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Old 09-17-2008, 06:57 PM   #16
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These are the proposed rules for the race. The rules as I understand it have not been finalized. I believe these were pulled off the ACCOR website and have been tweaked a little. Any comments will be forwarded on for consideration.
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Old 09-17-2008, 07:10 PM   #17
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I weighed mine last night...5 pounds, 3 ounces WITHOUT a battery. I don't get that 4.75# thing everyone has listed. I have 3-4 ounces of lead in it, but damn...

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Joe,
When I first started putting together a set of racing rules, the trucks were not even available. I just had the Traxxas defined specs to work with.

The Weight Traxxas listed for the truck is 76.2 oz
76.2 ounces (avdp.) = 4.7625 pounds (avdp.)

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Old 09-17-2008, 07:23 PM   #18
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I think Lipo battery's should be allowed. I know of a couple people that would absolutely race if they were allowed.
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Old 09-17-2008, 07:32 PM   #19
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These are basicly your rules then arent they? Do you allow Lipo despite the lack of a lipo cut off?

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Joe,
When I first started putting together a set of racing rules, the trucks were not even available. I just had the Traxxas defined specs to work with.

The Weight Traxxas listed for the truck is 76.2 oz
76.2 ounces (avdp.) = 4.7625 pounds (avdp.)

JD
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Old 09-17-2008, 07:39 PM   #20
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These are basicly your rules then arent they? Do you allow Lipo despite the lack of a lipo cut off?
I had rules for a similar one design class and just started trying to put something together for the Slash, since I expected it would be a similar deal (i.e. Tamiya Mini). Many tracks have taken them as a place to start from when starting their own Slash Racing Classes.

I do allow NiMH or Lipo.

The one item people have taken liberty with is using locking grease in the diffs. Thats the one thing which has caused the widest seperation on the track with the non-ball diff trannys.
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Old 09-18-2008, 07:59 PM   #21
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The one item people have taken liberty with is using locking grease in the diffs. Thats the one thing which has caused the widest seperation on the track with the non-ball diff trannys.
This could also be said about the thing EVERYONE changes when they hit the track...the shock oil. And there's been no discussion with that.

I hate being the bad guy here, but no one has explained why shock oil is ok but not diff oil. Again, maybe I'm missing something here...

Can someone explain it? Just curious.

Thanks.
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Old 09-18-2008, 08:35 PM   #22
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Anyone know if theres going to be any awards/prizes. And I wonder if any magazines will cover the event.
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Old 09-18-2008, 08:52 PM   #23
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This could also be said about the thing EVERYONE changes when they hit the track...the shock oil. And there's been no discussion with that.

I hate being the bad guy here, but no one has explained why shock oil is ok but not diff oil. Again, maybe I'm missing something here...

Can someone explain it? Just curious.

Thanks.
Tony, I know you were just being sarcastic with the shock oil reference.

I would consider putting Locking Grease in a gear diff as creating the same affect as an Adjustable Ball Diff one could lock down. Meaning it should not be a tuning aid for the Basic Class. It should be allowed in the Mod Division. The truck doesnt come with a fluid gearbox. It does have some light oil/grease only for gear protection like any other electric vehicle.

The intent is - We want people to learn to tune their vehicles, including their TRIGGER FINGER!!!! Shock tuning, ride height, camber, caster, toe, gear ratio should be enough to make the basic class a fun racing and learning experience.
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Old 09-18-2008, 08:55 PM   #24
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This could also be said about the thing EVERYONE changes when they hit the track...the shock oil. And there's been no discussion with that.

I hate being the bad guy here, but no one has explained why shock oil is ok but not diff oil. Again, maybe I'm missing something here...

Can someone explain it? Just curious.

Thanks.

Not trying to call you out, maybe just explain things from a layman's point of view.
Literally everyone has either heard, or can contemplate, changing shock oil --- it's an everyman's task.
As a factory racer changing the diff fluid in an electric truck might not seem that big of a deal, and you understand how and what it does, while the new racer and thus the type of person that is attracted to spec racing wouldn't have a clue. A clue where to start, or a clue what it does.

To me it's part of the reason why "pro's" have no business populating a newbie, weekend club racer, class.
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Old 09-19-2008, 08:09 AM   #25
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Tony, I know you were just being sarcastic with the shock oil reference.

I would consider putting Locking Grease in a gear diff as creating the same affect as an Adjustable Ball Diff one could lock down. Meaning it should not be a tuning aid for the Basic Class. It should be allowed in the Mod Division. The truck doesnt come with a fluid gearbox. It does have some light oil/grease only for gear protection like any other electric vehicle.

The intent is - We want people to learn to tune their vehicles, including their TRIGGER FINGER!!!! Shock tuning, ride height, camber, caster, toe, gear ratio should be enough to make the basic class a fun racing and learning experience.
Yes, I was being a bit sarcastic. Glad you're one of the ones that can see that over the internet.

While I agree that it could be a bit over the heads of some newbs, I think it could be an important tuning lesson for them. If putting diff fluid in the diff moves that vehicle to the mod class, why not just put a ball diff in and leave it at that? Most of the people running this truck will have NO idea how to use their TRIGGER FINGER as a tuning tool!

I want to race both classes, and will certainly bide by all the rules (cuz, well, I hate cheaters! ), but I think its a silly rule and can only benefit the people driving the trucks on the track.

Ok, getting off my soapbox. I'm done. Thanks for listening to my rant.
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Old 09-19-2008, 08:15 AM   #26
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Not trying to call you out, maybe just explain things from a layman's point of view.
Literally everyone has either heard, or can contemplate, changing shock oil --- it's an everyman's task.
As a factory racer changing the diff fluid in an electric truck might not seem that big of a deal, and you understand how and what it does, while the new racer and thus the type of person that is attracted to spec racing wouldn't have a clue. A clue where to start, or a clue what it does.

To me it's part of the reason why "pro's" have no business populating a newbie, weekend club racer, class.
You have a point, but the counterpoint is definitely that alot of things can be learned from one or two 'good' guys getting into the class.

Perfect example:

I love racing, and race everything with wheels. I went to a Motorcycle race (got my motorcycle on Wednesday, went to a National Level event on that Saturday). While 'practicing' the 3 days before the event, I modified the steering to make the bike more manageable...basically adding a steering damper. Ended up showing up to the event and TQ'ing the Stock and Modified class (even against a whole Motocycle team from Italy). Ended up winning Stock but having some lap traffic issues in Mod (finished 3rd). Point is, I ended up helping alot of people converting their bikes to the new steering and they had alot more fun, and ended up doing alot better than they expected...making their experience a good one.

I'm not saying diff fluids could do that, but anything that makes a car/bike/truck/motorcycle/whatever go around the track better makes for a better experience, especially if its within the rules.

Thus my fight.

Which, after the last post, has ended. I put it out there, if it goes, it goes.
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Old 09-19-2008, 10:14 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by TPhalen View Post
You have a point, but the counterpoint is definitely that alot of things can be learned from one or two 'good' guys getting into the class.

Perfect example:

I love racing, and race everything with wheels. I went to a Motorcycle race (got my motorcycle on Wednesday, went to a National Level event on that Saturday). While 'practicing' the 3 days before the event, I modified the steering to make the bike more manageable...basically adding a steering damper. Ended up showing up to the event and TQ'ing the Stock and Modified class (even against a whole Motocycle team from Italy). Ended up winning Stock but having some lap traffic issues in Mod (finished 3rd). Point is, I ended up helping alot of people converting their bikes to the new steering and they had alot more fun, and ended up doing alot better than they expected...making their experience a good one.

I'm not saying diff fluids could do that, but anything that makes a car/bike/truck/motorcycle/whatever go around the track better makes for a better experience, especially if its within the rules.

Thus my fight.

Which, after the last post, has ended. I put it out there, if it goes, it goes.

That just proves my point. You're a very good driver and can likely win first weekend out in anything. Though it does seem odd that people at a nats-level bike race wouldn't know the damper trick.
But it's my problem with spec classes since most of the advocates suggest it's a class to get the new guys involved in, but they don't learn a thing getting their arses handed to them by experienced, let alone pro, racers. You not only have all the batteries and trick parts at your ready access, but also know tricks like diff fluid changes that would never occur to the average weekend racer.


Seems to me there needs to be some classification or class differences.
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Old 09-19-2008, 10:38 AM   #28
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[QUOTE=cracka;4855357]
But it's my problem with spec classes since most of the advocates suggest it's a class to get the new guys involved in, but they don't learn a thing getting their arses handed to them by experienced, let alone pro, racers. QUOTE]

I think a lot of people mistake a "spec" class for a "novice" class. If you want a class for novices to race each other, have a novice class. If you want to have a race to see who is the fastest under a given set of specs, have a spec class.

I'm looking at coming down for this race along with a group of NorCal people, so any rules updates or clarifications would be great.
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Old 09-19-2008, 04:28 PM   #29
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I have been looking at everyone talking about the Traxxas race at Pegasus and thought I might share somethings. Now please, don't get mad at me for sharing my ideas. Its why we all are here, to share ideas. I think some, not all, but some are missing the point of this race. Traxxas is trying to promote their car(s), products and trying to make this a family friendly race environment. Now, I dont race in the Slash classes but from what I have seen and from James Meyer, and Louis Flood letting me run some of the races at Peg, it has always been intended to be a SPEC. class. Just like Pro Stock dragsters, Top Fuel, and NASCAR, there are things that everyone is not allowed to change! And must have the same in each car. This is no different. Changing the shock oil is a suspension issue which deals with handling. Changing the oil in the gear box is a speed issue. SPEC racing is meant to keep the cars as close to the same top speed and overall performance as possible. If you have one that changed the oil in the gear box and one who didn't, where is the SPEC. in that? I personally think that if it is going to be a SPEC. race, let it be SPEC. And keep all the cars the same, out of the box stock and have fun. And if there is going to be a Mod. class, well the heck, slap a GTB with a 3.5 in it had go to town!!!!

But it does look like it will be a fun race and one for the record books
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Old 09-19-2008, 04:41 PM   #30
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Chances are the rules will not be adjusted to allow diff oil.

Having said that, I am for being allowed to change diff oil.

It (diff oil) is a minor change in the characteristics of the handling, just as changing shock oil. It also doesn't cost more than $10 for the oil itself which keeps spec-Slash in the spirit of cheap entry level racing.

I had not changed my diff oil until the most recent race at HRH's and I found very little to zero improvement for my driving style.

There are other tunings options on the Slash such as camber, caster, toe, etc. Should they be limited to their out of the box configuration?
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