quality of the wire, its the thickness of the wire. Systems that pull a lot of power through the wires need thicker wire (lower gauge number)... like a 4x4 SCT or 1/8 scale. Systems that don't pull as much (like this buggy) do not need as thick of a wire.
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Old 01-31-2014, 11:20 AM   #13556
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Flame! Come visit us in Cali! We need more Durango's out at OCRC. I had so many people going…what's that? What's a durango? OI!
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Old 01-31-2014, 11:23 AM   #13557
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PS, so far Shorty seems sooooooooo much better on the 210. I ran the big saddles for a while and I was able to get a decent setup but this is a different level. The car jumps so far and so easily now and the weight difference really picks up the acceleration. It also seems to rotate very well. I'm on the short alum chassis.

Are most of your shorty pack guys running it all the way back or what position? I ended up with mine all the way back by the end of the day at OCRC.
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Old 01-31-2014, 11:34 AM   #13558
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Flame! Come visit us in Cali! We need more Durango's out at OCRC. I had so many people going…what's that? What's a durango? OI!
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PS, so far Shorty seems sooooooooo much better on the 210. I ran the big saddles for a while and I was able to get a decent setup but this is a different level. The car jumps so far and so easily now and the weight difference really picks up the acceleration. It also seems to rotate very well. I'm on the short alum chassis.

Are most of your shorty pack guys running it all the way back or what position? I ended up with mine all the way back by the end of the day at OCRC.
I'd love to, weather up here has been very arctic like this year, and could really use a break from it. Unfortunately I work outdoors, so its been crimping my funds as of late. We have the same thing up here in Minnesota, 6 Kyosho and 5-6 AE factory drivers make up a big part of the buggy class, few TLR and my Durango. The 4wd mod class has a few 410's sprinkled in there.
In mm4 my shorty liked to be to the rear with the +8 composite chassis. I never really used the kit chassis in MM4. Rm3 was the opposite, way up front, either chassis appeared to end up that way. I sold my V1, and am waiting on the new model, but I would assume this wont change.
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Old 01-31-2014, 12:00 PM   #13559
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Not sure, I don't use shrink tube on the wires.

Does your battery pack have wires coming out of it? Or just ports to plug the bullet connectors into (like the picture that you commented on a page or two back)?

The gauge of the wire does not mean the quality of the wire, its the thickness of the wire. Systems that pull a lot of power through the wires need thicker wire (lower gauge number)... like a 4x4 SCT or 1/8 scale. Systems that don't pull as much (like this buggy) do not need as thick of a wire.
It have the holes for plugin in. So 12 gauge is enough, I will try to find about the shrinkable tubes, I plan on use them for identification...

Just hope nothing else breaks! I want to play with this thing!!

Sorry forgot to ask, the connectors must be the 4mm?
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Old 01-31-2014, 12:07 PM   #13560
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If you have the plug in lipo, the bullets are actually the safest.
If you are using the charging lead that came with the lipo, that can be plugged into the lipo backwards by accident. Then the plug in between the lipo and ESC (Dean's EC5 or whatever) plugs in just as it always doss... but your backwards and your ESC just went up in smoke.

If you use bullet plugs from the lipo and wire straight to the ESC, if your ESC is mounted to the side of the pack... and your wires are cut to length to just reach the holes in the lipo with a little slack for chassis flex, you can not possibly plug in backwards without ripping the ESC off the chassis to get the shorter wire to the wrong hole.
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