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Red Dot Slash Motors- 12T Titan 550

Red Dot Slash Motors- 12T Titan 550

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Old 01-07-2010, 10:12 AM
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I race with Doc. He's as honest as they come. There is no opening of the can, zapping of magnets, or anything else shady.

He just knows how to tune a sealed can motor.

Now if he uses voodoo or black magic; that I can't comment on
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Old 01-07-2010, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by FocusWRC View Post
So if it is legal explain to me how he got so much more RPM's out of the motor without tweaking the arm or zapping magnets ?
once again as I said if you have to cheat to win , then you haven't won anything . So basically what tracks can do to combat this , is to implement a claimer rule of 25$ a motor , that is about the price of a true stock TRA3785 motor . Problem solved .
Its fairly easy to get a motor to run better without cheating. All depends on how you break in the motor. Plain and simple. You don't have to take the motor apart or even zap it do go fast.

If you been around as long as some have you know that not everyone that runs has to cheat, some actually have knowledge and experiance.

If I wanted I could easily do what Doc does but choose not to. He chooses to do it for fun and to help others out that don't know anything about brushed motors or just don't feel like putting in the little extra time needed to make the already good running Traxxas motor that tad bit better.

We do have a claim rule but the hobbyshop owner takes care of that. I had one taken last year and was given a new one for a replacement after some thought I was too fast. The shop owner even announced he gave me a new motor. I took the motor from the wrapper and no break in. Ran my heat and went 15 seconds faster than everyone. Everyone say me take it from the wrapper to my Slash so it was great. Last time anyone every said a word.

The other thing is not every single motor is great from the box. They are machine wound with huge tolerance between individual motors so it stands to reason if Doc goes thru alot of motors he will get ones that are better to start with and that upper % are the ones he would sell to the public. I know he has ones that never make it even after he uses his breakin process.

Even in the end in are Spec class I never been beating buy someone that had a special motor, I was just beat by a better driver on that day.
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Old 01-07-2010, 05:18 PM
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Default Black Cans

has anyone used a Black Can (Tam. Sport tuned) in a Slash w/XL-5?
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Old 01-08-2010, 08:02 AM
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Originally Posted by rcterp View Post
I race with Doc. He's as honest as they come. There is no opening of the can, zapping of magnets, or anything else shady.

He just knows how to tune a sealed can motor.

Now if he uses voodoo or black magic; that I can't comment on
This I concur. Been racing and watching Doc race for the past 7 years at TCS races. Pretty fast for an old guy too! (j/k Doc! )

Steve
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Old 01-08-2010, 08:03 AM
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Originally Posted by bowl806 View Post
has anyone used a Black Can (Tam. Sport tuned) in a Slash w/XL-5?
Black can will probably burn in a Slash in about a run and a half...they barely last 3 runs in a light weigh touring car.

Steve
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Old 01-08-2010, 08:15 AM
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Originally Posted by rcterp View Post
I race with Doc. He's as honest as they come. There is no opening of the can, zapping of magnets, or anything else shady.

He just knows how to tune a sealed can motor.

Now if he uses voodoo or black magic; that I can't comment on
So let me get this right , everyone is willing to pay double the price for a motor that they can break in themselves and save 50% of the cost ?
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Old 01-08-2010, 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by FocusWRC View Post
So let me get this right , everyone is willing to pay double the price for a motor that they can break in themselves and save 50% of the cost ?
You can break it in yourself, absolutely.

However, I assure you; Doc's motor will be faster.

You're paying a little more for that, not the motor.
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Old 01-08-2010, 09:12 AM
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Originally Posted by FocusWRC View Post
So let me get this right , everyone is willing to pay double the price for a motor that they can break in themselves and save 50% of the cost ?
Just like any field knowledge costs. Everything Doc does is legal and if you knew how and had years of experience, you could do it also.

Take even something as simple as water dipping. What voltage works best?
How long? etc... I'd rather pay for one of Doc's motors then screw around learning what works best, but you can if you want.
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Old 01-08-2010, 09:40 AM
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All good input from folks here, and I appreciate it.

Much of what our customers pay for is...consistency. We've put a lot of time, effort, research and- frankly- dollars into developing proprietary processes, fluids and equipment that ensure a quality, consistent product from motor to motor. Our motor ledgers contain performance documentation on every motor that's ever left the Lab, so we know whether we're going in the right direction. We're incredibly anal about things like fluid quality, time on equipment, dyno calibration and- perhaps most important- cleanliness (there's a reason it's called The Secret Underground Laboratory ). And we pass all of this knowledge along to our customers in the form of consistently improved performance.

Many of our customers comment on the condition of the comm when they receive their motors. A plain old water dip will give you a dull, scarred commutator, but our motors generally arrive with a comm that looks like it just came from the factory. That's because our unique break-in process (the first step of about 20 that takes a motor from box stock to Red Dot status) is designed to conform the brushes to the comm without causing undue damage that can drastically shorten the life of your new motor.

This is getting kind of long, but here's an example of how we do our research: Couple of years ago, I wanted to know whether any of the currently available bushing lubes would give me an advantage. So I devised a jig to hold a motor with an optical reader that determined RPM with a timer hooked up to it. I took about a dozen new motors, popped the cans, removed the magnets, and reassembled them. Each motor was oiled with a different lube. Then I mounted each motor in turn on the jig with a weighted dyno wheel attached to it, ran the wheel up to a predetermined RPM with a slave motor that had a rubber wheel attached to it, started the timer, removed the slave drive, and determined how long it took for the RPM to drop (with the magnets removed, the arm would spin for a long time). Each motor had to be new (and couldn't be reused) because oil leaves a residue and I wanted clean, clear results. At the end of the day (and clearly, a considerable investment), the testing showed that four of the oils worked better than the other eight. One was as good as the other three but cost much less.

So, here's my gift to you: Mobil One synthetic oil- the kind you buy by the quart in an auto parts store- in the lightest weight, works as well on bushings as anything you can find out there. It's cheap- 5 to 7 bucks for a quart, enough to last almost anybody a lifetime of RC racing. And the reasoning behind the recommendation came from solid, fact-based testing. Just like the way we tune our motors.
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Old 01-08-2010, 10:45 AM
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Originally Posted by teamstrc View Post
Black can will probably burn in a Slash in about a run and a half...they barely last 3 runs in a light weigh touring car.

Steve
Thanks Steve- after comparing the 2 side by side I noticed the pinion shaft is shorter on the black can anyway. Had the Black can in my Mini Cooper and was curious if it could be transplanted in the Slash. I think I'll just stick w/my VXL or Mamba.
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Old 01-08-2010, 10:46 AM
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Originally Posted by TwoTone View Post
Just like any field knowledge costs. Everything Doc does is legal and if you knew how and had years of experience, you could do it also.

Take even something as simple as water dipping. What voltage works best?
How long? etc... I'd rather pay for one of Doc's motors then screw around learning what works best, but you can if you want.
Oh...yes...and what kind of water? Just tap water? or bottled (not kidding, there's been test done on this too, by the way I believe tap works best) and what do you put in that water? I've heard of various "splash" of things put in the water. And yes, the amount of voltage, how often you change out the water, and normal rotation of motor or reverse, and if reverse for how long before you start going normal rotation again....etc...etc....been there done that, personally for a club race, I'll just throw in a out of the box Titan. But if I'm pulling up for a big race to race the Slash class, you can bet I'll have a red-dot in my truck, but that's just me (I need all the help I can get... )

Steve
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Old 01-08-2010, 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by rccardr View Post
So, here's my gift to you: Mobil One synthetic oil- the kind you buy by the quart in an auto parts store- in the lightest weight, works as well on bushings as anything you can find out there. It's cheap- 5 to 7 bucks for a quart, enough to last almost anybody a lifetime of RC racing. And the reasoning behind the recommendation came from solid, fact-based testing. Just like the way we tune our motors.
...what does motor oil have to do with anything? I've accepted that people are going to run the best they can buy and its just fact of racing. I'm just a little curious on the oil as I work in a shop for a living and its free for me.
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Old 01-08-2010, 06:54 PM
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Max- The point is not about oil...it's that we spend a lot of time and effort to use fact-based research on the work we do to improve motors. The oil thing was just an example of the lengths we go to to debunk myths and find the Truth.
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Old 01-08-2010, 07:29 PM
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Originally Posted by maxair45 View Post
...what does motor oil have to do with anything? I've accepted that people are going to run the best they can buy and its just fact of racing. I'm just a little curious on the oil as I work in a shop for a living and its free for me.
Well I guess you missed everything above your quote.

Basically put anyone can do what Doc does- no insult doc- but you have to one have the idea to try what he's tried and be willing to spend the money to test your theories. Personally, I would find it cheaper to buy one of his motors.
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Old 01-14-2010, 10:55 AM
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For anyone who's interested, the next production run of Red Dot Slash motors is scheduled for the week of January 25th.

The last run sold out even after we doubled it, and may of the motors in this run have already been sold through prepaid advance orders.

If you want one (or more) of these before mid-February, probably best to drop me a line at [email protected].
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