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Old 07-25-2008, 10:37 PM   #91
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The more i think about it the more sense carpet makes. Don't need water, rototiller, tamper, etc. It would save thousands in the things you don't even really think about.
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Old 07-25-2008, 10:47 PM   #92
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DIRT TRACKS TEND TO BE LABOR INTENSIVE, AND ARE HARD TO CHANGE LAYOUTS.
INDOOR DIRT TRACKS TEND TO CREATE A PERMANENT DUST PROBLEM.
CARPET TRACKS TEND TO BE NO MUSS NO FUSS, ARE EASILY CHANGEABLE, AND MUCH MORE VERSITLE.
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Old 07-26-2008, 08:29 AM   #93
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Great idea, low maintenance, multiple options, multiple classes.....


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Originally Posted by ratherBracin View Post
A concept that hasn't really ever been thought about here in the States, and especially in Cali with its generally great weather, is a multi-use facility. And in multi-use I mean a carpeted indoor facility that can cater to a lot of different classes by the simple implementation and/or removal of jumps and obsticles as is more the norm in Europe where the weather sucks all the time.

Now before anyone blows a gasket hear me out.
The problem as I see it with any permanent, espcially indoor, facility is the rent and/or land costs involved with such an endeavor as well as having enough racers of any particular class or format regularly involved in the programs to support it pay the bills. Everybody always says, "I'll be there" - but the fact of the matter is that one way or another they aren't, and definately not all the time. Which is what you need. Part of the problem is because like with any hobby, be if golf or tennis or whatever, is that people really only have one day (or two days max) each week to pursue it.
And then you have to decide if it's going to be pavement, or dirt, or carpet, or off-road and suddenly no matter which route you choose to go one way or another you've pigeoholed yourself into such a small part of the market that you're missing out on all the rest.

I luv dirt, but I'm man enough to admit that it's a mess. Whether it be the dust that seemingly goes everywhere or the water needed that turns to mud, or need to keep the track groomed, one way or another it's a lot of work. I've been doing a lot of reading on db's in Europe and they do all sorts of off-road racing on carpet or astroturf tracks, in part because of the lack of maintenance involved and also because their weather turns dirt to muck and goo, both indoor and outdoor.

So my suggestion, as I started to say above, is to have a permanently carpeted indoor facility - and that way it doesn't matter if it's raining or snowing or Thursday out - and each day of the week set it aside for a different class of practicing (days) and racing (nights).

Sunday = closed
Monday = 1/8th electric off-road
Tuesday = 1/12 on-road
Wednesday = 1/10th on-road
Thursday = 1/18th on-road
Friday = 1/18th off-road
Saturday = 1/10th off-road

This way your facility attracts not only the larger scales of off-roaders, but but also the on-road guys, as well as the micro and mini-scales that have been growing in popularity (in case you've been asleep). They each get their own night, everybody's happy, and you attract a diverse crowd of racers and customers
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Old 07-28-2008, 11:10 AM   #94
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Originally Posted by oxymoron View Post
i'm not looking to get into a long drawn out fight over this, but I actually did operate a indoor 1/2 dirt 1/2 carpet facility years ago and I can tell you from practical experience that the dirt and fine dust never goes away no matter how much vaccuming you do. all the extra manhours does is add to the unprofitability of the place
The reason OC/RC is so clean is because I pay my crew to sweep and mop every night and dust several times per day.

RB
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Old 07-28-2008, 02:33 PM   #95
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Any on road track 1 hour drive or less from Hollywood I will be there except Crystal Park...
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Old 07-28-2008, 06:14 PM   #96
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Now i dont know how the turnouts for carpet racing are but i know that asphalt is super popular (just ask charlie barnes, heck he may even be able to help you out with tips or run some of your races)...

my vote goes to indoor asphalt right off the bat. That'll at least get people like me there opening day for sure. Thats what was the main draw for me for SoCal and to have a stationary asphalt indoor track i can count on will be open on set days then I will make a great effort to be there. Im sure there are many that will agree. So i dunno. Maybe take your double track idea of indoor (dirt) offroad+indoor onroad and switch it up to indoor carpet + indoor asphalt. Id definately be down for that. Im just one opinion, tho. Would still be cool to see a new indoor track opening.

Just my thoughts.

Oh yeah forgot to say, the idea of a JBRL style series as someone mentioned earlier in the thread across these tracks would be awesome. JBRL goes for spring/summer, this new series could go during the fall/winter. :P

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Old 07-28-2008, 07:38 PM   #97
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I would really love to see a new So Cal open. I really cannot tell you how much I miss So Cal. I hope everything works out for you.

Last edited by Hodapp; 07-28-2008 at 07:53 PM.
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Old 07-28-2008, 09:33 PM   #98
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SoCal, (when it was well taken care of) OCRC and MnM for that matter all had or have one thing in common, good dirt (in MnM's case, amazingly high bite). Keep it dirt, clay works great. Its low tire wear, low dust (relatively), and its consistant. There are so many dirt tracks out that on the club level it would be nice to know that I can take something like Holeshots or X-2000s and go run at OCRC, Hot Rod if its not totally dry (even then you can still run ok) or Pegasus and not need to radically change setups and/or tires and still have good time practicing or racing.
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Old 07-29-2008, 07:53 AM   #99
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I really dont think we need another dirt track right now. I have heard comments about growing the hobby but i dont know if anyone has noticed what the economy is like right now and it is not condusive for growing anything. If something new is going to be in the least bit succesful it needs to be unique and even that is a crap shoot. OCRC is enjoying good turnouts and Robert has mentioned he is lucky to break even. I also hope the newness does not wear off to the point where he is loosing a lot of money. One of the great ideas he had was to get corporate sponsorship. If you want to grow the hobby get a manufacture involved and have their cars there for new people to try, at no cost if you have to. No one is going to go out and drop a couple hundred on a car when that same $200 only gets them a couple of weeks worth of gas.
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Old 07-29-2008, 08:11 AM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robertbl View Post
The reason OC/RC is so clean is because I pay my crew to sweep and mop every night and dust several times per day.

RB
And how much does that affect your bottom line or profitibility, and put an extra burden on those that you employ?
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Old 07-29-2008, 08:45 AM   #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rocket-mtrsprts View Post
And how much does that affect your bottom line or profitibility, and put an extra burden on those that you employ?
??????????

Bottom line?
Burden employees?

What are you asking?
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Old 07-29-2008, 08:54 AM   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robertbl View Post
??????????

Bottom line?
Burden employees?

What are you asking?
I'm merely suggesting that the extra work you put on your employees takes more man-hours, that not only puts an extra burden (more grunt work leads to less happy employuees) on them, but that all the (I would guess) end of the day mopping and cleaning affects your bottom line/profitability due to the additional wages paid to accomplish the tasks.
But I'd think you'd know that already, or maybe that since you've noted to others your problem with barely breaking even that you'd soon catch on.

What I said wasn't intended as an insult, or to insinuate you don't have a clean shop, but just as an eye-opener to anyone considering such an endeavor since such concerns are seldom thought of when considering the bottomline (profitability of a business).
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Old 07-29-2008, 09:00 AM   #103
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rocket probably missed a few posts above, Robert stated that he's not doing this for profit (breaking even is not profit, you can make more stuffing your money in a CD at a bank)...

Robert, I did notice how clean it was last time I was there

I was putting my bags down on the floor, where I usually put it, I noticed that there weren't any dust, your employees must've dusted it the night before. A very cool change from the floors at SoCal, which were always dusty.

Ofcourse for those of us that do visit and use the track OCRC, it's always a good idea to dust the pit tables after usage. Robert has a duster/brush at the front counter. I usually just bring the trash can over to the pits and dust off all the dirt (and broken parts ) into the trash. The trash cans are usually not filled with bricks, so it's not that hard...


The "newness" haven't worn off on me yet. In fact, I'm taking 3 days of vacation from work so I can work on my car and go bashing at OCRC...
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Old 07-29-2008, 09:07 AM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rocket-mtrsprts View Post
I'm merely suggesting that the extra work you put on your employees takes more man-hours, that not only puts an extra burden (more grunt work leads to less happy employuees) on them, but that all the (I would guess) end of the day mopping and cleaning affects your bottom line/profitability due to the additional wages paid to accomplish the tasks.
But I'd think you'd know that already, or maybe that since you've noted to others your problem with barely breaking even that you'd soon catch on.

What I said wasn't intended as an insult, or to insinuate you don't have a clean shop, but just as an eye-opener to anyone considering such an endeavor since such concerns are seldom thought of when considering the bottomline (profitability of a business).
Well Robert has instilled a great deal of "clean up" upon the racers as well. We help him dust off our pit areas and pick up the stools before we leave so its not a complete wreck when the night is over. We, as racers, know that if the place is going to continue to look clean as hell we have to do our part. I have no qualms about dusting my area, and really the dirtiest places IMO are the pit mat areas.

I don't believe they have to stay after for hours on end to clean up, its a pretty simple system that he uses and it works.
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Old 07-29-2008, 09:22 AM   #105
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Originally Posted by tom_chang79 View Post
rocket probably missed a few posts above, Robert stated that he's not doing this for profit (breaking even is not profit, you can make more stuffing your money in a CD at a bank)...
I guess I missed that one, couldn't find it either, but regardless it just seems that one way or another either not being in it to make a profit or doing things intentionally to hurt your profit margin doesn't seem too wise and eventually leads to any business closing its doors.


Quote:
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Well Robert has instilled a great deal of "clean up" upon the racers as well. We help him dust off our pit areas and pick up the stools before we leave so its not a complete wreck when the night is over. We, as racers, know that if the place is going to continue to look clean as hell we have to do our part. I have no qualms about dusting my area, and really the dirtiest places IMO are the pit mat areas.

I don't believe they have to stay after for hours on end to clean up, its a pretty simple system that he uses and it works.
Hey, that's great!
As long as you can keep the racers playing along with the theme. But my concern there is that people are generally lazy or figure that if they're paying to race it's not there job. I've seen it happen before, and it's my guess it won't be the last time.


But either way all I was commenting on was the idea of a multi-purpose carpet track that would not only keep it out of the direct competition of the dirt boys at OCRC as well as offering a wide variety formats that could attract all sorts of drivers and racers as well as being rather low maintenance in comparison.
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