I would choose not to deal with Jake S again
09-21-2007, 06:53 PM
#1
I would choose not to deal with Jake S again
Bought two CO27 motors from Jake S on his offer http://www.rctech.net/forum/showthread.php?t=180791 . They were listed as having 2 and 3 cuts each and BOTH including a new set of Putnam Green brushes. The motors arrive and, surprise, the pic was taken with poor lighting AND at the only angle that wouldn't reveal they look like hell. Ah well...my fault for not asking for better pics, and they were $16/shipped for the pair. My pic of the motors is attached below--his are on the thread linked above.
Keep in mind...I paid HIS price including shipping. He was not beaten up in any way on price.
The motors arrived with no brushes. I sent an e-mail asking if they'd been inadvertently not packed, lost, etc. The first reply was to check the garbage, that they're in a baggie. Let him know if they weren't there and he'd send some 767 brushes.
One of the big attractions to the package was that he was offering brushes that priced alone plus shipping would have been $16. I've wanted to try Putnam Greens, and I've already got 767's coming out of my ears from a bulk buy. Also, I hadn't thrown the packing (wadded up newspaper) away so I looked through it again. Nothing. I sent him a pm offering three different resolutions to the problem.
a) Find the brushes and send them (my guess was they'd been accidentally forgotten).
b) The brushes are priced at $5.50/pr at my lhs--Stormer. Credit me $11 via PayPal
c) I send the motors back and he credits me back the $16 plus return post.
I would have been cool with any of them.
His reply was that I am "outta my mind" if I thought he was going to refund $11 on $16/shipped motors. Nice. Also that he KNEW the brushes were packed in there because he packaged everything at the campus post office. Guess what--he left them sitting on the counter.
Notice he immediately jumped on the one option that "cost" him the most, ignoring the other two. If these were such great motors you'd think he'd KNOW he could sell 'em and recoup his money if he bought them back...but he knows that if people knew they'd balk.
Anyway, a few more pms yada yada yada I sold them so cheap yada yada. Then, "I priced them at LeftHander and they're $3/pr. I'll credit you $5". Never mind that a) they're $3.25/pr at LeftHander, b) twice $3.25 is $6.50, not $5 and c) I never order from Left Hander so with shipping they'd cost at least as much as just paying Stormer $11 to throw a couple pairs in my next order.
You know what--this is WAY beyond money. I can go buy whatever brushes float my boat. This is about doing what is right, and the right thing is a) sending what you say you're going to send and b) making it ALL THE WAY "right" if you don't. Never mind the motors are poor specimens (at least on the outside...don't want to know what's inside other than any bets I find dirt?).
I told him to forget about it, that I'd leave feedback and tell the story and let others make up their minds. If he'd even said "I'm sorry, what can I do?" I'd have probably told him to forget about it...but from the outset it's all been my fault "you musta thrown them away", "your outta your mind", "I sold them so cheap I can't do that" etc. You know what...if he was selling them so close to the "edge" he should have made damn sure everything was in the box. He thinks I'm entirely unreasonable to expect what I was told I was getting...maybe I am. I just know that were our rolls reversed I'd have offered the same three options and honored whichever one he chose--my trader rating and name are worth FAR more to me. Apparently they aren't to him.
As it is, I'm mailing the motors back to him in his original box and with his original packaging. He can do whatever he thinks is "right"...that's what he was going to do in the first place anyway ("I'll credit you $5). I could really care less anymore. I would hope that he would do the right thing and credit me the $20.60 I've spent. At the least (since it's all my fault) he'd credit back the $16. If he doesn't, it's on him--if he can't make it right there's more screwed up in his life than this so I really don't want to be the one kicking him when he's down.
Scottrik
Keep in mind...I paid HIS price including shipping. He was not beaten up in any way on price.
The motors arrived with no brushes. I sent an e-mail asking if they'd been inadvertently not packed, lost, etc. The first reply was to check the garbage, that they're in a baggie. Let him know if they weren't there and he'd send some 767 brushes.
One of the big attractions to the package was that he was offering brushes that priced alone plus shipping would have been $16. I've wanted to try Putnam Greens, and I've already got 767's coming out of my ears from a bulk buy. Also, I hadn't thrown the packing (wadded up newspaper) away so I looked through it again. Nothing. I sent him a pm offering three different resolutions to the problem.
a) Find the brushes and send them (my guess was they'd been accidentally forgotten).
b) The brushes are priced at $5.50/pr at my lhs--Stormer. Credit me $11 via PayPal
c) I send the motors back and he credits me back the $16 plus return post.
I would have been cool with any of them.
His reply was that I am "outta my mind" if I thought he was going to refund $11 on $16/shipped motors. Nice. Also that he KNEW the brushes were packed in there because he packaged everything at the campus post office. Guess what--he left them sitting on the counter.
Notice he immediately jumped on the one option that "cost" him the most, ignoring the other two. If these were such great motors you'd think he'd KNOW he could sell 'em and recoup his money if he bought them back...but he knows that if people knew they'd balk.
Anyway, a few more pms yada yada yada I sold them so cheap yada yada. Then, "I priced them at LeftHander and they're $3/pr. I'll credit you $5". Never mind that a) they're $3.25/pr at LeftHander, b) twice $3.25 is $6.50, not $5 and c) I never order from Left Hander so with shipping they'd cost at least as much as just paying Stormer $11 to throw a couple pairs in my next order.
You know what--this is WAY beyond money. I can go buy whatever brushes float my boat. This is about doing what is right, and the right thing is a) sending what you say you're going to send and b) making it ALL THE WAY "right" if you don't. Never mind the motors are poor specimens (at least on the outside...don't want to know what's inside other than any bets I find dirt?).
I told him to forget about it, that I'd leave feedback and tell the story and let others make up their minds. If he'd even said "I'm sorry, what can I do?" I'd have probably told him to forget about it...but from the outset it's all been my fault "you musta thrown them away", "your outta your mind", "I sold them so cheap I can't do that" etc. You know what...if he was selling them so close to the "edge" he should have made damn sure everything was in the box. He thinks I'm entirely unreasonable to expect what I was told I was getting...maybe I am. I just know that were our rolls reversed I'd have offered the same three options and honored whichever one he chose--my trader rating and name are worth FAR more to me. Apparently they aren't to him.
As it is, I'm mailing the motors back to him in his original box and with his original packaging. He can do whatever he thinks is "right"...that's what he was going to do in the first place anyway ("I'll credit you $5). I could really care less anymore. I would hope that he would do the right thing and credit me the $20.60 I've spent. At the least (since it's all my fault) he'd credit back the $16. If he doesn't, it's on him--if he can't make it right there's more screwed up in his life than this so I really don't want to be the one kicking him when he's down.
Scottrik
Last edited by Scottrik; 06-27-2008 at 04:41 PM.
09-21-2007, 09:22 PM
#2
well you never denied the $5 return, so after i receive the motors ill refund your purchase price. sorry if you feel your getting killed on the deal, but i distinctively remember putting brushes in the bag, i may have missed it, but im confused why i only have one putnam green left (offered to send that single brush i had found in my parts box as well as two 767s - you never mentioned that). not sure how i can send brushes i don't have....sorry for any confusion for not selecting your option "A".
when i get the motors i will return your money...i wont have any hard feelings, but it sure sounds like you will....good luck in the future. but this is already too late you left me poor feedback accentually removing any chance i have of selling anything on here again, since there is no way to remove ill-gotten feedback.
when i get the motors i will return your money...i wont have any hard feelings, but it sure sounds like you will....good luck in the future. but this is already too late you left me poor feedback accentually removing any chance i have of selling anything on here again, since there is no way to remove ill-gotten feedback.
09-21-2007, 09:59 PM
#4
Refund has, indeed, arrived. Thank you for that.
You still miss the point, however. I don't feel "done"...never did. Just think it's absolutely ridiculous that I have to argue with you to get you to do what you should have offered right up front to do. I don't want something for nothing...I want what I agreed to buy. Nothing more, nothing less. It doesn't matter how much or how little you "made" on a deal--everything that was offered must be provided. Am I going to miss a mortgage payment because I didn't get the brushes? Not at all. As I said before, it's a case of what's right is right. And I'm dead serious, had you bothered to appologize and offer to send the brushes I'd have said to forget about it. As it was, it was a non-stop litany of excuses, the crux of which were I was either incompetent (threw them away) or was expecting too much.
I have no doubt at all you put the brushes in a baggie and that you fully intended they go in the box. I'll bet they got left on the counter at the PO where you packed everything or slid under your car seat, etc. Wish I could say I've never done exactly the same. Stuff happens.
As for "ill-gotten" feedback, others will decide whether it was ill-gotten or not. I directed people to this thread if they're concerned and they can make up their own minds. In the end I'm made "whole", but had to go through bs that just wasn't appropriate. I guarantee none of my buyers would have had to make a second request--I would have (and have) made the exact same three solution offers I made you and a fourth...ask if they had another alternative.
Finally, no the motors were to be shipped out tomorrow or Monday so they haven't gone out. I will donate your motors to a couple of newer/cash strapped racers. There is no way I want to come out "ahead" in any of this.
Thanks again for stepping up though.
You still miss the point, however. I don't feel "done"...never did. Just think it's absolutely ridiculous that I have to argue with you to get you to do what you should have offered right up front to do. I don't want something for nothing...I want what I agreed to buy. Nothing more, nothing less. It doesn't matter how much or how little you "made" on a deal--everything that was offered must be provided. Am I going to miss a mortgage payment because I didn't get the brushes? Not at all. As I said before, it's a case of what's right is right. And I'm dead serious, had you bothered to appologize and offer to send the brushes I'd have said to forget about it. As it was, it was a non-stop litany of excuses, the crux of which were I was either incompetent (threw them away) or was expecting too much.
I have no doubt at all you put the brushes in a baggie and that you fully intended they go in the box. I'll bet they got left on the counter at the PO where you packed everything or slid under your car seat, etc. Wish I could say I've never done exactly the same. Stuff happens.
As for "ill-gotten" feedback, others will decide whether it was ill-gotten or not. I directed people to this thread if they're concerned and they can make up their own minds. In the end I'm made "whole", but had to go through bs that just wasn't appropriate. I guarantee none of my buyers would have had to make a second request--I would have (and have) made the exact same three solution offers I made you and a fourth...ask if they had another alternative.
Finally, no the motors were to be shipped out tomorrow or Monday so they haven't gone out. I will donate your motors to a couple of newer/cash strapped racers. There is no way I want to come out "ahead" in any of this.
Thanks again for stepping up though.
09-21-2007, 10:01 PM
#5
yep step up still to have neg feedback.....you could use the "edit off"
as for the arguing, it was all to try and come to a solution that wouldn't screw me over, while you still get the product, but thats why i just said keep them, but w/e for your troubles i thought it was worth it.
i couldn't choose an option i had no way to do (a) because i only had 1 pair of brushes after misplacing 2 sets
"I don't want something for nothing" is what would have about happened with (b) i end up about losing money with nothing to show for it
(c) is what happened, but you jumped to feedback without reply about the $5 refund for the brushes you didn't even really need (as you said)
as for the arguing, it was all to try and come to a solution that wouldn't screw me over, while you still get the product, but thats why i just said keep them, but w/e for your troubles i thought it was worth it.
i couldn't choose an option i had no way to do (a) because i only had 1 pair of brushes after misplacing 2 sets
"I don't want something for nothing" is what would have about happened with (b) i end up about losing money with nothing to show for it
(c) is what happened, but you jumped to feedback without reply about the $5 refund for the brushes you didn't even really need (as you said)
Last edited by Jake S; 09-21-2007 at 10:38 PM.
09-21-2007, 10:55 PM
#6
Yup. All my fault. What the hell was I thinking.
re your comments regarding the options, any one of which I would have done based on buyer choice:
a) you found 'em for sale on LeftHander...offer to buy some and send them on.
b) you still don't get it...whether you ultimately made money or not I STILL wouldn't have gotten "something for nothing". The brushes would cost me $11 to buy with an order from Stormer, that's what I asked for. Look it up. You offered up a site (LeftHander) that has 'em for less AND STILL DIDN'T EVEN OFFER TO CREDIT THAT AMOUNT. Never mind that I never buy from them, so those $6.50 brushes would STILL cost $11 once they were shipped.
c) I told you a couple hours before I posted feedback what I was going to do, by which anybody would have seen that your "offer" was being rejected. During that couple hours I saw you actively looking around (checked your profile periodically) so it's not like I blind-sided you. You were warned and elected to take no action until your face was rubbed in it.
re your comments regarding the options, any one of which I would have done based on buyer choice:
a) you found 'em for sale on LeftHander...offer to buy some and send them on.
b) you still don't get it...whether you ultimately made money or not I STILL wouldn't have gotten "something for nothing". The brushes would cost me $11 to buy with an order from Stormer, that's what I asked for. Look it up. You offered up a site (LeftHander) that has 'em for less AND STILL DIDN'T EVEN OFFER TO CREDIT THAT AMOUNT. Never mind that I never buy from them, so those $6.50 brushes would STILL cost $11 once they were shipped.
c) I told you a couple hours before I posted feedback what I was going to do, by which anybody would have seen that your "offer" was being rejected. During that couple hours I saw you actively looking around (checked your profile periodically) so it's not like I blind-sided you. You were warned and elected to take no action until your face was rubbed in it.
Last edited by Scottrik; 09-22-2007 at 07:49 AM.
09-21-2007, 10:59 PM
#7
never said it was. just stating my options. but now its too late, any reputation i had is tarnished because of this even after i already gave a refund, ill still have that -1 on my rating.
im not saying your the bad guy at all, i just want to state that i feel im not a bad guy either, after refunding your $16, and letting you keep the motors to hand off....just feel i shouldn't be out the -1 too....
im not saying your the bad guy at all, i just want to state that i feel im not a bad guy either, after refunding your $16, and letting you keep the motors to hand off....just feel i shouldn't be out the -1 too....
09-22-2007, 07:59 AM
#8
Your reputation is "tarnished" because of your actions. Regardless whether I was ultimately refunded or not the fact I had to argue with you and put up with being referred to derrogatorily belies your attitudes and, ultimately, your customer service ethic.
I have entered a request to have the "negative" rating changed to a "neutral". I agree that since I have been made "whole" in the deal a "negative" is unfairly punative but I do feel a "neutral" warning is appropriate.
I have entered a request to have the "negative" rating changed to a "neutral". I agree that since I have been made "whole" in the deal a "negative" is unfairly punative but I do feel a "neutral" warning is appropriate.
Last edited by Scottrik; 09-25-2007 at 11:36 AM. Reason: Inaccurate statement...retracted.
09-25-2007, 09:43 AM
#11
Also worthy of note is that I have given you two opportunities to deny that the motors were used in your buggy, neither opportunity has been taken. The ad listed them as having been used in your TC, the implication being that was the only place they have been used. Look at those motors in my pic above...that rash has "buggy" written all over it.
it says 2wd-stock which is buggy
09-25-2007, 11:35 AM
#12
As far as those chiming in that I've received "something for nothing" Jake has asked that I give them to a couple new/less well financed racers here as goodwill tokens from him. I won't use them.
Last edited by Scottrik; 09-25-2007 at 11:46 AM.
09-25-2007, 11:41 AM
#13
it was nice getting this all straightened around....
09-25-2007, 11:51 AM
#14
And I edited the previous post to match that. The agreement was to hand them on and that is what will be done.
Thanks Jake...I am glad we were able to work it all out in a mutually acceptable manner. I'm one to let bygones be bygones, I would deal with you again if opportunity arose since I think we BOTH maybe learned something from this.
I will post up a reminder to the mods as I see nothing has been done about the rating. I hope they will modify that.
Thanks Jake...I am glad we were able to work it all out in a mutually acceptable manner. I'm one to let bygones be bygones, I would deal with you again if opportunity arose since I think we BOTH maybe learned something from this.
I will post up a reminder to the mods as I see nothing has been done about the rating. I hope they will modify that.
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