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Old 07-08-2007, 08:20 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by UN4RACING View Post
I agree totally. Yet my owners manual say they can flame up.
thats possibly under certain circumstances. I have the manual. And I'm sure you do to.
Have you seen this.?
http://press.team-orion.com/press/av...am_quality.pdf

It looks that some day people will learn that you can over peak.
And there will be some serious experiments going on.
This is the fear. We can be thankfull Orion is pretesting in the ability to put out warnings to the future of Lipos. Its inevitable. And you can bet when Orion finds a way to cram 6000 MAH's into that case I'll buy them.
Yes I have seen that in the manual. I also remember the 1C charging limitation they had. That's now been changed to 2C with further testing at least according to the threads here. Here's a quote from an email I received from Orion recently - "The Orion LiPo will not explode or torch even if over charged they will simply puff and pop like a paper bag. Too date we have only had one customer even manage to do this." Now, I haven't tried this as I don't have money to burn(literally). I have been looking and can find no reports of an Orion cell flaming. With how much usage they are surely getting by now I would think someone has screwed up.

BTW, did you see MrBlacks pics in the 20 min Stadium thread? If I ever do endurance that's my method right there.
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Old 07-08-2007, 08:33 PM   #17
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Sure Did. Almost tried it then decided to pick up some 6000's instead.
Is this it.?

Last edited by UN4RACING; 08-21-2008 at 08:01 AM.
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Old 07-08-2007, 08:38 PM   #18
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I run two 2s 6000 Maxamps batteries in series (14.8vdc) in my electric Losi 8ight I have them positioned just like the orion's above
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Old 07-08-2007, 09:37 PM   #19
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Craps wrote:

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What a shame to pay twice as much for battery because it is in a useless plastic box!!!
If you compare prices at Tower, Kokam's 4800 costs only $10 less than Orion's 4800 that also has Kokam cells, a fuse, balancing port, and protective hard case. Sounds like a good deal to me.

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Even if Maxamps does use Kokam, there are several types and qualities available from them. In a recent thread I'll look for in a bit, a maxamps pack ignited at a race. I think it was the 6000 pack. Granted it was mistreated but this would not have happened with a properly protected pack. I think lipo users need to be as safe as possible at all times if they ever want the tech to become more widely accepted.
As an Orion and Maxamps lipo owner and avid lipophile, I believe that Kokam and Enerland cells in protective hard cases are the only way to go at this time. They're the only cells that have been proven to be safer than NIMH. I like my Maxamps 8000, but not everyone runs electric stadium pro truck like me and Craps, and other classes need batteries that can take some serious abuse.

That Maxamps 6000 went off like a blowtorch at Mike's Hobby Shop in Dallas, TX. He is possibly the only indoor track owner in Region 9 who allows lipos and he ended up with a fire under the driver's stand and a bunch of lipo goo on his shoe. That happened on an ozite track and the outcome could have been a lot worse. I fear that some people trying to save a buck or two are going to ruin it for the rest of us. The Orion 3200 is perfect for a cf chassis, and the new orion lipos will hopefully be perfect for indoor offroad and electric stadium pro truck. I think that Maxamps has its place in the industry, but I don't believe that place should be indoors...
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Old 07-08-2007, 10:15 PM   #20
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Yeah Orion is out there. Load and clear. Here we are, they are transparent with there product and it will hopefully force all of the competitors to meet and exceed all the standards as Orion, though Kokam is the leader Orion is there proving ground.
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Old 07-09-2007, 06:18 AM   #21
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Sure Did. Almost tried it then decided to pick up some 6000's instead.
Is this it.?
That's the one. It looks like what I did with my 24V Lithium drill when the charger crapped out and I was in the middle of a project. 3 in series with a whole lotta zipties.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leodis View Post
Craps wrote:
As an Orion and Maxamps lipo owner and avid lipophile, I believe that Kokam and Enerland cells in protective hard cases are the only way to go at this time. They're the only cells that have been proven to be safer than NIMH. I like my Maxamps 8000, but not everyone runs electric stadium pro truck like me and Craps, and other classes need batteries that can take some serious abuse.

That Maxamps 6000 went off like a blowtorch at Mike's Hobby Shop in Dallas, TX. He is possibly the only indoor track owner in Region 9 who allows lipos and he ended up with a fire under the driver's stand and a bunch of lipo goo on his shoe. That happened on an ozite track and the outcome could have been a lot worse. I fear that some people trying to save a buck or two are going to ruin it for the rest of us. The Orion 3200 is perfect for a cf chassis, and the new orion lipos will hopefully be perfect for indoor offroad and electric stadium pro truck. I think that Maxamps has its place in the industry, but I don't believe that place should be indoors...
Well to be fair I heard it was the driveshaft that cut into the pack as well as a lot of impacts. That would cause most lipos to have an issue. I guess my biggest concern is every lipo fire regardless of the reason is fuel for the fire(pun intended) that causes anyone anti-lipo to launch yet another series of pictures of melted batteries. Usually along with "At least this wasn't in your house" like it proves something. While I don't care what they think it's the people on the fence who see these scary pictures and quite likely decide against it.

I'm loving that people are running long mains with lipo as it's really starting to show the capabilities of these batteries.
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Old 07-09-2007, 06:31 AM   #22
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That's the one. It looks like what I did with my 24V Lithium drill when the charger crapped out and I was in the middle of a project. 3 in series with a whole lotta zipties.


Well to be fair I heard it was the driveshaft that cut into the pack as well as a lot of impacts. That would cause most lipos to have an issue. I guess my biggest concern is every lipo fire regardless of the reason is fuel for the fire(pun intended) that causes anyone anti-lipo to launch yet another series of pictures of melted batteries. Usually along with "At least this wasn't in your house" like it proves something. While I don't care what they think it's the people on the fence who see these scary pictures and quite likely decide against it.

I'm loving that people are running long mains with lipo as it's really starting to show the capabilities of these batteries.
The shorter the main the longer they last. You can make a 6000 last forever running 5 and 6 minute mains. If you run it 5 and charge it. Run it 5 and charge it. The less you drain it per runs the better.
My 4800's when I sold them were as good as the day I bought them. They had about 3 0r 4 10 minute runs on them. It comes to show just how much of a difference a case can make. Those wires dangling out there are an accident waiting to happen.
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Old 07-09-2007, 07:10 AM   #23
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I quess everybody forgets how dangerous nickel batteries are...seen a several nickel cells pop throwing hot sharp metal casing like a hand grenade with no warning like a li-po will give by swelling up way before there is a problem!!!

4 years of li-po racing experience and I have yet to see one catch fire, explode or burn.
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Old 07-09-2007, 07:53 AM   #24
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I quess everybody forgets how dangerous nickel batteries are...seen a several nickel cells pop throwing hot sharp metal casing like a hand grenade with no warning like a li-po will give by swelling up way before there is a problem!!!

4 years of li-po racing experience and I have yet to see one catch fire, explode or burn.
Yep.
And some thing to consider. The more you sell the more likely you will hear of it.
If there cheap and your selling triple the competitor you are likely to have more pop. So to be fair you would have to calculate the owner the use of the owner the amount of packs sold VS. the amount of the competitor and so on.

Theres some oval guys around here running some el'cheapo's and have not had one single issue.
Yet the case and the fuse are a tough quality to argue. That will add for the extra cost of the pack and the piece of mind of that particular pack.
I would expect that will be a rule of thumb in the future.

Or the kits will evolve to a more forgiving battery compartment and universal cases per battery speck will come about.
Like the ones you may have seen in the 1/8th scale buggies.

Now theres a future.
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Old 07-10-2007, 12:24 PM   #25
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anyone used the gold trakpower lipo?? that thing sounds sweet and has got amazing reviews oople.com
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Old 07-10-2007, 12:50 PM   #26
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anyone used the gold trakpower lipo?? that thing sounds sweet and has got amazing reviews oople.com
I have heard good things about it but no personal experience. In one of the orion threads linger was discussing the differences in discharge rates between the Kokam and Enerland cells and I think Trakpower was using Enerland. Kokam performs better during higher amp draws while Enerland does better in the lower amps. End result was Kokam for mod and Enerland for stock and 19T. Whether the differences would be noticed in a real world application I don't know.

I'll have to look it up but I swear I read that the Trakpower doesn't have the lifespan that the Orion packs have. I do like really like the balancer they came out with for their packs which can also be used for Orion's.

Edit: Found the post with all the info. linger talks about the pack degradation at the end of this post: http://www.rctech.net/forum/showpost...postcount=1144
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Old 07-10-2007, 12:52 PM   #27
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I can tell you that Killer and I were both at Revelation running 4wd...he had the 6000 maxamps and I had a 4800 Platinum. We both had them charged and went out at about the same time and we were both running similar setups (same cars, both had mild brushless setups, same charger), obviously the same track...he would dump and I wouldn't. I could stay out at least twice as long.

You squishy Lipo fans can protest all you want, but when my year-old, (at the time, still have it), well-worn 4800 lasts longer than a week-old 6000, there's a problem. It probably had something to do with the case...and the lack of one on the Maxamp battery.

Getting banged around comes with the territory in offroad (or R/C in general) and the Peak/Orion cells are made to get banged around and still live.
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Old 07-10-2007, 01:13 PM   #28
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i wonder what lipo battery jeff would recommend??
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Old 07-10-2007, 02:03 PM   #29
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i wonder what lipo battery jeff would recommend??
Do you know if the makers of Liposack have a full size car sack in the works yet?
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Old 07-10-2007, 03:08 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Turbo Joe View Post
I can tell you that Killer and I were both at Revelation running 4wd...he had the 6000 maxamps and I had a 4800 Platinum. We both had them charged and went out at about the same time and we were both running similar setups (same cars, both had mild brushless setups, same charger), obviously the same track...he would dump and I wouldn't. I could stay out at least twice as long.
There must be something wrong with the 6000. In my experience the Platinum 4800's can't touch a Maxamps 6000 in run time. And they shoudn't.
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