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Old 09-08-2008, 03:19 AM   #46
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When my LHS sells a 'RTR' to anyone rookie or pro they try to educate the buyer as much as they can before they walk out of the shop. They also give them a 'break-in' sheet which tells you step by step the correct way to do it, run and maintain it. They also let them know that if they have any worries, questions or just want to discuss anything that they can ring them or bring the car back in and they will have a look for them. They will even invite anyone who is uneducated on 'RC' to come to a club race meet so they can get an idea of what racing "RC" is all about.

How this is hurting the hobby beats me, surely it can only help?

If things were too easy then there would be no challenge

If it weren't for brushless and li-po a lot more people would be driving nitro at the moment. You can't beat the smell of burning nitro first thing in the morning

If it wasn't for 'RTR' i for one would not of gotten into the hobby to start with and i'm sure there are a lot of other people out there that started with a 'RTR' and if they didn't then they probably aren't in the hobby then.

How many of you owned a high end 'kit' for your first car?
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Old 09-08-2008, 03:34 AM   #47
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I'm still wonder why they think nitro is hurting them?????
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Old 09-08-2008, 05:32 AM   #48
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Funny how it takes more batteries and more electric motors to race a Nitro 1/8th scale than it does an electric one!

Even funnier is the starter box motor is faster than the one it is cranking!

The noise of nitro needs to be compared to the baby rattle entertaining the baby!
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Old 09-08-2008, 08:55 AM   #49
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I've always been into electrics, but I don't think nitro have hurt this hobby at all. I think it has only augmented this hobby with a another choice. Even though a LiPo+Brushless combo can turn even the E-Maxx into a rocket these days, I can't deny the excitement and awe of a nitro 1/8th buggy roaring by. I don't want to work on a nitro engine, but I love the sight and sound of it!
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Old 09-08-2008, 02:40 PM   #50
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I think one of the things we have now is an entire new generation of "Nitro" only guys out there. People that started with nitro and have never been around electric. It's a different "breed" of racer.

It is so funny for me to take my electric out to an all gas track and run laps around 1/8th scale guys with my little 1/10th scale electrics. They get so worked up trying to keep up that they forget to do things like turn!

Don't get me wrong, I like nitro too.. ran nitro for years. I started with electric and had no misgivings that electric was faster.. nitro looks, sounds and even smells cool.. it's just not as smooth and fast as electric.. at least in off-road..

Our local track is 99.9% electric.. a few times we have nitro guys come out to race but they can't even keep up with our fast stock electric guys and end up not coming back or buying an electric..

I think electric has more staying power at race tracks.. this I think is because we tend to be more social... kind of hard to chat with somebody in the pits with folks reving their nitro car every second. It's an eb and flow.. electric is definately making a strong comeback in our area.


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Old 09-08-2008, 03:04 PM   #51
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I wrote this in the nitro forum and I've be watching this here. I think it kinda applys. But I will say, "most of the top nitro racers came from or still run electric". It teaches you throttle control. Anyway...

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Ok, as a nitro racer. I look at electric racers as preppy Izod wearing white collar guys that get together to sign petitions to keep minorities out of there yat club. Just too good to get their hands dirty with these little cars, they can’t keep their focus for any longer than five minutes. And get “prissy” when someone runs over their custom painted body. Just chill, you’re breathing all the fumes off the gel in your hair.

But,,,

As an electric racer. I see nitro guys as hairy Neanderthals that are upset that Gieco stole their image for the insurance commercials. They think that getting greasy is fun and adds flavor to the food they eat. Some of them see the movie, “Deliverance” as how life should be. Brushing your tooth (singular) is an option, and dentures are something that you strive for. Underpinning your house is “high class”, and getting it, “reposed” is a badge of honor.
All of us just need to chill….
(Sorry, it’s 3 in the morning and I’m trying to be funny.)
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Old 09-08-2008, 03:19 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrwoodchuck View Post
Ok, as a nitro racer. I look at electric racers as preppy Izod wearing white collar guys that get together to sign petitions to keep minorities out of there yat club. Just too good to get their hands dirty with these little cars, they can’t keep their focus for any longer than five minutes. And get “prissy” when someone runs over their custom painted body. Just chill, you’re breathing all the fumes off the gel in your hair.

But,,,

As an electric racer. I see nitro guys as hairy Neanderthals that are upset that Gieco stole their image for the insurance commercials. They think that getting greasy is fun and adds flavor to the food they eat. Some of them see the movie, “Deliverance” as how life should be. Brushing your tooth (singular) is an option, and dentures are something that you strive for. Underpinning your house is “high class”, and getting it, “reposed” is a badge of honor.
All of us just need to chill….
(Sorry, it’s 3 in the morning and I’m trying to be funny.)
I love this. It's awesome. I've been on both sides too.
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Old 09-08-2008, 05:33 PM   #53
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when that one guy said electric cars cant drive coast to coast and nitro is better and doesnt need electric....well internal combustion is what is killing our earth...figure that one out
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Old 09-08-2008, 05:58 PM   #54
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This is the big problem. Nitro didn't hurt the hobby. The sales people in the hobby stores have hurt the hobby....
Odd, I work in a hobby shop and we do our best to discourage new bloods from going nitro and less than 1 in 10 wind up heeding our advice, no matter how strongly we recommend otherwise. In the vast majority of cases, the only way to avoid selling a new guy nitro would be to refuse to sell it to them. Putting nitro in the hands of rookies is like falling off a greased stump, all we have to do is have it on the shelf and it's a done deal. It takes a lot of convincing to get a newbie to change their mind about electric versus nitro because they have been led to believe by ads from the car makers that nitro is faster (and also ups the cool factor of it's owner) and that's all 99.999% of first timers are interested in is how fast it is out of the box? The second most asked newb question is "will it do a wheelie"?

R/C car makers are by far the single most influential factor in a rookies first car buying decision. I can't tell you how many kids (between the ages of 12 and 50) have come in to our store with a magazine opened to the HPI ad depicting a savage at what appears to be 30 feet off the ground, wanting one just like it.

From my side of the counter it's a macho thing for first time buyers who perceive electric as not as bad ass as nitro. The people who walk in and ask what is the best beginners car are no problem because they actually want something easy to learn on, but they are so few and far between it's like a doo-doo bird sighting when one comes through the door.

Until you've tried to convince a 9 year old a JATO is too much car for him while grandma pats her foot, impatient to write the check and be on her way, you should be more careful making blanket statements about where the fault lies that so many rookies wind up with nitro.
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Old 09-08-2008, 06:42 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fhm555 View Post
Odd, I work in a hobby shop and we do our best to discourage new bloods from going nitro and less than 1 in 10 wind up heeding our advice, no matter how strongly we recommend otherwise. In the vast majority of cases, the only way to avoid selling a new guy nitro would be to refuse to sell it to them. Putting nitro in the hands of rookies is like falling off a greased stump, all we have to do is have it on the shelf and it's a done deal. It takes a lot of convincing to get a newbie to change their mind about electric versus nitro because they have been led to believe by ads from the car makers that nitro is faster (and also ups the cool factor of it's owner) and that's all 99.999% of first timers are interested in is how fast it is out of the box? The second most asked newb question is "will it do a wheelie"?

R/C car makers are by far the single most influential factor in a rookies first car buying decision. I can't tell you how many kids (between the ages of 12 and 50) have come in to our store with a magazine opened to the HPI ad depicting a savage at what appears to be 30 feet off the ground, wanting one just like it.

From my side of the counter it's a macho thing for first time buyers who perceive electric as not as bad ass as nitro. The people who walk in and ask what is the best beginners car are no problem because they actually want something easy to learn on, but they are so few and far between it's like a doo-doo bird sighting when one comes through the door.

Until you've tried to convince a 9 year old a JATO is too much car for him while grandma pats her foot, impatient to write the check and be on her way, you should be more careful making blanket statements about where the fault lies that so many rookies wind up with nitro.
You're right. I made it sound like ALL people who work in ALL hobby shops are idiots. There are shops and workers in some shops who are are very good at what they do and helping the customer learn about the hobby. But in the 18 years I've been in this hobby, they've been few and far between. I understand that if the customer is set on buying that 1/8 scale RTR, they're going to buy it. Period. Fine. That's what they really want, give the customer what they really want after you've tried to educate them. But the problem lies in the lack of knowledge many (not all) hobby shops and their employees have about the cars they're selling. I'm speaking from the experiences I've personally had and things I've seen at hobby shops. Many of the "Big Chain" hobby stores employ a lot of people who are just as clueless as the noobs walking in the door looking for a car that "looks like the one in the picture." Again, not all of them, are clueless, but I've delt with some people working behind the counter at these places that I've wondered if they've ever even driven an RC Car. Mr. noob buys an 1/8 scale RTR and floods the engine or breaks a servo. He brings it to the hobby shop he bought it from because he doesn't know how to fix it. (Not having built the car himself ) The guy behind the counter looks at it like it's a part from the space shuttle. I don't know how many times I've been standing there waiting for someone behind the counter to ring me up for something and I've ended up helping the kid out who brought in his broken car because the other kid behind the counter has no idea what he's doing.

However, you're right also about the advertising. I think a large part of the blame has to be laid on the magazines and the manufacturers themselves. They're pushing their RTR products because that's where the money is at right now.

Bottom line is I don't think nitro has hurt at all. (Since it's been around longer than electrics.) I think the fact it's easier to get a nitro car into the hands of those who shouldn't be running them YET and that they're what's pushed more (by both the manufacturers/magazines and some hobby shops) is what's hurt the hobby. For every guy who comes on here and says they wouldn't be racing if it weren't for nitro RTR's, I'd be willing to bet there's at least one or more person who's not in this great hobby because of their one and only experience being a nitro RTR that frustrated them enough to scare them away.
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Old 09-08-2008, 07:08 PM   #56
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I don't think nitro necessarily killed the hobby. I think the hobby is just too complex for most ADD type people nowadays. I also think it is too expensive.

I initially bought a VXL Rustler because it was faster than a nitro and RTR. I couldn't deal with the noise and mess of nitro, so electric was appealing. I quickly found I really liked the hobby and have since moved on to racing 1/8 electric and would probably never buy a RTR ever again. Not to mention, my VXL didn't have a single stock part on it by the time I eventually sold it (Full FLM conversion, etc).

However, when I look at how much of a money pit this hobby is along with the fact I don't have a track less than 40 miles away from me, I can see how someone would quit soon after purchasing a car. I mean there is only so many times you can run up and down a street before it gets boring.

People don't realize how easily the cars break and all the spare parts you have to keep. Not to mention the maintenance. I must break my car down entirely once every two weeks, with minor work on it during the week just to keep it in decent shape.

At the end of the day, this hobby isn't for people with short attention spans, light wallets, and who don't like to get a little dirt under their nails.
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Old 09-09-2008, 01:51 AM   #57
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I think the biggest "hurt" to the hobby is the thorn that has been there for years...The "Toy" version verses the "Hobby" version of RC. Education of what the differences are, and why the prices are like night and day, has never really been pressed on the stages it should have been. Yeah, there's been a few write ups and statements here and there, but its never consistent. The average un-educated consumer getting into RC thinks they can go to the local toy store, pick up that 70,80 buck radio control tyco and bring it out to the track or bash it. They get a big surprise when they find out its not the same thing. Then when the see the prices of the kits or RTR in the hobby versions of RC, it kind of intimidates them & backs them off. Most back off because they are not further educated as to why the Hobby versions are initially more expensive than the Toy versions. Those that do get the deeper info tend to understand, and find that in the long run they get more bang 4 their buck due to the fact that their Hobby RC can be maintained like that of their full size car/truck.
I think the "Toy" vs "Hobby" issue has always been the biggest hurt to hobby RC
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Old 09-09-2008, 09:05 AM   #58
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I personally don't think that nitro has hurt the hobby. I think that the people buying the cars without knowledge of how a nitro car works have hurt it. an 1/8th scale nitro buggy is a very delicate piece of machinery and alot of knowledge goes into running one properly.

The most important part is education. Yes these are so called Toy cars but again not really. These are extremely fast and can do severe damage to somebody if a person is not careful. I will agree with rbfive that people are lazy and do not want to take the time to research and learn about the hobby instead of dropping 500 bucks at the local hobby shop and blowing up a motor in a week.

I personally race both and i love each one for different reasons. This hobby will continue to evolve and there have been drastic improvements in technology but i do not feel that nitro has in any way hurt the hobby, it has probably gotten more people involved. whether lipo or nitro, just get out there and support your local tracks.
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Old 09-09-2008, 09:21 AM   #59
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I think the fact we have both options has helped this hobby.

I do think electric is the way to go for your first hobby grade rc car. Nitro can be a bit frustrating if a newbie does not follow the breakin, cleaning and storage rules. Electric can be a small problem if they don't treat their battery properly but not as much as a nitro that won't fire.

No new comer should enter the hobby by buying the fastest thing on the shelf, whether is be nitro or electric. If a nikko kitchen runner is their first and they jump to one of the electric speed demons or a nitro sedan or buggy they will have a steep learning curve and may leave the hobby.

Short sighted hobby shops may go for the quick cha ching but if they sell the newbie an entry level car and keep selling them more progressive cars they will make more money in the long run.

my 2 cents
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Old 09-09-2008, 09:27 AM   #60
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Just to play devil's advocate. Doesn't a newb who doesn't know much about nitros, who blows up an engine block every week, bring more business to that shop by asking for repair service and new parts/block?

You can't really force education on the people who wants to do this casually and don't want to dedicate their time to it. I think them buying anything, whether it's a nitro or an electric, is a good thing.

The on-site hobby shop at my local track constantly work on cars for other people because they don't understand how to work on their cars or just too lazy to do it themselves... I hope they are charging money for their labor, because labor is costly.

I think there's nothing wrong with nitro. Playing favortism to one is excluding yourself access to the other. You can like chocolate over vanilla, but you don't have to hate it because you like chocolate more!

I like watching nitro, but I would never get into one since they seem a lot of trouble. Now with the advent of brushless, the thought of having to cut my comms and service my motor seems tedius, even though that's what I used to do. Instead, I can now concentrate on shock and diff maintenance and car setup then worry about my powerplant...
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