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Old 08-09-2007, 12:44 PM   #241
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Originally Posted by mr. losi View Post
in my area we have 3 small offroad tracks, (65'x50') in size.....i dont think power is what is winning races......be it brushed brushlesss, lipo 6 cell or 5 cell.....i like the lipo for the ease of use, but i am going to wait for the dust to settle before i jump in, just as i did with brushless......
I can't disagree with you there...

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most of the ppl on this thread run local club racing(if i read everyone correctly) the change is primaraly for the guys who go to the bushell full of big races every year......and has no effect on the club level......
I'm glad you brought up this point. Here is my response:

Unfortunately, the rules at the big races trickle down to the club level. Even if a club allows lipo, what happens when it holds a big race? That's right, people are told that the stuff they use week in and week out at the club can't be used at the big race. Most lipo lovers aren't going to go out and spend several hundred dollars on NIMH stuff just to run one or two big races per year in their area so they come to rctech and bash the status quo.

That being said, should we really tailor rules around the top 100 guys who travel to all the big races or should we tailor the rules around what's going on at the club level to help increase turn-outs at the big races? Obviously, I think the latter is the way to go...
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Old 08-09-2007, 12:48 PM   #242
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you forget that all the potential roar racers have to start out somewhere. do you really think they will 'downgrade' (in their eyes) from lipo/bl to something 'slower' (in their eyes again)??


the largest roar series (florida state off-road series) has approved bl and lipo in all classes starting at the october race (1st race for the new season). which is after the roar approval dates. or they could be using it as a test bed (like they have the on-road series in the past) and you might see them approved by may 08 (the other roar approval date)


Heck I'm even considering replacing some of my nimh/brushed stuff - after all, i've been wanting 'equal' grounds, intelligent radio frequency stuff, etc since before i started racing. all this 'tech' we've seen in the last 2 years is over 15 years old.


edit: I am a ROAR member. 04-96473
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Old 08-09-2007, 12:57 PM   #243
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mfishel=planet rc raceway?
i dont think roar needs a rule change unless those that are faster with 5 cell want to outlaw those who run 6...if you are faster with 5 why would it bug you?
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Old 08-09-2007, 01:00 PM   #244
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Originally Posted by Leodis View Post
I can't disagree with you there...



I'm glad you brought up this point. Here is my response:

Unfortunately, the rules at the big races trickle down to the club level. Even if a club allows lipo, what happens when it holds a big race? That's right, people are told that the stuff they use week in and week out at the club can't be used at the big race. Most lipo lovers aren't going to go out and spend several hundred dollars on NIMH stuff just to run one or two big races per year in their area so they come to rctech and bash the status quo.

That being said, should we really tailor rules around the top 100 guys who travel to all the big races or should we tailor the rules around what's going on at the club level to help increase turn-outs at the big races? Obviously, I think the latter is the way to go...

not so in my area...if it is allowed at the club level, when the track has a larger event(non roar) they are allowed.....
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Old 08-09-2007, 01:03 PM   #245
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Originally Posted by mugenlife View Post
mfishel=planet rc raceway?
i dont think roar needs a rule change unless those that are faster with 5 cell want to outlaw those who run 6...if you are faster with 5 why would it bug you?
You might say planetrcraceway=mfishel
I wasn't advocating rule changes. I believe if you read my response I said come to my track and run what you want. I'm advocating a change of who and how rules get changed. No manufacturers advocates, but RACING advocates.
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Old 08-09-2007, 01:17 PM   #246
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Originally Posted by Leodis View Post
I can't disagree with you there...



I'm glad you brought up this point. Here is my response:

Unfortunately, the rules at the big races trickle down to the club level. Even if a club allows lipo, what happens when it holds a big race? That's right, people are told that the stuff they use week in and week out at the club can't be used at the big race. Most lipo lovers aren't going to go out and spend several hundred dollars on NIMH stuff just to run one or two big races per year in their area so they come to rctech and bash the status quo.

That being said, should we really tailor rules around the top 100 guys who travel to all the big races or should we tailor the rules around what's going on at the club level to help increase turn-outs at the big races? Obviously, I think the latter is the way to go...




So there are only 100 guys who are holding back your lipo's from taking over the world?

WOW lets go kick their ass.


Most nimh guys are smart enough to not spend hundreds on equipment that can't be used at big races.

You made the choice to buy products that are not legal for big races. Now rather than complain about it you can #1 Go buy legal equipment or #2 don't race big races.
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Old 08-09-2007, 01:19 PM   #247
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I wrote a nice big post, then I deleted it. Because nobody cares. But basically, there is always going to be complaining, it doesn't matter what the "official" rules are. But really, kill the hobby, I will just fly heli's.
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Old 08-09-2007, 01:34 PM   #248
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So there are only 100 guys who are holding back your lipo's from taking over the world?
I don't want lipos to take over the world or this hobby for that matter. It would be nice to see 1:1 lipo powered cars become more popular one day and it would nice to see 1/10 lipo cars not be the target of disinformation, lies, and half-truths from people like you. That's all.

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WOW lets go kick their ass.
Advocating violence on a message board isn't a very smart thing to do...

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Most nimh guys are smart enough to not spend hundreds on equipment that can't be used at big races.

You made the choice to buy products that are not legal for big races. Now rather than complain about it you can #1 Go buy legal equipment or #2 don't race big races.
It seems you have a habit of putting your foot in your mouth. For the record, I own both NIMH and lipo. That's why I'm educated on this subject unlike some people in this thread. Did you say you own a track? Please let me know the name of it so I never make the mistake of racing there.
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Old 08-09-2007, 01:44 PM   #249
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not so in my area...if it is allowed at the club level, when the track has a larger event(non roar) they are allowed.....
That's cool...I wish that was the case everywhere as I think it would help a lot. In the last year, I went to a big race at a club that allows lipos, but didn't allow them at the big race. I also went to an RC Pro Series race at a club that doesn't allow lipos, but they had to grudgingly allow them for that one day only. If more tracks did what your area does, I think there would be a lot less "drama".
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Old 08-09-2007, 02:15 PM   #250
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Originally Posted by Leodis View Post
I don't want lipos to take over the world or this hobby for that matter. It would be nice to see 1:1 lipo powered cars become more popular one day and it would nice to see 1/10 lipo cars not be the target of disinformation, lies, and half-truths from people like you. That's all.



Advocating violence on a message board isn't a very smart thing to do...



It seems you have a habit of putting your foot in your mouth. For the record, I own both NIMH and lipo. That's why I'm educated on this subject unlike some people in this thread. Did you say you own a track? Please let me know the name of it so I never make the mistake of racing there.




Exactly what lies have I told about lipo's?????? Please give examples



Violence.....yea I better watch it or i'll get banned




How exactly is my foot in my mouth??? I guess I missed it where you gave examples of me being clueless or telling lies.


Please as a person obviously much smarter than I tell me what it is you know that i'm uneducated on here.
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Old 08-09-2007, 02:40 PM   #251
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In my experience, ROAR has always let us trickle away from the "set in stone archaic rules" for our larger events. Granted the largest event we've ever held was Electric Regionals... But still. Everytime we ask ROAR for a waiver for one of our large events, they have granted it.

I'm not sure if they would do that with Lipo since they allegedly aren't covered under their insurance for Lipo batteries (And that's their current reasoning for not making rules for it)

I hope they expand. If not, as my track's race director, I am contemplating asking our members who want to run Lipo to join AMA (because AMA covers flying and racing) so that they will be covered under insurance if we choose to allow it next year.

I doubt that ROAR will change any battery rules for 2008, given that it is now August and we haven't heard anything yet. But I certainly hope that by 2009, or by the spring of 2008 they have made the leap to lipo.

The current batch of IB NiMH batteries aren't performing very well. At our track, 3 of us have 4200's, for a total of 10 packs. We have experienced failures on 3 packs in a 2 month span in primarily stock and 19T classes. Now that's expensive! 2 failures from Orion, 1 failure from a Trinity pack.

If anybody needs to see what an overcharged NiMH battery can do, search the on-road forum for 2006 ROAROval nationals. Eric has pictures of a battery embedded in a 2x4 from a careless user. Or search this forum a couple pages back and see a shorted out box of batteries that caught fire in the back of somebody's pickup truck.

To stay on topic... I still firmly believe we do not need to lower ourselves to 5 cells. I think we should open it up to lipo, and I'm all for allowing brushless to expand into other classes. (Now I haven't seen a brushless spec motors race on-road, but in off-road they hold no advantage over my brushed motors.

Paul

P.S. I run brushed equipment only.
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Old 08-09-2007, 02:45 PM   #252
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#2 don't race big races.
That's a matter of perspective. At the rate people are converting to LiPo it will become harder and harder hold a big race. Judging by the number of mains at Electric Off Road Nats this year I would say that we (club racers) have stopped going to the big races.
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Old 08-09-2007, 03:02 PM   #253
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That's a matter of perspective. At the rate people are converting to LiPo it will become harder and harder hold a big race. Judging by the number of mains at Electric Off Road Nats this year I would say that we (club racers) have stopped going to the big races.
You are correct, its perspective. I was going to list the national events that donít allow Lipo. But I think it would be easier for me to ask you, "What national level events allow Lipos for the 2007-2008 season???"

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Old 08-09-2007, 03:17 PM   #254
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That's a matter of perspective. At the rate people are converting to LiPo it will become harder and harder hold a big race. Judging by the number of mains at Electric Off Road Nats this year I would say that we (club racers) have stopped going to the big races.
I'm sure that turnout had nothing to do with people having to spend a grand on tires

vegas has 450 entries.....no lipo

snowbirds has 6 or 700 entries.....no lipo

Cleveland sells out ....no lipo

novak race sells out.....no lipo


Your right looks like people stopped going to big races
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Old 08-09-2007, 03:31 PM   #255
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I'm sure that turnout had nothing to do with people having to spend a grand on tires

vegas has 450 entries.....no lipo

snowbirds has 6 or 700 entries.....no lipo

Cleveland sells out ....no lipo

novak race sells out.....no lipo


Your right looks like people stopped going to big races

It's about $250 for 7 sets of tires for that race, assuming one set of tires each run.

Notice how all those races you list are carpet races? What about off-road?
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