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Old 04-10-2008, 03:43 PM   #121
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Its not all the RC industries fault. You cant blame the retailers or manufacturers or magazines because its not a car culture anymore.

There are simply less guys under the age of 30 who care about performance cars or motorsports than there were 25 years ago.

Guys today are more worried about their feul mileage or sound equipment than they are about 1/4 mile times. So its only natural that most of them don't get into high performance RC cars either.

Its not really their fault. They are taught in school that engines kill the environment and that their self esteem is so fragile that they shouldnt keep score. And when it comes to self esteem, racing is brutal. Everyone knows who came in last or who didnt make the main. It seems like too many guys would rather quit than be 25th.

But the upside is that the young guys who do get into it and stay with it are almost guaranteed success. Its a lot easier to learn how to get all the performance out of a RC car when your 15 than it is when your 25 or 35 like I was.
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Old 04-10-2008, 04:08 PM   #122
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Please don't take this the wrong way, but I'm sure Traxxas did their homework. Advertising and marketing were not invented yesterday. They run in MT, have run in a variety of "mens interest magazines."
Why would I take it the wrong way? Thanks for your point of view. You make some strong points. Yes advertising and marketing were not invented yesterday, but there are very distinct differences between good marketing and bad marketing. I think Traxxas is somewhere in the middle. Again, marketing and promotions is very expensive. To hire a branding firm you are looking in the millions. I do not think Traxxas has that kind of capital to invest in branding/identity and then the additional capital needed to pay advertising fees. It shows. I do not blame them and my apologies if I seem like I am harshly criticizing them. I thank them for keeping the sport alive and the awesome products they put out.

This is where I come in. More importantly, we. This thread will help me to devise a solid idea and counterpoints like yours do help me to refine my approach to a strategy. I can put together a basic marketing package that all the manufacturers can use a a baseline resource if they decide to take me seriously. If not, hey, its just fun for me to come up with this stuff. I will put it in my portfolio.
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Old 04-10-2008, 04:43 PM   #123
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Why would I take it the wrong way? Thanks for your point of view. You make some strong points. Yes advertising and marketing were not invented yesterday, but there are very distinct differences between good marketing and bad marketing. I think Traxxas is somewhere in the middle. Again, marketing and promotions is very expensive. To hire a branding firm you are looking in the millions. I do not think Traxxas has that kind of capital to invest in branding/identity and then the additional capital needed to pay advertising fees. It shows. I do not blame them and my apologies if I seem like I am harshly criticizing them. I thank them for keeping the sport alive and the awesome products they put out.

This is where I come in. More importantly, we. This thread will help me to devise a solid idea and counterpoints like yours do help me to refine my approach to a strategy. I can put together a basic marketing package that all the manufacturers can use a a baseline resource if they decide to take me seriously. If not, hey, its just fun for me to come up with this stuff. I will put it in my portfolio.
So people don't get butt hurt too much, not directed toward you Tom, but I cant' stand when somebody criticizes magazines and says they are worthless. If I came here and said an opinion was worthless to somebody they would get pretty bent out of shape. My opinion...my magazine is just that. And while I have arguments why my opinion does hold more weight I do take other peoples opinions and give them the respect they deserve.

I for me obviously, but I've been into RC and IN RC for a long freaking time. I can't drive as well as I used to when I had time to do it all the time, but even out of practice I consider myself a good driver, and not just one one surface.

Tom,

YOU may think Traxxas advertising is medicore, but they sell/sold way more cars and seem to spend way more in advertising that lots of bigger companies throughout the world. They do a good job, have a decent product lineup and support system.

I deal with ads and marketing all the time. I can go on to tell you stories that some of these companies are really stupid, don't take marketing in their own hands and many things they do wrong.

I am a little curious though of what you've done in marketing. It's always fair to show your work if you're going to criticize other companies right? So post up some of the ads you feel are good so I can see if we agree.
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Old 04-10-2008, 05:00 PM   #124
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I think the best place to market outside of the industry is in BEER Magazine. Something tells me it will make you a fortune.
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Old 04-10-2008, 05:34 PM   #125
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This is all about branding. Brand it right and they will come. It is possible.
Well, perhaps. And apologies for getting off track a little, but as someone who watched from the front row as John Smale and Ron Zarella left GM barely alive, if that, from a focus on Branding... No disrepect Tom, this is a great read, lots of good ideas. And to be fair I'm sure Branding can be done well and poorly. But the more I read about it being the answer, the more I remember that sad period. They were saying all the same things, that nobody in the industry got it, they were going to shine the light.

Part of the answer, perhaps, maybe. But I would put my money on DJ's approach. Both of my 2 cents.
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Old 04-10-2008, 06:57 PM   #126
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r/c cars are in virtually every store you step in to. If you guys want to advance r/c racing then you have to have an organization that can provide places for people to race that will affiliate w/ said brand in the places you are advertising to. If there is no hobby shop or track in the said place then there is no way for racing to grow.
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Old 04-10-2008, 07:36 PM   #127
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So people don't get butt hurt too much, not directed toward you Tom, but I cant' stand when somebody criticizes magazines and says they are worthless. If I came here and said an opinion was worthless to somebody they would get pretty bent out of shape. My opinion...my magazine is just that. And while I have arguments why my opinion does hold more weight I do take other peoples opinions and give them the respect they deserve.

I for me obviously, but I've been into RC and IN RC for a long freaking time. I can't drive as well as I used to when I had time to do it all the time, but even out of practice I consider myself a good driver, and not just one one surface.

Tom,

YOU may think Traxxas advertising is medicore, but they sell/sold way more cars and seem to spend way more in advertising that lots of bigger companies throughout the world. They do a good job, have a decent product lineup and support system.

I deal with ads and marketing all the time. I can go on to tell you stories that some of these companies are really stupid, don't take marketing in their own hands and many things they do wrong.

I am a little curious though of what you've done in marketing. It's always fair to show your work if you're going to criticize other companies right? So post up some of the ads you feel are good so I can see if we agree.
I would have to agree with you. I have seen Traxxas advertisements all over the place RC related. Though it would be cool to see them do an add in Stuff or Maxim magazine, to get the 20 or 30 something croud, who would have the budget to get in to it. Just an idea to get more out of the box .
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Old 04-10-2008, 07:44 PM   #128
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I would have to agree with you. I have seen Traxxas advertisements all over the place RC related. Though it would be cool to see them do an add in Stuff or Maxim magazine, to get the 20 or 30 something croud, who would have the budget to get in to it. Just an idea to get more out of the box .

Yea if they did this with like with racing, track, and kinda sell it.Not just the fastest monster truck.
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Old 04-11-2008, 12:32 AM   #129
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Derek,
I appreciate your frustration and I agree magazines are one of the several avenues for bringing people into the hobby. But that not withstanding, I think you are kidding yourself if you feel the current magazines serve the interests of the hobbyist well. The fact is that the current spate of RC magazines are reliant on the manufacturers for not only their content but their revenue. As such your allegiances lie with them and that puts you at odds with some if not all of your readership. I went on your website to check out some of your reviews and while most were either of cars I knew were solid or I had no knowledge of, the TC4 I know well and know it's not great. Now mind you the TC4 isn't a bad car, but it is no where near as good as it's contemporaries. And yet Shane Archer said "It's difficult to say that Associated has hit a home run with the car, but they've come close." That's also as close to truth as it seems we can get. Everyone who has seen that car knows it's merely a warmed over TC3 and there were chassis kits out for the TC3 that could in fact produce a better car than what Associated was offering. But did you say people should just buy a TC3? Did you suggest they take a look at an Xray instead? No, you said what you ALWAYS say "this is a great car now go buy it".

Look, you do what you do, but don't come here and cry foul when people state the obvious if unpleasant truth. It would be like the editor of Progressive Farmer magazine going into a HIGH TIMES forum and asking why people there don't buy the magazine. After all they all work with dirt. You say that your magazine is your opinion, if so it's been heard and sorry to say many find it worthless. If you really need to feel appreciated here than produce a product people here will find useful and as a template you could do far worse than Competition Plus. Otherwise be content at trying to be the best catalog in the business. There's nothing wrong with that.
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Old 04-11-2008, 12:33 AM   #130
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Francis M.
I agree that the segmentation of the hobby that was not so pronounced during the eighties has made it more difficult to maintain a strong base. But I also feel the Internet has had a balancing effect in providing access to those niches. And yes your promotion ideas are right on the money but as always there is the question of who is going to do it?
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Old 04-11-2008, 06:31 AM   #131
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I think the current RC magazines are probably too good for the average racer or basher.

We need to stop blaming everything else but ourselves. If just 10 more people showed up at every track this weekend to race AND have some fun that would be a huge step in the right direction.
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Old 04-11-2008, 06:40 AM   #132
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Perhaps, Just perhaps, The vast majority of RC owners enjoy bashing and casual racing amongst themselves rather then organised meetings. No amount of phantom money will change that.

Hence RC cars already being mainstream on every level apart from racing...


For what its worth, I do know of a couple of tracks spending up large promoting events and attracting largish crowds of spectators, But it didn't result in any more people joining the club or attending as racers.
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Old 04-11-2008, 09:46 AM   #133
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DerekB,

As per your request here is a small list of my qualifications:

Washington Mutual - WaMu art
Pepsi Cola - New can art
McDonalds - repositioning the brand
Westin Hotels - I had my hands on all of their collateral through all stages of development
Four Points by Sheraton - total repositioning
Verizon - Production and promotion

This is just a few. I also do branding work for pharmaceutical companies as well but for security reasons I can not mention them by name. My total experience in creative services/branding/marketing spans almost 14 years. I posted this on the first page after some guy posted with a chip on his shoulder. I appreciate the fact that your request was far more respectful and you have every right to question my qualifications given the context of this thread.
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Old 04-11-2008, 12:15 PM   #134
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If r/c is ever going to become mainstream then the mainstream class needs to become cheaper then an x-box 360 w/ 2 games @ your lhs. I am not talking about silver can tamiyas w/ 1500 stick packs. I am talking about cars that are race worthy & can run 40 mph through a parking lot for under $400 w/ batts, chargers, tools, & everything else. When people show up to your local track & seem interested untill you tell them your 1/8th scale set you back about $1000 they turn around pretty quickly. I believe this is why r/c is hurting atm.
I believe that 2wd truck is currently headed in the right direction. I mean, you can get decent li//bl setups for under $600 or you can get something like a nitro firestorm w/ all the stuff you need for around $400. If you can't race localy for less then the price of an x-box then don't expect new people to show up to the track before they invest in their xbox. If you want the local racing population to grow then get w/ the other racers & come up w/ a dirt cheap class to run as a 2nd class instead of something like arena truck. I mean, you can pick up used ad1s for $75 & new firestorms(actually a great truck) for $250. hobby shops are going to make their money off of parts, tires, fuel, & ect. The more cars that are out racing & bashing around yards then the more money hobby shops are going to make. The faster they go the more often they will break & go through tires. I know of a track that runs indoors off road in the winter. This winter they started promoting li//bl truck & nitro. Well, this summer their truck class is going to go from less then 10 last year to dozens this year. Oh yeah, people can invest in the class for under $400.
EXACTLY!

the costs of everything is what turns people away from the hobby! remember, it is just a hobby...
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Old 04-11-2008, 12:20 PM   #135
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Hence RC cars already being mainstream on every level apart from racing...

so true.......

Boggles my mind.
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