SEQ 12th Scale Racing
04-03-2014, 04:56 AM
#721
The European tracks we see on videos are going to be a bit bigger. From what I've seen of club tracks many are smaller.
8 cars I think you'll find is tradition. Everything was 8 car finals in the 90s, it wasn't until about 2000 that we went 10 car at Australian events. I still think at most clubs 8 is a better number, it promotes cleaner racing.
8 cars I think you'll find is tradition. Everything was 8 car finals in the 90s, it wasn't until about 2000 that we went 10 car at Australian events. I still think at most clubs 8 is a better number, it promotes cleaner racing.
Cheers
04-03-2014, 05:46 AM
#723
I'd say most people don't realise, it's not like RC history is well recorded. In general a lot of ideas get repeated as if they are new because the community loses the knowledge of what has gone before (sorry, off topic, but a personal hobby horse).
People might think that 10 is better because 2 extra people get a chance to win, but 9 and 10 almost never win. The number of times I've seen someone from outside the top 4, in a triple-A format, win in a major, in all the time I've been racing is no more than half a dozen times (I did it myself once from 5th!).
In fact having an extra 2 cars in the main makes it harder for drivers from 4th to 8th to win, because the start is more of a mess, and increased traffic in general makes it harder to fight to the front.
Fewer cars means cleaner racing, together with good pre-grading it can lead to better racing if you don't take it too far. Not being able to race many people can be boring too.
People might think that 10 is better because 2 extra people get a chance to win, but 9 and 10 almost never win. The number of times I've seen someone from outside the top 4, in a triple-A format, win in a major, in all the time I've been racing is no more than half a dozen times (I did it myself once from 5th!).
In fact having an extra 2 cars in the main makes it harder for drivers from 4th to 8th to win, because the start is more of a mess, and increased traffic in general makes it harder to fight to the front.
Fewer cars means cleaner racing, together with good pre-grading it can lead to better racing if you don't take it too far. Not being able to race many people can be boring too.
04-03-2014, 03:12 PM
#726
I am in the middle of writing a "little" blog post about how I feel about the current racing formats. I usually have pretty individual views these days so I might open it up to comments when I post it
04-03-2014, 03:38 PM
#727
Hows this for an idea for deciding how many cars on a track at a time -
Make a calculation based on the staggered start qualifying. You want everyone to have a good clean first few laps to get every one settled down. That's never going to happen if the first starter is already in a position to lap the last starter by the time they actually start. It probably needs some experimenting to find the best distance but I'd propose at least 1/3 of a lap between the first starter and the last starter. I think most races use a 1sec delay these days and assuming an 8sec average lap time that means 5 cars on a track for qualifying and for grouping finals.
Of course the more entries there are the harder this might be to stick to, but the standard thing these days seems to be reduce the number of qualifying rounds or as like the USF1 does, use shorter qualifying rounds - who needs 8 minutes for a qualifying round. 4mins would be plenty and still allows plenty of spanner time to make setup changes.
Make a calculation based on the staggered start qualifying. You want everyone to have a good clean first few laps to get every one settled down. That's never going to happen if the first starter is already in a position to lap the last starter by the time they actually start. It probably needs some experimenting to find the best distance but I'd propose at least 1/3 of a lap between the first starter and the last starter. I think most races use a 1sec delay these days and assuming an 8sec average lap time that means 5 cars on a track for qualifying and for grouping finals.
Of course the more entries there are the harder this might be to stick to, but the standard thing these days seems to be reduce the number of qualifying rounds or as like the USF1 does, use shorter qualifying rounds - who needs 8 minutes for a qualifying round. 4mins would be plenty and still allows plenty of spanner time to make setup changes.
04-03-2014, 05:30 PM
#728
Hows this for an idea for deciding how many cars on a track at a time -
Make a calculation based on the staggered start qualifying. You want everyone to have a good clean first few laps to get every one settled down. That's never going to happen if the first starter is already in a position to lap the last starter by the time they actually start. It probably needs some experimenting to find the best distance but I'd propose at least 1/3 of a lap between the first starter and the last starter. I think most races use a 1sec delay these days and assuming an 8sec average lap time that means 5 cars on a track for qualifying and for grouping finals.
Make a calculation based on the staggered start qualifying. You want everyone to have a good clean first few laps to get every one settled down. That's never going to happen if the first starter is already in a position to lap the last starter by the time they actually start. It probably needs some experimenting to find the best distance but I'd propose at least 1/3 of a lap between the first starter and the last starter. I think most races use a 1sec delay these days and assuming an 8sec average lap time that means 5 cars on a track for qualifying and for grouping finals.
The only thing i see is even putting 5 guys in a final if one of those 5 is 0.5 sec a lap on his best lap off the pace he will be getting lapped quite regularly which will slow him down even further causing him to be lapped quicker it sorta becomes a viscous circle.
Which is why i think we need to seed the finals at least in the short term until more guys are up to speed, based on best lap and qualifying times if that means 4 guys( i draw the line at 4 minimum) in any final at club level then that's how it should run so that everybody enjoys themselves.
For more serious events maybe make it a max of 8 but give the option to reduce it to say 5 or 6 if needed based on qualifying times. The cut-off will need to be worked out after a bit more track time.
Anyway my 2 cents
Cheers
Tim.
Last edited by Superkarter; 04-03-2014 at 05:31 PM. Reason: grammer
04-04-2014, 05:30 AM
#729
Good night of 12th racing tonight at Xray Raceway in Trackside Rc. The juniors Mason and Sean showed much promise again, out qualifying a number of the adults. Luke Sinanian had a special guest appearance in Jeff Hamons green machine and had a ball in the 2 quals he ran. And I was a sook and went home early because I am exhausted after a huge days work and now im going to bed. Will post up the qualifying sheet tomorrow as well as the finals sheet also.
Night
Night
04-04-2014, 04:01 PM
#730
Awesome night guys!!!
Sausages were amazing.
Everyone enjoyed themselves and had fun, even if the finals were a bit crazy.
I am working on uploading results online, will let you know when i do.
Remember track is open 7 days for anyone wanting to do some testing.
Sausages were amazing.
Everyone enjoyed themselves and had fun, even if the finals were a bit crazy.
I am working on uploading results online, will let you know when i do.
Remember track is open 7 days for anyone wanting to do some testing.
04-05-2014, 07:53 PM
#731
Tech Fanatic
Let's hope that all clubs in the South East can now be involved in 12th scale.
Certainly Trackside we be "the" facility for this class and I will certainly be supporting racing there.
That having been said all clubs have members with cars and I am sure club Organisers would welcome extra numbers.
I know the Sunshine Coast is hoping for more racers, they all still have their cars and would like the competition. They are all pretty new to racing and need to be encouraged to race outside of their own track. 1/12 is a great all rounder class excellent for all classes of racer.
Graham
Certainly Trackside we be "the" facility for this class and I will certainly be supporting racing there.
That having been said all clubs have members with cars and I am sure club Organisers would welcome extra numbers.
I know the Sunshine Coast is hoping for more racers, they all still have their cars and would like the competition. They are all pretty new to racing and need to be encouraged to race outside of their own track. 1/12 is a great all rounder class excellent for all classes of racer.
Graham
04-05-2014, 08:00 PM
#732
Let's hope that all clubs in the South East can now be involved in 12th scale.
Certainly Trackside we be "the" facility for this class and I will certainly be supporting racing there.
That having been said all clubs have members with cars and I am sure club Organisers would welcome extra numbers.
I know the Sunshine Coast is hoping for more racers, they all still have their cars and would like the competition. They are all pretty new to racing and need to be encouraged to race outside of their own track. 1/12 is a great all rounder class excellent for all classes of racer.
Graham
Certainly Trackside we be "the" facility for this class and I will certainly be supporting racing there.
That having been said all clubs have members with cars and I am sure club Organisers would welcome extra numbers.
I know the Sunshine Coast is hoping for more racers, they all still have their cars and would like the competition. They are all pretty new to racing and need to be encouraged to race outside of their own track. 1/12 is a great all rounder class excellent for all classes of racer.
Graham
04-05-2014, 08:12 PM
#733
Tech Fanatic
I know they are hoping for a few extras next race meeting.
Graham
04-05-2014, 11:44 PM
#734
Very disappointing to say the least.
And What has happened to 1/12th
Sorry to post here
Shane "Disappointed' Hyde
Last edited by Swamp Rat; 04-05-2014 at 11:56 PM.
04-06-2014, 12:40 AM
#735
Tech Rookie
Rob had to work
Steve and Mason had last minute family commitments
Richard is still dealing with a bad back
Johnny La went and raced pro tourer because none of his friends were going to be racing anymore.
No idea what happened to Jason and Sean, you would have to ask them.
Sorry you are disappointed Shane, just circumstance meant most could not attend. The 12th guys love Logan, it is a great track to race 12th on and I know Rob plans to try and get everyone down to Logan again a couple of weeks after Tamworth, he is a big believer in supporting those who support the class.