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Bang For Buck 17.5

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Old 09-11-2019, 02:27 PM
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Originally Posted by billdelong View Post
Curious what "pretty far out of spec" means to you?
More than any other motors I tested, usually around 6* that would not change by simply shimming or advancing the timing. FWIW, these analyzers are pretty inaccurate. I also see these variances deviate a little by simply testing a couple times in a row.
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Old 09-11-2019, 06:26 PM
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Originally Posted by BRSracing View Post
I read SMC is doing away with making motors..........
thats a bummer if true, I love the 3 i have.
that might be why they dont have the 13.5 on the site anymore. :/
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Old 09-14-2019, 08:37 PM
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Sounds like these motors are popular because they run a little hotter than a ROAR approved and spec'd motor. Wouldn't that be considered an unfair advantage sort of like pushing batteries to the extreme and running them at higher voltages? Are people looking for a way to side step the rules? Or am I totally missing the point?
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Old 09-15-2019, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by zipperfoot View Post
Sounds like these motors are popular because they run a little hotter than a ROAR approved and spec'd motor. Wouldn't that be considered an unfair advantage sort of like pushing batteries to the extreme and running them at higher voltages? Are people looking for a way to side step the rules? Or am I totally missing the point?
The Punisher motors help level the playing field so folks can buy a $75 motor that is comparable to a $150 Team Motor, this allows the Average Joe's access to similar performance gear without having to get a sponsorship, it helps end the motor wars while still allowing the sponsored drivers to continue running their high end brand motor without violating their contract. When their is a big ROAR event, then the motors must be ROAR spec, where presumably the Average Joe's don't typically run the big races.
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Old 09-15-2019, 11:21 AM
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Originally Posted by billdelong View Post
The Punisher motors help level the playing field so folks can buy a $75 motor that is comparable to a $150 Team Motor, this allows the Average Joe's access to similar performance gear without having to get a sponsorship, it helps end the motor wars while still allowing the sponsored drivers to continue running their high end brand motor without violating their contract. When their is a big ROAR event, then the motors must be ROAR spec, where presumably the Average Joe's don't typically run the big races.
say what?
what about southern nats? AMS, Wicked weekend.?
all big races. These kind of races and other like these are more influential on rc racing than dnc or pnb etc. The up and coming racers have a stage to perform without being plowed over by the elite.
i disagree that it levels out the playing field. Theres no event that the joes can race the pros with an outlaw motor. So whats the point? The only reason for running an outlaw motor is club racing, maybe. Some small clubs have an outlaw class. Few and far between though. I mean, there's a class for everything now. MOST tracks will not allow an outlaw even on a club night. And if you run one anyways, well then you need more help than an outlaw motor can give you. They're of no interest to a basher, and you cant run them in stock. A mute point in mod. Personally I think manufacturers should do away with outlaw motors. Just give a wrong idea of what youre actually supposed to concentrate your efforts on. 🤪 phweeuu,,,, that was a rant...
now before everyone goes nutso, these are just opinions 😄
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Old 09-15-2019, 11:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Funkydrummer1 View Post
The only reason for running an outlaw motor is club racing
this is basically what I said, outlaw motors are not for most big events, typically a ROAR sanctioned event... most pros attend club races too. Anyone who is a sponsored driver for a competing brand will not support the outlaw motors because they will want to maintain the advantage they have with having access to a "Team Motor" which is not available to the public, simple as that. Many clubs recognize this problem which is why they allow the outlaw motors to help level the playing field and keep costs lower.
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Old 09-15-2019, 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by billdelong View Post
this is basically what I said, outlaw motors are not for most big events, typically a ROAR sanctioned event... most pros attend club races too. Anyone who is a sponsored driver for a competing brand will not support the outlaw motors because they will want to maintain the advantage they have with having access to a "Team Motor" which is not available to the public, simple as that. Many clubs recognize this problem which is why they allow the outlaw motors to help level the playing field and keep costs lower.
I don't know about anyone else but the Pros I've raced against in the past during club races ran circles around me. Literally lapped me during the race. I remember years back a local Pro entered a Mod buggy race with a 17.5 and blew away the field. (Hint... it's not the motor). It's going to take more than an outlaw motor to hang with a pro.

That is why I feel the few who used these outlaw motors did so just to gain an advantage over their local club racing brothers and sisters.

Now they all use them... so they form a special class for the outlaw motors? Too funny. In reality we are back to where we started, competing against each other on equal terms even if it's not ROAR approved.
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Old 09-15-2019, 12:27 PM
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Originally Posted by billdelong View Post
this is basically what I said, outlaw motors are not for most big events, typically a ROAR sanctioned event... most pros attend club races too. Anyone who is a sponsored driver for a competing brand will not support the outlaw motors because they will want to maintain the advantage they have with having access to a "Team Motor" which is not available to the public, simple as that. Many clubs recognize this problem which is why they allow the outlaw motors to help level the playing field and keep costs lower.
even if theres no rule for outlaw motor at your lhs, my experience is that racers look down on guys that run outlaws. But like it was said, if you think you need an outlaw to get faster laps, you need more than that.
Most, not all but most lhs has no outlaw blinky.
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Old 09-15-2019, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by zipperfoot View Post
I don't know about anyone else but the Pros I've raced against in the past during club races ran circles around me. Literally lapped me during the race. I remember years back a local Pro entered a Mod buggy race with a 17.5 and blew away the field. (Hint... it's not the motor). It's going to take more than an outlaw motor to hang with a pro.

That is why I feel the few who used these outlaw motors did so just to gain an advantage over their local club racing brothers and sisters.

Now they all use them... so they form a special class for the outlaw motors? Too funny. In reality we are back to where we started, competing against each other on equal terms even if it's not ROAR approved.
yep!!! A pro will woop your ouaw on a gen 1 motor
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Old 09-15-2019, 01:29 PM
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There are varying levels of pro drivers out there, I'm talking about the bottom tier pro's who get a nominal discount, some might call these "fake sponsorships", these are guys that are definitely fast guys, but are not going to keep up with elite drivers that are world class ranked. Not uncommon to see many Average Joe's in my area without any sponsorship to run a Punisher and beat many local pros (at the lower level) and it's not that the Punisher is any faster than the name brand Team Driver motor they are running, the Punisher motor gets their cars to run equally as fast as the pro drivers ROAR legal motor, that's the point you two are missing.
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Old 09-15-2019, 01:44 PM
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Originally Posted by billdelong View Post
There are varying levels of pro drivers out there, I'm talking about the bottom tier pro's who get a nominal discount, some might call these "fake sponsorships", these are guys that are definitely fast guys, but are not going to keep up with elite drivers that are world class ranked. Not uncommon to see many Average Joe's in my area without any sponsorship to run a Punisher and beat many local pros (at the lower level) and it's not that the Punisher is any faster than the name brand Team Driver motor they are running, the Punisher motor gets their cars to run equally as fast as the pro drivers ROAR legal motor, that's the point you two are missing.
I get what youre saying man. Its nice to have close racing. Thats stock racing for ya!!! LOL
LOVE IT
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Old 09-15-2019, 02:04 PM
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Honestly, Iím not even sure my Punisher 13.5 motor is faster than my Team Powers off the shelf.
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Old 09-15-2019, 02:09 PM
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Originally Posted by RazorRC View Post
Honestly, Iím not even sure my Punisher 13.5 motor is faster than my Team Powers off the shelf.
thats what Im sayin
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Old 09-17-2019, 04:30 PM
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Originally Posted by billdelong View Post
There are varying levels of pro drivers out there, I'm talking about the bottom tier pro's who get a nominal discount, some might call these "fake sponsorships", these are guys that are definitely fast guys, but are not going to keep up with elite drivers that are world class ranked. Not uncommon to see many Average Joe's in my area without any sponsorship to run a Punisher and beat many local pros (at the lower level) and it's not that the Punisher is any faster than the name brand Team Driver motor they are running, the Punisher motor gets their cars to run equally as fast as the pro drivers ROAR legal motor, that's the point you two are missing.
So you are buying a specific motor just to beat a small group of so called "bottom tier pros"? What about all of your fellow racers that are sticking to approved motors and playing by the rules? My question is why would you want to run in a spec'd class just to find a way to gain an unfair advantage? Big deal the guy with the "fake sponsorship" is getting better motors, so what? If it's ROAR approved, it's technically within spec. Those running non conforming motors should be placed in the mod class. Just because one motor costs more than another should not be an excuse to circumvent rules.

Just my opinion. To me the whole point of racing in a spec'd class is to test my skills against other drivers using the same equipment.

There are many ways look at this. For example, I like my MT44 radio better than any other radio. I could buy just about any radio I wanted and have tried many, but I choose to run a "Lower tier radio". Does that give the other guy with a $700 radio an advantage? Maybe. In fact what if one brand of buggy handles better than another brand, does that mean the other guy has an unfair advantage? If a kit comes with all bling parts to make it stand out, does that mean it's unfair to the person who buys the standard kit? I think if you are going to run a spec'd class, stay within spec.

Last edited by zipperfoot; 09-17-2019 at 09:00 PM.
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Old 09-17-2019, 06:41 PM
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Originally Posted by zipperfoot View Post
So you are buying a specific motor just to beat a small group of so called "bottom tier pros"? What about all of your fellow racers that are sticking to approved motors and playing by the rules? My question is why would you want to run in a spec'd class just to find a way to gain an unfair advantage? Big deal the guy with the "fake sponsorship" is getting better motors, so what? If it's ROAR approved, it's technically within spec. Those running non conforming motors should be placed in the mod class. Just because one motor costs more than another should not be an excuse to circumvent rules.

Just my opinion. To me the whole point of racing in a spec'd class is to test my skills against other drivers using the same equipment.

There are many waist look at this. For example, I like my MT44 radio better than any other radio. I could buy just about any radio I wanted and have tried many, but I choose to run a "Lower tier radio". Does that give the other guy with a $700 radio an advantage? Maybe. In fact what if one brand of buggy handles better than another brand, does that mean the other guy has an unfair advantage? If a kit comes with all bling parts to make it stand out, does that mean it's unfair to the person who buys the standard kit? I think if you are going to run a spec'd class, stay within spec.
Exactly. The only reason outlaw motors exist is because people still think you have to go faster to go faster. Usually faster means driving beyond your limits. Or the cars. When that happens, you fight the car. When that happens you crash.
faster means nothing. Lower lap times is what you want. And those are two totally different things.
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