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Roar Brushless motor debate thread.

Roar Brushless motor debate thread.

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Old 01-09-2008, 04:44 PM
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I started the onroad ROAR BL thread and have posted that 13.5 would/should be used for offroad stock.
In onroad the 13.5 has to much power, mostly bottom end, to compete with stock brushed motors, where a 17.5 or 15.5 would be more in line for that class.

If ROAR does go with these two diff motor rules, it could be good for offraod as there will be a lot of good deals on 13.5's and would cut down the whinning for those that can't use them. At least get them some money back to buy 17.5's.

So post on that thread to and let ROAR know how you feel.

I'm just getting into offroad and have found the fun again that has been going away in onroad.

Fred
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Old 01-09-2008, 05:05 PM
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Originally Posted by C_O_jones View Post
I started the onroad ROAR BL thread and have posted that 13.5 would/should be used for offroad stock.
In onroad the 13.5 has to much power, mostly bottom end, to compete with stock brushed motors, where a 17.5 or 15.5 would be more in line for that class.

If ROAR does go with these two diff motor rules, it could be good for offraod as there will be a lot of good deals on 13.5's and would cut down the whinning for those that can't use them. At least get them some money back to buy 17.5's.

So post on that thread to and let ROAR know how you feel.

I'm just getting into offroad and have found the fun again that has been going away in onroad.

Fred

I'm reading both.. I'll bring it up to the Excom
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Old 01-09-2008, 05:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Cain View Post
I think there is merit to what craps said about dividing by skill level.

Ultimately though until at least out here electric really takes off, won't matter much. Its nitro heaven in the summer here, and no local track in the winter.
We have the skill level thing in play right now. It's called "qualifying", and subsequent, A, B and C mains.
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Old 01-10-2008, 01:40 AM
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Originally Posted by johnnyboy View Post
Stock is THE worst class out there. It is bad for the hobby and should be scrapped. It is just chock full of sandbaggers and people spending too much time and money on motors, motor accessories and batteries. How is that good for beginners (because that is what stock is for right?).
i do agree, started onroad TC for a few weeks agothe Stock 27T is the only class yet for me so i can get some Licens points and do a upgrade to modified.. and it have cost me a, Lathe,27T race motors,Fussybrush,fiddlestick, brushes,springs etc...and i thought this was a "begginers class" the cheap one.. without the best motor and cells, you o not have any advantage.

My vote for BL in every class =)
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Old 01-10-2008, 03:16 AM
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Originally Posted by OG RC 10T View Post
Seriously?

That is the most competitive class, at least in this area.

Going from stock directly to mod, dosnt make that much sence. If you really dont like the 19t class, dont compete in it.
Dead serious... maybe on road is completely different, but in off road I see no reason to have three classes.

Going from stock to mod.... you don't have to run a wicked fast motor in mod class. If a guy isn't good enough to handle a mild modified then he should still be running stock.

19t is for sandbaggers who would rather win than compete with the fast guys.

At big races, split the mod class by skill levels, and even the stock if there's a lot of fast guys wanting to run stock. WE DON"T NEED A SPEC MOD CLASS TO WATER IT DOWN EVEN MORE....
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Old 01-10-2008, 03:21 AM
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I'm thinking that the stock BL motor design needs changed (smaller rotor) to reduce torque and increase RPM to make the powerband and gearing more like a brushed motor.

The guys who design and build them can figure out how to get it done.... I'm not going to go there.

No... it probably won't happen, but it would really help if the BL motors ran just like a BR motor so we could all get along and run them together.
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Old 01-10-2008, 11:29 AM
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Do the new Light novak brushless motors not have as much torque on the low end? I thought I heard something about this?

With the mamba max motors and ESC combo, I was able to configure it easily enough that I coudl have no wheel spin, or a whole lot. And this was without the computer hookup. Would be cool if they made a race specific ESC and motors.

I agree on the stock thing not being really beginner friendly. With all you can do to those motors, guys buying multiple ones to get the "hot" motor, etc. Its really not a beginner class. Seems more challenging that mod as far as working on motors go . I remembe watching a big oval race when I was in CT and the guys with all the motor tuning stuff in the pits for the stock class, was pretty crazy.
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Old 01-10-2008, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Craps View Post
You guys want electric off road racing to grow again!

Forget the motor and battery rules with so many classes! Makes it way to complicated for something so insignificate to going fast on off road! You can still use the rules on the truck/buggy on wheels, size and weight.

Narrow it down to 2wd Truck, 2wd Buggy and 4wd Buggy and if you want to divide it further, do it by driver ability with the Pro, Sportsman and Novice designations!

Sorry, but everybody can't be in an "A" main!
I myself would love to see a brushless Truggy class and Brushless Monster Truck class, but I've went to Mod-4wheel so it's a great class.
Next Year I may be running 2 classes.
2WD Truck and 4-wheel modified.
I've seen people run all 3 classes and do pretty good.
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Old 01-10-2008, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by glassdoctor View Post
Dead serious... maybe on road is completely different, but in off road I see no reason to have three classes.
Going from stock to mod.... you don't have to run a wicked fast motor in mod class. If a guy isn't good enough to handle a mild modified then he should still be running stock.
19t is for sandbaggers who would rather win than compete with the fast guys.

At big races, split the mod class by skill levels, and even the stock if there's a lot of fast guys wanting to run stock.

WE DON"T NEED A SPEC MOD CLASS TO WATER IT DOWN EVEN MORE....
First you said there is "no reason to have three classes", then you said "At big races, split the mod class by skill levels, and even the stock if there's a lot of fast guys wanting to run stock." So now you have 4 classes instead of three. Kinda contradicted yourself there. 19T/10.5 is a good intermediate class IMO. Its good competitive racing.
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Old 01-10-2008, 01:09 PM
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I guess it comes down to how we want to divide the classes either by power, chassis type, or by skill level.

at a club level, I am leaning towards chassis type. Seems that the cream will rise to the top as they always do. And if a resort is done after each heat, seems you get the lower skilled guys into a heat that better fits them right away. As for those who are running lots of power, but find themselves in the lower heat consistently, if it was me at least, that really tells me something about my driving skills versus other people, regardless of the power.

That way, at least how I see it so far, keeps the turnout for the class up ( Don't know about you guys, but I hate 3 man classes) and races interesting.

At bigger events, other ideas probably are better.

I was in the 19T spec camp or general spec classes camp for awhile, but after driving 1/8 scale buggy and seeing how things go there (guys with much more powerful .21s running with budget .21s), it changed my mind.
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Old 01-10-2008, 05:26 PM
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I try to stay roar legal, although Id love to see them mamba's banned,
but it's gonna go on forever and Id be in a war with people all the time.
At Bickels track that's all they ran, so I quit racing there due to that, and
the nitro racers tottally disrespecting my B44.
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Old 01-10-2008, 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Dawn Sanchez View Post
I'm reading both.. I'll bring it up to the Excom
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Please keep us off-road racers in mind by keeping the 13.5 BL motor stock class legal that most off-road tracks in the country have already adopted 13.5 BL motors as the Stock Class equivalent and you can also please consider the soft sided li-pos are OK for the off-road too. We have been racing with them for over 4 years now in the Carolinas with no problems.

There is alot of off-road racers at local tracks all over the country that already have 13.5s for Stock and alot that already have soft sided li-pos too!!! Just trying to keep on what is already main stream out there and save racers money!

Thank you for your service to our great hobby!
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Old 01-10-2008, 05:57 PM
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No that's not 4 classes.... it's 2 classes. One spec class (stock) and one open class (mod).

Splitting up into a "amatuer" and "pro" would only be done at big races where there are plenty of entries to go around. That's not four "classes" in the sense of this discussion. If you think it is... then how about novice and masters? Those are both "stock class" divisions... not another set of rules, motors, etc.

Why try so hard to argue?
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Old 01-10-2008, 06:14 PM
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Originally Posted by party_wagon View Post
This is why 1/8th scale is taking off & electric is dwendling. When you are not at a major sanctioned race at the mecca of r/c tracks it is not easy to get a full track of cars. When you run everyone in the same class you can have a turnout of 20-30 racers & have a a great race day locally. When you spread things out in to 20 differant classes you end up w/ a lot of very small classes. Run two classes w/ not motor limit(pro & sportsman).
I totally agree with what you are saying, but that is really not what this debate is about.

I really wasn't trying to add another class so much as, I was trying to suggest a fair way to phase out an old one.
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Old 01-10-2008, 07:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Craps View Post
Dawn
Please keep us off-road racers in mind by keeping the 13.5 BL motor stock class legal that most off-road tracks in the country have already adopted 13.5 BL motors as the Stock Class equivalent and you can also please consider the soft sided li-pos are OK for the off-road too. We have been racing with them for over 4 years now in the Carolinas with no problems.

There is alot of off-road racers at local tracks all over the country that already have 13.5s for Stock and alot that already have soft sided li-pos too!!! Just trying to keep on what is already main stream out there and save racers money!

Thank you for your service to our great hobby!
I agree on the lipo's Craps, I also agree on the motors. I think the "stock class" should be a spec class where all is equal, except for tuning and driving. Mod should be "Run what you brung", I understand there needs to be rules, But they should be dimensions not restrictions. I also agree on there being a limit on voltage, Like 7.4V Lipo's, 3s and above are just too much
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