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Old 03-04-2007, 05:26 PM   #16
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Over time I have ran Losi and AE vehicles. Mod and gas truck with each. One thing I can say is that proper adjustment is key. One thing I found that will kill the diff is to overtighten it during the first build. Most kit manuals tell you to tighten them all the way down and then back off "x" amount of turns.

What happens is people will tighten the diff until they can't turn the wrench anymore, then back it off. What this does of flat spot the balls into the rings from the get go, leading the premature failure. I prefer to actually tighten the diff until I feel it getting pretty snug, then from there tighten for proper action.

ALWAYS make sure before you run (the first one especially) that the slipper slips BEFORE the diff. Alot of people will burn up the diff due to the slipper not acting properly, then on jump landings or in ruts they kill the diff. To check the slipper first, hold the left tire and spur gear, and turn the right tire with the other hand. The SLIPPER should be turning. If the diff turns before your slipper, this is probably the reason your eating diffs up.

Sorry to make it DIFF 101 here, but with proper tuning skills, there really wouldn't be an X versus Y discussion.
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Old 03-04-2007, 05:31 PM   #17
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i was only speaking of my first hand experiences from the two trucks and buggies. i had both mf1 and mf2 along with the buggies and now i run t4, b4 and it is just what i experienced. the losi trannys work great but there are some things you can do to make them last a little longer is. their not weak or unreliable, but i experienced more wear in my losi's than i do in my AE cars. it still will always come done to driver anways so it really doesn't matter how anything works along as you can drive it.
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Old 03-04-2007, 05:39 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AzBobby
i was only speaking of my first hand experiences from the two trucks and buggies. i had both mf1 and mf2 along with the buggies and now i run t4, b4 and it is just what i experienced. the losi trannys work great but there are some things you can do to make them last a little longer is. their not weak or unreliable, but i experienced more wear in my losi's than i do in my AE cars. it still will always come done to driver anways so it really doesn't matter how anything works along as you can drive it.
I agree that with first hand experience I have had more durability with the diffs with the AE. But really, for the cost of a rebuild, and with any significant race I would do a rebuild anyway, I don't really see it as a hinderuance, as mine would get freshened either way. But for a sportsman racer not looking to do as much maintanece, yes I do think the AE diffs get more longevity.
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Old 03-04-2007, 05:41 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brandon Melton
I agree that with first hand experience I have had more durability with the diffs with the AE. But really, for the cost of a rebuild, and with any significant race I would do a rebuild anyway, I don't really see it as a hinderuance, as mine would get freshened either way. But for a sportsman racer not looking to do as much maintanece, yes I do think the AE diffs get more longevity.
right that was my point the first time but sometimes it doesnt come very clear cause i cant type and i hate to type, so i dont say it well sometimes. sorry guys. i go through mine alot as well but when its just club racing for months on end i don't gewt in there very much, unless something fails or my adjustment gets out and then it fails cause i was lazy. no parts cost for either is good.
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Old 03-04-2007, 05:59 PM   #20
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I've not run much losi stuff recently, but have raced the XX4. XXX4 and XXXbk1 cars over the years and the diffs have never been a patch on the b4 or similar.

On the flip side, I always found the Losi shocks lasted longer before a rebuild was needed.
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Old 03-04-2007, 07:20 PM   #21
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Thanks guys, good discussion and good information. I went and drove one of the faster guys t4's today, for 3 packs worth. It was different, but I attribute the biggest part of that to setup, and I didnt see any great potential for lap gains that would have tipped my decision one way or the other.
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Old 03-04-2007, 09:23 PM   #22
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nope its all driving style. once i got kinda good i found going back to AE i liked alot. only because i want to have more steering than i really need at any given time to move around or drive any line on a track. and to react to mistakes by myself or others that i want to miss. the tranny really wont make your faster or slower just due to reliability issues. the output is what you should worry about if you were looking for quicker lap times not reliability. as to being able to handle mod,brushed,brushless, or lipos they both can do it.
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Old 03-04-2007, 11:14 PM   #23
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Yeah the tranny reliability thing was what I started with as a question, but I had wandered off into the whole Losi Vs Associated thing. No I didnt expect that aspect to make a big difference in lap times, just maintenance. I guess I switched topics there.
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Old 03-05-2007, 06:46 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brandon Melton
I agree that with first hand experience I have had more durability with the diffs with the AE. But really, for the cost of a rebuild, and with any significant race I would do a rebuild anyway, I don't really see it as a hinderuance, as mine would get freshened either way. But for a sportsman racer not looking to do as much maintanece, yes I do think the AE diffs get more longevity.
I pretty much agree with this guy. At a MINIMUM, flip your rings every 2-3 months and rebuild the entire thing every 6 months. Have a spare diff in your bag during a major race just in case.

I don't have problems with the diff in my MF2, and I run a mamba max 5700 with 13t pinion, so I am running major torque. I have the slipper set so it will slip before the diff but even if I set the slipper to full lock, I still don't hear/feel the diff slip.
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Old 03-05-2007, 07:24 AM   #25
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AE have a slight advantage here because the main diff balls are further apart. So an AE diff can handle a little bit more torque.

That being said, there is no substitute for regular maintenance.

More info here: http://users.pandora.be/elvo/12/8/
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Old 03-07-2007, 05:00 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron Waldron
I'm not sold on ceramic diff balls. Something has to give somewhere; if you use harder diff balls, you're going to put more stress on the rings. You can make the diff smooth with stock parts, I don't think there's any reason for anything else.
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I am not saying your wrong, but consider the fact that ceramic is the best material known to man to handle heat and friction. Heat and friction are your enemy when it comes to moving parts that contact each other. The cooler the ball is the cooler it is on the rings that includes alot less wear on both due to the lack of heat. Cooler tranny temps equal longer maintence/adjustment intervals.

We are racing weekly with them in out trucks for 20 minute electric mains and as I said earlier, the outdrives/bones are wearing out way before we need to touch the diff. I have noticed with the ceramic balls that once you get it adjusted, you don't need to touch it anymore. A 20 minute race is alot harder on the tranny than 4-5 minute races because you are building and holding that heat in the tranny over 20 minutes that a 5 minute races allows to cool off.

Something to consider!
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Old 03-07-2007, 12:32 PM   #27
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Craps - I agree, ceramic balls sound great on paper and should work better than the stock rings for many reasons. I run gas truck all the time, with 20-30-45 minute mains (or longer), and have experienced the same thing; you'll wear dogbone pins and outdrives before the diff needs attention.

It's possible to build a great diff with stock parts, so I have never been able to justify telling someone they 'need' to buy different balls, different thrust bearing, different lubes or greases, etc. But I understand there are many racers who have great luck with a variety of different items.
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Old 03-07-2007, 01:32 PM   #28
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The majority of time the diff feels gritty is due to the thrust washer and balls, not the 3/32 diff balls. Not sure about Losi but the AE cars come with the carbide balls in the kit. I have used the carbide balls for 4-5 rebuilds and they always felt as good as new as long as you don't flat spot them by overtightening. Most of the time the thrust washers and diff rings alone is all you need for the rebuild if you have carbide balls.
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Old 03-07-2007, 01:54 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron Waldron
Craps - I agree, ceramic balls sound great on paper and should work better than the stock rings for many reasons. I run gas truck all the time, with 20-30-45 minute mains (or longer), and have experienced the same thing; you'll wear dogbone pins and outdrives before the diff needs attention.

It's possible to build a great diff with stock parts, so I have never been able to justify telling someone they 'need' to buy different balls, different thrust bearing, different lubes or greases, etc. But I understand there are many racers who have great luck with a variety of different items.
Have to agree with Aaron on this one ...
The Ae diff does not require any ceramic`s ...
and
Its the smoothest, most durable diff ever created....
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Old 03-07-2007, 02:10 PM   #30
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The biggest trick I found for keeping the losi diff nice and smooth for a long period of time is to tear it down, clean and re-lube it after the first weekend you run it. After that re-lube every few weeks of racing. The parts will last a very long time if you do that. Also make sure your slipper is adjusted to slip a bit on hard acceleration.
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