R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric Off-Road

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 08-09-2007, 11:45 AM   #226
Administrator
 
Matt M.'s Avatar
R/C Tech Elite Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 8,410
Trader Rating: 26 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kuzo View Post
Sorry, we can't talk lipo without some moron spouting off about a fire their nephew's cousin's brother's soon to be brother-in-law heard about a fire that might have been from a lipo so they are bad.

Ok the topic. The only thing you've said about the topic is I'm a danger to myself for not running 6V and forcing everyone to run it instead of convincing them will make the world a better place? You'd make a great politician.

And just so you know, lipo is a valid point for the 5 cell discussion. Running 5 cell would prevent lipo from running at all. Now some of the other 5 cell threads discuss running that way in general, not cramming it down everyone's throat and invalidating a battery tech at the same time. I don't go in those.
how would 6 volts prevent lipo???? the current rules are 7.2, lipo is 7.4 ppl run them anyway.....

what we are talking about is large organized racing(roar, iic, cleavland, snowbirds, cactus and the like)....i could care less if someone is running lipo at the cleub level and i am running 5 cell....if i wanted more voltage i would run 7 cell.......
__________________
Team Losi Racing-Team Tekin-Proline Racing-Motiv-92zero Designs-Jim Neubert Paint Design-LiveRC.com-TFR-Team Dirt Heaven-Gravity RC-Trackside

UNLESS someone like you cares a whole awful lot,nothing is going to get better. It's not. Dr. Seuss
Matt M. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2007, 11:45 AM   #227
Tech Fanatic
 
kuzo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 948
Trader Rating: 11 (100%+)
Send a message via MSN to kuzo
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tripthreat View Post
I have talked with many people in the industry, and they all agree 1/10 RC should go to 5-cells. And not just mod tc, every discipline and every class, stock to mod. I agree. Right now, 6 cells is 7.2v and 2s Lipo is 7.4v no big deal. But 5 cells is 6.0v, the right range. There is no way to get Lipo in that range. It is simply 3.7 or 7.4.. to little or too much...lose-lose. The real change to reduce cost all around... tire wear, cheaper battery, longer motor life, longer electronics life, ect. ect...
Josh - I suggest YOU reread the first paragraph. 50% of it is why lipo won't fit in his grand scheme to fix racing.
kuzo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2007, 11:46 AM   #228
Tech Champion
 
Davidka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 9,929
Trader Rating: 77 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr. losi View Post
i could care less about ppl running lipo, just quit trying to force the world to change......
run it if you like, but dont try and ram it down my (and others) throat......

I hear you there. I think the issue that the Lipo guys here are concerned about is that if 5 cell becomes a rule then there is a voltage issue that further sets back LiPo as an accepted technology. The A123 cells are a viable option as is vlotage regulation.
Davidka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2007, 11:50 AM   #229
Tech Fanatic
 
kuzo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 948
Trader Rating: 11 (100%+)
Send a message via MSN to kuzo
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr. losi View Post
how would 6 volts prevent lipo???? the current rules are 7.2, lipo is 7.4 ppl run them anyway.....

what we are talking about is large organized racing(roar, iic, cleavland, snowbirds, cactus and the like)....i could care less if someone is running lipo at the cleub level and i am running 5 cell....if i wanted more voltage i would run 7 cell.......
Because they aren't talking about some people running 6 cell, some running 5 cell and some running lipo. They are advocating a rule change to limit batteries to 6V period. Lipos will not get to 6V without a voltage regulator or a total change in battery chemistry.

The concept of 7.2V vs. 7.4V is invalid as lipos are limited to 8.4V max voltage at full charge. What do high end NiMH batteries peak at? Nominal voltage means nothing in this conversation.
kuzo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2007, 11:57 AM   #230
Tech Fanatic
 
kuzo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 948
Trader Rating: 11 (100%+)
Send a message via MSN to kuzo
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Davidka View Post
I hear you there. I think the issue that the Lipo guys here are concerned about is that if 5 cell becomes a rule then there is a voltage issue that further sets back LiPo as an accepted technology. The A123 cells are a viable option as is vlotage regulation.
Hopefully the A123 packs get a resize someday though. Orion Platinums are 45mm wide the 4600 A123 pack is 53mm. I'm not fitting that in without altering my chassis.
kuzo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2007, 12:10 PM   #231
Administrator
 
Matt M.'s Avatar
R/C Tech Elite Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 8,410
Trader Rating: 26 (100%+)
Default

the limit now is suposed to be 7.2 max...period....not 7.4 or what ever......

some tracks are alowing the lipo any way....that is fine...

i ask you this, if at the roar race that they had the brushless lipo class could i have run my sub c cells?????if the answer is no, then why not, you expect to be able to run lipo why should i not expect to run what i want?????
__________________
Team Losi Racing-Team Tekin-Proline Racing-Motiv-92zero Designs-Jim Neubert Paint Design-LiveRC.com-TFR-Team Dirt Heaven-Gravity RC-Trackside

UNLESS someone like you cares a whole awful lot,nothing is going to get better. It's not. Dr. Seuss
Matt M. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2007, 12:18 PM   #232
Tech Elite
 
Leodis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 2,058
Trader Rating: 16 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr. losi View Post
the limit now is suposed to be 7.2 max...period....not 7.4 or what ever......

some tracks are alowing the lipo any way....that is fine...

i ask you this, if at the roar race that they had the brushless lipo class could i have run my sub c cells?????if the answer is no, then why not, you expect to be able to run lipo why should i not expect to run what i want?????
I think ROAR intentionally segregated the class for the reasons I already outlined in another thread:

Quote:
ROAR did a lipo truck exhibition class this year at the nats, IMO, to get all the lipo lovers off ROAR's back and make them put up or shut up. IMO, the main was as boring as a 20 - 45 minute gas main, but at least lipo got some exposure and some of the best drivers in the world participated in the class. This class will probably become an official class next year, but lipos won't be allowed in stock, 19T, or mod in 2008 or 2009. Lipos will remain segregated from the real classes for as long as possible so that the NIMH distributors, battery matchers, and motor tuners (19T & Stock) can keep making money off racing until 1/10 electric ROAR races are no longer relevant. At that point, ROAR will either finally change its ways or a new sanctioning body will step in to save electric from all the special interests and do a better job of holding regional and national races that actually reflect what's going on at the club level.
Leodis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2007, 12:18 PM   #233
Tech Fanatic
 
kuzo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 948
Trader Rating: 11 (100%+)
Send a message via MSN to kuzo
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr. losi View Post
the limit now is suposed to be 7.2 max...period....not 7.4 or what ever......

some tracks are alowing the lipo any way....that is fine...

i ask you this, if at the roar race that they had the brushless lipo class could i have run my sub c cells?????if the answer is no, then why not, you expect to be able to run lipo why should i not expect to run what i want?????
I am personally for run what you want when it comes to batteries. A few pages back it was discussed that running 5 cell, 6 cell and lipo together does not make a significant difference in lap times. In the onroad section there's a few threads discussing 5 cell driving and several people are saying their lap times improved over 6 cell. I would assume the same would hold true for offroad. Lipo users are not asking to replace NiMH in any way.
kuzo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2007, 12:20 PM   #234
Tech Addict
 
mfishel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: the racing capital of the world
Posts: 551
Default

Lipo seems to be the #1 topic on this forum right now. There are at least 3 or 4 different threads going on right now. With all this chatter where are the manufacturers of these products? Unless they are remaining anonymous. In which case I say 'show yourselves!'.
Come on guys. The manufacturers don't care about the racing. They sell their product regardless. They will do what they want when they want, then you will have to go along or quit.
If it wasn't for Dave G at MRC/Academy and Coach at Associated, I'd say we aren't racing cars, we're playing with toys that we have to make do with.
I'm a track owner, so I could easily cut my own throat. But do the companies making all the money give a crap? Everybody come to my track and run what ya freakin' want.
mfishel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2007, 12:22 PM   #235
Tech Fanatic
 
kuzo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 948
Trader Rating: 11 (100%+)
Send a message via MSN to kuzo
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mfishel View Post
Everybody come to my track and run what ya freakin' want.
Indiana??? That's going to be a looong commute for me. If I ever get close to ya I'll bring my stuff.
kuzo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2007, 12:31 PM   #236
Tech Champion
 
Davidka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 9,929
Trader Rating: 77 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr. losi View Post
the limit now is suposed to be 7.2 max...period....not 7.4 or what ever......

?????
6 cell sub C's have not met the 7.2v limit for years now. This is yet another reason that supports my idea that if racing is to continue and be fair from a power standpoint then the answer is voltage regulation. This way at least one of the variances in batteries and battery technologies can be eliminated.
Davidka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2007, 12:31 PM   #237
Tech Regular
 
cfwdude's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Spokane, WA
Posts: 288
Trader Rating: 7 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mfishel View Post
Everybody come to my track and run what ya freakin' want.
Now that's the way to promote electric racing!
cfwdude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2007, 12:33 PM   #238
Administrator
 
Matt M.'s Avatar
R/C Tech Elite Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 8,410
Trader Rating: 26 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leodis View Post
I think ROAR intentionally segregated the class for the reasons I already outlined in another thread:
i understand....i was trying to make a point....

in my area we have 3 small offroad tracks, (65'x50') in size.....i dont think power is what is winning races......be it brushed brushlesss, lipo 6 cell or 5 cell.....i like the lipo for the ease of use, but i am going to wait for the dust to settle before i jump in, just as i did with brushless......

most of the ppl on this thread run local club racing(if i read everyone correctly) the change is primaraly for the guys who go to the bushell full of big races every year......and has no effect on the club level......
__________________
Team Losi Racing-Team Tekin-Proline Racing-Motiv-92zero Designs-Jim Neubert Paint Design-LiveRC.com-TFR-Team Dirt Heaven-Gravity RC-Trackside

UNLESS someone like you cares a whole awful lot,nothing is going to get better. It's not. Dr. Seuss
Matt M. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2007, 12:36 PM   #239
Tech Addict
 
mfishel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: the racing capital of the world
Posts: 551
Default

Sorry I'm off my meds.
I forgot to mention seemingly the whole team at Kyosho. They are also very involved in this forum.
The problem is in competition organizational structure. No racing series in history has been successful when run by a committee. It just turns into a bunch of good old boys looking out for their owns b'hinds. You can't look out for the best interests of the racing if you're selling product and the guy next to you on 'the board' is selling his own product. And the next guy down is selling the advertising.
What is needed is a benign dictator. Why do you think F1 is the biggest sport in the world? Bigger than the Olympics and football (soccer). Sorry NASCAR fans it is true. And for the less informed US racing fans, the same applies to the reason NASCAR is about to become bigger than the NFL. The person in charge doesn't care what the manufacturers want. He just wants to be the biggest kid on the block and if anybody doesn't like it then 'bye-bye'.
mfishel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2007, 12:43 PM   #240
Tech Addict
 
mfishel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: the racing capital of the world
Posts: 551
Default

Oh yea. And all the guys at JConcepts. Boy I hope I don't start contradicting myself.
mfishel is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
XRAY T2 2008 6 CELLS EU SPEC + TEAM ORION 3200 CARBON EDITION FOR SALE cyclone78 R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 14 09-05-2008 09:34 PM
Modified Racing in 2008 - 5 cells or 6? Swanny Australian Racing 155 07-27-2008 02:33 AM
ROAR: 8 cells in TC effective Feburary 30, 2008 RCSteve93 Electric On-Road 12 04-01-2007 09:13 PM
CYCLING BOARD FOR 30 CELLS AT A TIME BCOLEMAN R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 0 05-29-2005 09:25 AM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 10:49 PM.


We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net