Blackout XTE Motor/ ESC upgrade Options? 2019
 

Hello. This is my first post here and I realize this has been asked / answered before. However, it appears that the motor linked previously is now discontinued so I'm not completely sure what my selection should be. With that out of the way, I have a blackout XTE that i got for free, I swapped in some 7.4v 5000 mah 25c Lipo batteries and after my second run with the batteries burned the motor out.


I'm looking to replace the motor for a brushless design and ESC as a result. What are some recommended combos? I've spent several hours today researching but don't want to spend $100 on a combo just to have something burn out again so I've decided to turn to those who are more experienced.


I was looking at the following combo:

(Sorry, can't post links yet) QUICRUN 3650 Sensored brushless motor G2 Timing 10.5T (3600kv) and QUICRUN 10 Brushless ESC Sensored (2-3S). I assumed the sensored version will better prevent motor overheating in the future? My main concern on this combo is the current at Max output power of the motor is 62A and might damage the ESC?


Info that might help:

• 7.4v 5000 mah 25c Lipo's
• 18T Motor Gear
• 55T Spur Gear
• The XTE Pro uses a 3800kv Brushless motor
• At the time the truck mostly sees grass duty.

I'm willing to spend around $100 - $130 for a good combination, so if my money would be better spent somewhere else (for performance and reliability) please let me know.


Thanks

P.S.
If you could elaborate as to why you make that recommendation or what makes it better I would appreciate it as doing so would help me understand the train of thought.

Take note on the length of motor and the amount of room you have to mount a new motor. That extra protective plastic cover, around the XTE's ESC, may need to go/be modified when thinking about some 3656, or 3660 size motors. I'm not quite sure on the amount of power the tranny can handle. Even though the Pro version uses a 540 size motor, I'd be shoving in a 550, or even a 3660 motor in there. Why? I'd want to make sure I had enough torque to turn all four of them big tires. That's just me. Different motors have different quality. Most 4 pole 540/3650 motors could get the job done...just gotta gear 'em right.

Just check to make sure of sizes on anything for possible fitment.

Cheap 80A ESC route: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Waterproof-...LCOFXUCg%3D%3D

I got some extra cash 120A ESC route: https://www.amainhobbies.com/hobbywi...010201/p607216

Thanks for these notes. The stock xte motor is a brushed 550 --- I didn't realize the 3656/3660 designation was merrily a dimension designation, so the XTE stock motor has roughly a 63.5mm body and only a couple mm to spare. I'm pretty handy with a dremel so the ESC shield can be easily modified.

From what I saw in research it looked like a lower kv would provide essentially more torque and less top end power. I did look at that motor earlier but had a couple reservations regarding it being sensorless and the shaft diameter (just ordered 2 more motor gears for 3.175, but not a big deal since they're cheap). Regarding gearing, is it really just a trial and error deal? IE; test different gearing and keep an eye on the temps along the way? Assuming I understand everything correctly, consider a new motor itself being "better" and the XTE Pro (same chassis) uses a 3800kv motor and 18T Pinion gear... By jumping to a 4000kv motor I can counteract that change by dropping a tooth in the pinion gear and see a similar powerband?

I'll keep researching options before making a purchase decision. Thanks for any help.

Alright,
So I got the EZ Run combo posted. Got everything installed. didn't have to do too much trimming for the ESC but did have to trim a bit to allow wiring and capacitor clearance. I took the stock motor's heatsink off and attached it to the new one. I installed the 16T pinion gear and let it rip.

Motor temps were pretty solid right at 150F. I've been bashing it a bit. The car is very quick to get going, rips up the grass, etc etc, pulls wheelies from a stop depending on terrain. First day testing the motor out and checking temps I did a bunch of jumps, can confirm all electronics in the car are water-safe after taking it for a dip in a pond. Did a bunch of jumps --- blew the rear shocks and broke off the bottom spring seat. Purchased some Pro-Line PowerStroke shocks/springs for the front and rear (hoping/asssuming they fit)-- I decided to splurge because I'd rather not replace broken shocks every other run. Got a variety of shock oils to test out. In the meantime I swapped some shocks/springs from the Blackout XTE truck and it turns out (this was a customer return) that the springs/shocks are not the same between the truck and SUV, with the truck having a much more firm suspension - assuming it was stock that was returned.

I've run the car through a few battery cycles no issue on concrete/grass. I've been ripping up more grass today and near the end of my run-time started to hear clicking under heavy throttle. I knew right away it had to be a gear, checked spur and pinion, both checkout and look new. So I tested the car in front wheel drive (rear half shafts and suspension removed) and couldn't recreate the noise. Opened up the rear diff and it turns out the "hardened steel" gear is stripping. Other than the torque/load primarily going through the rear I can't come up with a great explanation. Is it possible to add too much grease to the gear? (there was some factory grease and I added maybe a pea size total to it) It looks like the gear is just screwed on and may be interchangeable with no mesh adjustment.

So I have a couple options to remedy the stripping gear, I'm thinking I turn the "Start Mode/ punch" down on the ESC, find a better diff gear vs replacing with OEM, and/or gearing up the pinion to reduce torque.

Any opinions / thoughts on the matter? Thanks.


P.S. Still can't embed images or upload them as attachments so that's helpful...

I would go down a tooth or two on the pinion gear. 150 degrees is on the high side especially in the winter months. I would also turn down the punch since that will lessen the stress on the drive train. The newest version of the Blackout comes with hardened steel ring gears instead of pot metal gears. You can tell the difference since a hardened steel gear is really smooth with a nice finished surface. A pot metal gear is poured and looks cast, sometimes kind of rough looking.

Another consideration is that grass is probably the toughest terrain for an R/C vehicle. Dirt is much more forgiving and less strain on the drive train.

Brian

Lubing the ring/pinion is user discretional on the amount of grease you want to use. A thin coating is all that is needed. Your diff gears, on the other hand, are sealed with o-rings, and a gasket so you can fill them up with diff fluid if you wish to do so.

Talking about the diff gears, you may want to check the lateral movement of the diff gear in the gearbox. Over time, the ring/pinion gears will wear down and I had to do some shimming to get more life out of the diffs. The picture below is from another platform, but I posted to give you somewhat of an idea what maybe needed to do in order to get a good mesh.
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rct...d5195f3d64.jpg

I agree/imagine grass is the toughest due to the constantly inconsistent extra drag. When I did my testing it was around 82F ambient (Savannah, GA), I'll have to check but I thought anything under 200 should be "safe" though I imagine produces excess stress and wear on components. I'll keep pinion Tooth count in mind as I continue testing everything out. It's a little worrying to drop more teeth while stripping gears, but I also haven't played with the punch setting yet to see its effect. This Blackout XTE was purchased back in Feb 2018. I see RCR sells the hardened steel diff and assumed that wasn't something that changed over the years. As best as I can tell, this might be the pot metal one, the non-wear areas are a bit roughly finished but the teeth/greased points are now polished shiny. :sweat: I'll pick up an extra couple diffs from RCR and see how things go there.

I did pop open the diff unit and found what you described JUST before reading this, it comes fairly heavily greased inside. I can't imagine there are any material benefits with adding a diff fluid - outside of very high speed applications? I like this image though, I would have never thought you could shim the unit to get a more ideal mesh - this one seemed a bit loose with its pinion (not sure the terming regarding multiple pinions?).

Thanks for the input guys I'll continue to update this thread and hopefully post pictures in the future, for people who will be researching this same modification. In the meantime you can view the installed motor and diff gear by viewing my photo album through my profile.

The part number for hardened diff is BS803-026A and the main gear has kind of a gold/bronze tint to it. The pot metal gears are silver.

The brushless motor temps should be 160 degrees or less but ideally no higher than 140 unless your doing more serious racing and aren't as concerned about motor life. Another tip is to go down a tooth or two on the pinion gear to get the temps down and then you can advance the timing to lower the low end torque and get back some of the top speed. Just keep an eye on the temps.

I would also see if the brushless esc has any torque settings other than the punch that you can lower. The Blackout is a light vehicle so the ideal motor size would be a 540 4 pole motor which has a little less torque than a 550 4 pole motor.

Adding diff fluid inside the diff is also a really good idea. It helps to keep the gears lubricated better than grease which tends to fling off of the gears. Something in the 7,000 to 10,000 range is a good place to start.

Brian

Thanks,
Just checked RCR's site, can confirm this XTE had the pot metal diff gear. Will be ordering the hardened steel diff unit. It doesn't look like this particular ESC has any other power related adjustments. It does have BEC Voltage 6v or 7.4v. I'm not sure what that stands for as the documentation with the ESC is pretty poor to explain it, default is 6v. Also doesn't show timing as an adjustable value, is that done through the ESC? I'm obviously still learning what all can be done with these hobby RC trucks. :D

Regarding the SUV vs TRUCK suspension noted earlier, it looks like the truck that was returned to us had the big bore shocks/springs installed and were not stock with that truck afaik.

The BEC setting is for the voltage to the servo. You want to keep this set at the default of 6v unless you upgrade to a high voltage servo.

The timing can usually be adjusted in the esc. It's different than the punch.

I'm pretty sure the newest Blackout trucks come with the plastic big bore shocks.

Brian