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Old 09-14-2007, 02:21 PM   #121
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if roar change it to 5 cell

i think it was only to save many matcher seller who lost $ by customer who buy lipo for save alot of money and time on nimh maintenance
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Old 09-14-2007, 11:49 PM   #122
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From what I have heard elsewhere and not in this forum is that the reason for reducing the voltage to five cell was that the manufacturers are having a difficult time keeping the speed controls from over heating with high draw mod motors. Many of the pros are finding issues with their speed controls overheating or even buring up. I think the manufacturers need to improve their products, despite how hard it may be.
If thats the reason, they still need to raise the voltage and lower gearing to drop amp load. when you drop voltage, People will naturally gearup to regain performance. that will increase the overall load and the esc's will blow more often, batteries will pop more pften because of increased stress on already stressed batteries. The reason i went to LIPO's, was because wether i run my T4 (5700 mamba max) or my Gorilla revo (9xl amd mamba max at time) My batteries would come out of the car scalding hot and every once in a while I'd hear a sizzling, I even poped a cell in the G revo while racing.
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Old 09-15-2007, 12:22 AM   #123
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Hey guys, check out the IFMAR worlds thread, there's mention of two sub-c packs exploding. One was on an academy 4wd buggy. Its aluminum shaft got "bent like a banana".
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Old 09-16-2007, 07:21 AM   #124
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Hey guys, check out the IFMAR worlds thread, there's mention of two sub-c packs exploding. One was on an academy 4wd buggy. Its aluminum shaft got "bent like a banana".

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One of the Academy team had this pack of cells blow whilst walking to morning practice! The offending cell blew through the carbon battery strap and bent the centre drive shaft like a banana. It happened again to one of the Yokomo drivers a little later on.
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Old 09-19-2007, 11:50 AM   #125
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Holy crap! I wouldnt want to get struck by one of those in the pit area...
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Old 09-20-2007, 12:29 AM   #126
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I have been using lipo's in offroad since the platinum 4800 came out. I bought two packs, and basically have two summers worth of pratice and racing on them. In my x-6 with a 13.5 i can get 30 minutes of runtime. In my bj4 with a 6.5 I can get 20 minutes. I cannot tell you the exact number of cycles on them, but driving for 20 weeks a season two times a week with 3-4 cycles a time, that is between 240-320 cycles. Now they are going to go indoor because my local club is now allowing lipo batteries, which is great for me. I will have to purchase one 3200 for my tc. The 4800 just will not fit. But $80 is a heck of a lot better than $250, and next year I won't have to buy any (hypothetically speaking).

Going to 5 cell will kill the hobby quicker than you can say "death". While yes, I do understand most of the people already vested will grudgingly make the change, new people will not. I can tell you as a track assistant and local knowledge guy that the first question new people ask is; how fast do they go? Followed by; can you make it go faster? Then finally; how much does it cost? If electric goes to 5 cell, those new people will move to nitro, because lets face it, new people care about speed. And I don't know about the rest of you, but after being pampered with lipo and brushless, there is no way I want the maintenance of nitro again.

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Yes, ROAR is looking into how to get this done. Basically, your looking at a new class being created and certain safety requirements would have to be in place for a MFG's pack to be permitted. Specs will have to be created.
I find this quite disheartening. If specs are not already created and ready for implementation, then it is unlikely that lipo's will be allowed next year. These things should already be known, if they are not, then it is apparent that roar does not hold the future (I use this term presumptuously, but nonetheless the rest of the worlds electronics have moved beyond nimh) in high regard.

I do however see light in the future, I predict that within two years the price of nimh cells will go up, regardless of rc (we are pretty small in comparison to the worlds electronics). While I am not a market analyst, the logical implications of present and future electronics being dependent on a different power source than nimh, suggests that manufactures of just nimh products will have to raise costs due to lack of demand. This will eventually lead to the downfall of nimh chemistry, and give its short reigned superiority to the battery technology of the day. The question is; what will that technology be? The future can sometimes as well be a double edged sword, if roar holds to nimh until its dying day and only then realizes that lipo not nimh is taboo, then I believe it will be the downfall of roar. However, if at that time there is a better technology than lipo, then roar will be held as smart, not falling for the lipo gimmick. But this is all speculation, and rambling at best.
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Old 09-20-2007, 11:43 AM   #127
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I agree with Trilerian(sp). The issue is that battery technology is always changing. I recall starting out in the late 80's with 1200 cells, and every so often it went higher in capacity. So, my point is even if LIPO is somehow a fad in technology, so were 1400SCR's, and every other battery cell upgrade since I started racing until today. I dont see the why ROAR is dragging their feet on approving LIPO. Do they want more racers (= members) or not?
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Old 09-20-2007, 07:33 PM   #128
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If you change the rules to make 5 cell manditory you will only create a battery war because people will need more oomph out of their 5 cell for their car to make the power they want. 5 cell NIMH matched packs would be more expensive than the 6 cell matched packs we have now if they switched it to 5 cell.
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Old 09-20-2007, 08:36 PM   #129
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I agree with Trilerian(sp). The issue is that battery technology is always changing. I recall starting out in the late 80's with 1200 cells, and every so often it went higher in capacity. So, my point is even if LIPO is somehow a fad in technology, so were 1400SCR's, and every other battery cell upgrade since I started racing until today. I dont see the why ROAR is dragging their feet on approving LIPO. Do they want more racers (= members) or not?
1400s and beyond were not new technology, but a refinement or improvement of the EXISTING technology. NIMH batteries were a new technology (new chemistry at least). Fortunately they were same looking and performing as the then current technology (NICD), so they were ushered in with no problem. They were also adaptable to the abilities of the matchers and produced by the same manufacturers.
LIPO is different. Different manufacturers, and the matchers cannot work with them. They also have different distribution networks. It leads me to surmise that a whole new network of hands will be making the money when R/C racing embraces these products. COULD THESE REASONS BE WHY ROAR IS'NT INTERESTED IN THIS TECHNOLOGY?
When I got back in to racing NICD had gone and NIMH had been embraced, and none of my chargers were compatible. This didn't keep me from racing, and apparently didn't keep ROAR from allowing NIMH to be used.
Now most high end chargers and speed controls can adapt to NIMH or LIPO. So my question is WHY NOT?
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Old 09-20-2007, 09:48 PM   #130
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Everyone knows that batteries are big business. They are a comodity item like tires. Lipo's end that.
+1
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Old 09-20-2007, 10:14 PM   #131
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Originally Posted by mfishel View Post
1400s and beyond were not new technology, but a refinement or improvement of the EXISTING technology. NIMH batteries were a new technology (new chemistry at least). Fortunately they were same looking and performing as the then current technology (NICD), so they were ushered in with no problem. They were also adaptable to the abilities of the matchers and produced by the same manufacturers.
LIPO is different. Different manufacturers, and the matchers cannot work with them. They also have different distribution networks. It leads me to surmise that a whole new network of hands will be making the money when R/C racing embraces these products. COULD THESE REASONS BE WHY ROAR IS'NT INTERESTED IN THIS TECHNOLOGY?
When I got back in to racing NICD had gone and NIMH had been embraced, and none of my chargers were compatible. This didn't keep me from racing, and apparently didn't keep ROAR from allowing NIMH to be used.
Now most high end chargers and speed controls can adapt to NIMH or LIPO. So my question is WHY NOT?
I can give you the two reasons i have seen in forums and discussions.

The reason they give us: To retool for Lipo's and setup programming, will drive our cost up.

the answer to that: Its a one time purchase and will hurt initally, but after roughly a year you have recouped, by not buying good cells every couple weeks to every month to keep up.

The real reason they want them to stay off ROAR; See above answer to the first reason.

I am not bashing the companies, that are holding back the technology. Without the companies, that are in the game now, we would not have a hobby or racing. But not giving a choice is really not a good idea, those who will evolve with the hobby will win over those who hold it back
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Old 09-21-2007, 11:52 PM   #132
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Originally Posted by Wild Cherry View Post
Lou , Roar is offering this endurance truck class as the only option if you wish you race with a Li-Po ...

The other class`s ?
Roar will not allow anyone to race with a Li-po....

Ask um why Lou .....

I will get a kick if they even reply and give you a reason why they won`t allow again next year ....
Well, hopefully it will be a popular class. lipos are still relatively new but i can't really see r/c not adapting to the lipo/brushless technology. it's coming, and in some cases already here. i think all we have to do is wait and try and prove that it is part of the new rc era.
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Old 09-22-2007, 08:09 PM   #133
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I hope I dont get flamed too badly, but maybe it is time for a new sanctioning body for electric racers.
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Old 09-22-2007, 08:25 PM   #134
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Andy, You are on to something there....ROAR must re-prioritize, or die. ROAR does not do a darn thing while tracks all over the U.S. are closing daily. Why not organize ROAR (or whatever organization) into something like motocross has and have a national point system, maybe 10 races in different regions of the U.S, and at the end of the year, hold a major event in Vegas to crown the overall points leaders. They could publicise the crap out of these races, and maybe get TV coverage on Spike or some other cable network. Some things gotta give to get new blood into this hobby to show how extreme it can be, seems like all the sports are "extreme" these days, and thats where all the young people are at.
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Old 09-23-2007, 12:21 AM   #135
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i see roar had a 13.5 truck race, at some upcoming event i saw in a recent magazine....but roar needs to let the 13.5 truck and buggy classes take over the 27turn classes.....stock is suppose to be for novice racers, brushless is aimed towards them.
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