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TLR 22 5.0

Old 09-12-2019, 01:13 PM
  #961  
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Real dirt
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Old 09-12-2019, 05:25 PM
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This is my home track.
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Old 09-12-2019, 07:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Phillip F
This is my home track.
need more tracks like this again.
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Old 09-13-2019, 04:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Phillip F
My TLR 22-5.0 Elite is ready for the track. Will race it on a dirt track first see a if it's better than my dialed B6.1
Let us all know how it compares. I'm thinking about getting back into buggy so I'm particularly interested in the comparison.
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Old 09-13-2019, 06:10 AM
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Last edited by zipperfoot; 02-11-2020 at 08:50 AM.
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Old 09-13-2019, 09:48 AM
  #966  
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Originally Posted by shark2288


Im considering the 5.0 too for black carpet. Do you get the elite or the ac?
I think that's tough to answer. The AC is good out of the box. But the best carpet setups include some parts that now come in the ELITE like +2 front/rear shock towers, lower front wing and mount, stiffezel parts

Reason to Buy the AC
  • Kit cost $50 less to invest in other parts (+2 shock towers, stiffezel waterfall, brass)
  • Comes with swaybars F/R $35, Gear Diff $30
  • Already has the G3 shocks with 3.0mm shafts (better on carpet)
Reason to buy the ELITE
  • Comes with +2 Carbon Fiber Towers,
  • All black aluminum parts (looks cool!)
  • Includes new VHA rear hub Assembly $45, Rear Pivots C&D Blocks w/pills $35 (Testing VHA tonight for first time :-) )
  • Has 3.5mm shock shafts (not as good for carpet). Which shocks do you want to run?
  • Do you need a ball diff for dirt?
MUST HAVES FOR CARPET
  • Brass Electronics Mounting Plate, 34g: 22 5.0 (TLR331039) $10
  • Brass Battery Weight Set - 18g, 25g, 36g, (TLR331045) $20
  • (Optional IMO) Team Losi Racing 25 Front Brass Pivot (50g) (TLR334020) $40
Not sure if this makes it easier or harder to decide ;-)
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Old 09-13-2019, 11:12 AM
  #967  
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Originally Posted by dbracn
I agree, it seems rather confusing, if someone could help explain. Also is anyone able to explain the relationship between the diff height and the axle height. Do they work together or independent? Can you run one higher or lower than the other?

Suspension Pills - The number on the pill (0, .5, 1) represents how many degrees, from the stock settings, you want to change the angle of two main things (and 2 advanced settings): Rear Toe-in and Anti-squat. The default kit setting is 3 deg Rear Toe and 2 deg Anti-squat. This new set of blocks does add a massive amount of tune-ability options which means more unknowns for many as well. In the simplest terms, The C-Block sits in front of the rear suspension arm and the D-Block is on the rear of the car. If you want more toe-in on the rear wheels, you need to spread the rear pills which hold the hinge pins. This will pivot the suspension arms forward slightly and increase the angle of toe on the rear wheels. So widening the D-Block pill by .5 = 1/2 deg more rear toe. Widening by a 1 pill = adding 1 deg more rear toe. You can add or take away toe as you like. What makes it more complicated is that not only can you change the back D-Block pills, you can also change the C-Block as well. It's more about the relationship between the pills that sets this.


There is a 2nd dimension of adjustment beyond toe-in, it is the anti-squat angle of the rear suspension arms. The same logic of changing the angle of toe is also true for anti-squat. When thinking about this, disregard whatever your toe-in settings are for now. Now you care about how high or low the pills are in relation to each other. Lowering the D-Block pill, without moving the C-block pill height will increase anti-squat angle and visa versa. You also could raise/lower the C-Block pill instead. Just remember that the stock pill is 0, which provides 2 deg of anti-squat, so each pill changes by 0, .5, or 1 degree.


*NEW* The 3rd dimension is Roll Center - If you can keep the relationship between your C-Block and D-block pills the same, you can also raise or lower the pills to change the roll center of the rear suspension. LRC is slamming the pills down, and HRC is raising them up. Previously, you would have to buy several different C and D blocks to achieve all the range of settings which is now accomplished in one pair.


*NEW* The 4th dimension is track width - On top of all the other changes, if you keep your pill relationships the same, you can widen or narrow the distance between your hinge pins. So now you can change how wide the rear of the car is. So for this, move BOTH the C-Block AND D-Block pills (IN or OUT) as as set, to make the width adjustment.


Diff/Axle Heights - Think about it this way. If you run on high grip carpet, you want your car low to the ground. Like 15-18mm. This means that you lower the chassis by adjusting the spring collar settings. But what happens to the angle of the suspension arms? What about the axles, and all the mechanical joints and connections? If the diff was left at one of the lower settings 0,1,2, the axles (dog bones) would be at an angle when sitting at ride height. Then as you compress the suspension, that axle angle will increase further. The greater the axle angle, the less efficient the CVA joint performs. Also, the whole transmission moves with the chassis as well. So being able to adjust the diff height effects several things but the one that is most evident is that you can maintain keeping the drive axle as close to level (at ride height) as possible. So now, with the VHA hubs, you have the ability to adjust the axle height on the outside (in 1mm increments), to match the settings of the diff height in the inside. These two things can be adjusted independently if you like. Changing hub heights also effects cornering characteristics. Generally speaking, raising the axle +3 or +4mm, is more of a carpet setting and will provide a more linear feel. Lowering the axle (0/+1/+2 settings) are typically more for dirt. But using these settings tends to free up the back of the car, squaring corners more. The point at which traction breaks is more sudden.


Tuning options gallore.....have fun learning.
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Old 09-13-2019, 11:43 AM
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Originally Posted by RazorRC
Are the pills really that hard?

Go steeper (higher front or lower rear) to increase anti-squat.
Go more pointed in (narrower front or wider rear) to increase rear toe.

Both wider to go wider track width.
Both up to raise roll center.
I subscribe to your youtube ... would be super awesome if you do a video about this and explaining how it affects the handling of the buggy.
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Old 09-14-2019, 10:51 AM
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I've been considering a second 22 5.0, primarily for the parts...although, possibly for having two vehicles w/ two different setups. Before ordering my SR, I had considered ordering two kits (the old "the parts cost more than the whole" theory). However, with the recent release of the Elite, now I'm wondering if having ordered only one SR may have turned out to be the "smarter" move.

dkurschner posted a pretty good comparison of the AC vs Elite. Can anyone post a similar compassion of the SR vs Elite? I'm still considering that second 22 5.0, but now I'm "on the fence" as to whether I'd use it for parts for the SR already built, or (especially if I were to get the Elite) whether I'd build a second vehicle with a different setup. Besides, I'm sure I'm not the only one interested in seeing an SR vs Elite comparison, as there's bound to be others trying to decide between these two kits.
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Old 09-14-2019, 06:50 PM
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panther6834,

Not too much of a comparison between the sr and elite other than value. Main difference between the two cars is the drivetrain. Sr comes with the lightened diff, direct drive, and steel rear dogbones whereas the elite comes with a standard ball diff, slipper, and steel rear dogbones. Most who run stock run a slipper instead of a direct drive so that would help with the elite Big difference is the shocks. sr comes with the 3.0 mm shocks vs the elite comes with the 3.5 mm shocks. The car on clay is so much better with the 3.5 shocks. The value comes with the elite as it has the plus 2 towers, tons of aluminum, titanium,3.5 mm shocks, and black anodized hardware. For only about 50-60 dollars more its a far better value. You can run stock or mod with the elite whereas the sr you can only run stock. If you wanted to get the elite, you can purchase the sr drivetrain. SR diff would be 40-50, dogbones 15, and direct drive 25. Overall I would suggest the elite if you plan to run clay and stock. While the drivetrain is a little heavier in the elite, with the power of todays motors and batteries, you wont really notice a difference. Elite is awesome and has the newest rear end as well. Hope this helps.
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Old 09-14-2019, 07:41 PM
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Last edited by zipperfoot; 02-11-2020 at 08:45 AM.
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Old 09-14-2019, 11:35 PM
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I could see upgrading to the 3.5mm shocks...but, as for the +2mm towers, from what several people (including Frank) have said, it doesn't really offer any advantages. So...between the SR & Elite, it looks like money would be better spent on a second SR...at least for those running on clay/dirt. As for those running on Astro, or carpet, I can see the advantages of the Elite over the AC.
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Old 09-15-2019, 01:55 AM
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I found the +2 towers to make a big difference.
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Old 09-16-2019, 07:08 AM
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I will be running clay with 17.5. Elite here all day long.
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Old 09-17-2019, 12:53 PM
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Is there any way to run non TLR front wheels on the 22 5.0 say using a spacer on the outside of the Hub between the hacks and the Hub, removing those two small washers on the inside of the Hub where the screw goes to the outside of the Hub?
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