nitro or electric faster
07-23-2002, 12:25 AM
#46
Tech Rookie
Originally posted by Alvin
Some advice: Whatever car you choose, these factors should influence it:
a) Parts support
b) Ppl running it for car/setup/parts/modification help
I would LOVE to run an T4 or Barracuda as my modified TC, unfortunately, a) Parts Support is totally non-existent; point b) fortunately doesn't bother me at all.
the 414 for example (my main TC
) needs to special order in e.g. rear drive belt. Any metal parts go, oh boy time to hit the special order form. Xray no idea. But that car is basically unbreakable. Seen too many of them go through the wood barriers @ RCS ;-)
Some advice: Whatever car you choose, these factors should influence it:
a) Parts support
b) Ppl running it for car/setup/parts/modification help
I would LOVE to run an T4 or Barracuda as my modified TC, unfortunately, a) Parts Support is totally non-existent; point b) fortunately doesn't bother me at all.
the 414 for example (my main TC
) needs to special order in e.g. rear drive belt. Any metal parts go, oh boy time to hit the special order form. Xray no idea. But that car is basically unbreakable. Seen too many of them go through the wood barriers @ RCS ;-)
07-23-2002, 12:52 AM
#47
This is my 2 cents; first decide if you are going to be racing or not, and determine your budget.
If you aren't racing and are looking for a motor which has high initial investment cost, and low running cost (in theory, since I do not speak from experience), that would be the way to go. Especially when you can eat the nitro cars on the straights
If you are racing them well... me I have the support equpiment for brushed motors, but I do want to run a BL system for economy reasons. The key factors turning me off are basically no $$$ for a bl system. It is up to the individual to budget, sufficient for brushed motors for racing (of course there is the "outlaw" series by HL but that's besides the point - look at ifmar, roar, jmrca for now).
What are your views?
If you aren't racing and are looking for a motor which has high initial investment cost, and low running cost (in theory, since I do not speak from experience), that would be the way to go. Especially when you can eat the nitro cars on the straights
If you are racing them well... me I have the support equpiment for brushed motors, but I do want to run a BL system for economy reasons. The key factors turning me off are basically no $$$ for a bl system. It is up to the individual to budget, sufficient for brushed motors for racing (of course there is the "outlaw" series by HL but that's besides the point - look at ifmar, roar, jmrca for now).
What are your views?
07-23-2002, 01:09 AM
#48
Tech Rookie
I don't race and stuck with alot of brush motors. Been absent from Rc for some time, now back again. Still quite a hefty investment for BL. Might "steal" a ride from sam's car to experience the power, might just compel me to buy. In the mean time, my brushed motors kicks nitro butts!
I will also do a survey and wait for the BL to mature its technology.
I will also do a survey and wait for the BL to mature its technology.
07-23-2002, 01:26 AM
#49
Sam's BL Xray is lovely. But IMHO I feel the super extra torque generated needs to run foam, else it's probably gonna be wheelspin city. Plus, if the wear rate is high, it can imply motor maintenance -> down, tire maintenance -> up....
I'd probably gear it high for minimal wheelspin @ zero timing, and choose a model closer to 11T. Sam's one had excellent torque throughout the power curve. Not like my 14x2s which boast good acceleration, but lesser higher up the envelope.
I'd probably gear it high for minimal wheelspin @ zero timing, and choose a model closer to 11T. Sam's one had excellent torque throughout the power curve. Not like my 14x2s which boast good acceleration, but lesser higher up the envelope.
07-23-2002, 01:40 AM
#50
interesting thread ...... 
been following this for a while ... expecially when "hb" posted
hahahaha he and his usual antics ... pissing everyone off ...
i agree that racing or not its personal preferrence
and i i also agree that to test EP vs Nitro is on a drag race ...
but usually the result would be 1st 20m-30m EP accelerates like a rocket leaving nitro in the dust then ...
at aorund 35m nitro ctaches up and eats electrict
i beat a nitro kyosho super 10 stock standard with tuned muffeler ... using OSmax engine - dunno how many cc maybe .12 or .15 not sure
i am using my Tamiya Acto Power Pink Motor with a insane gearing of
5.2:1 FDR (beats it in acceleration and strights to the end of a streach of about 80 - 100 m ) <- never knew my car can fly that fast b4 this LOL and i left him behind pretty far
he was stunned LOL hahahaha
the motor is a gonner now ... lol
been following this for a while ... expecially when "hb" posted
hahahaha he and his usual antics ... pissing everyone off ...
i agree that racing or not its personal preferrence
and i i also agree that to test EP vs Nitro is on a drag race ...
but usually the result would be 1st 20m-30m EP accelerates like a rocket leaving nitro in the dust then ...
at aorund 35m nitro ctaches up and eats electrict
i beat a nitro kyosho super 10 stock standard with tuned muffeler ... using OSmax engine - dunno how many cc maybe .12 or .15 not sure
i am using my Tamiya Acto Power Pink Motor with a insane gearing of
5.2:1 FDR (beats it in acceleration and strights to the end of a streach of about 80 - 100 m ) <- never knew my car can fly that fast b4 this LOL and i left him behind pretty far
he was stunned LOL hahahaha
the motor is a gonner now ... lol
07-23-2002, 02:20 AM
#51
my two semi-informed cents..
A recent rc car action mag had a showdown between a nitro and electric dragster... the electric won but i think the nitro had some problems off the start line...
Also, if you're looking into hard facts on fastness, there has recently been two races (one electric, one nitro) run at the RC Speedway at Taman Jurong and the course layout has been exactly the same for each race.
For the open electric race, the avg laptimes for A Main were under 12s... For the recent Impulse Challenge (Series 2 Race 8), the A Main times were averaging over 12.. although during qualifying i think there were some sub 12s (cannot confirm... can go www.hobbylink.com.sg to check if you want). Basically, from observing both nitros and electrics run at the same time during practice days, the EPs smoke the Nitros in-field, and the Nitros will usually roar pass the EPs on the straights.
So.. what's the answer? buggered if i know....
Also, if you're looking into hard facts on fastness, there has recently been two races (one electric, one nitro) run at the RC Speedway at Taman Jurong and the course layout has been exactly the same for each race.
For the open electric race, the avg laptimes for A Main were under 12s... For the recent Impulse Challenge (Series 2 Race 8), the A Main times were averaging over 12.. although during qualifying i think there were some sub 12s (cannot confirm... can go www.hobbylink.com.sg to check if you want). Basically, from observing both nitros and electrics run at the same time during practice days, the EPs smoke the Nitros in-field, and the Nitros will usually roar pass the EPs on the straights.
So.. what's the answer? buggered if i know....
07-23-2002, 03:56 AM
#52
- To avoid stepping on toes, edited ;-) -
Last edited by Alvin; 07-23-2002 at 04:03 AM.
07-23-2002, 06:34 AM
#53
i remember reading abt the drag race in RC car action between electric n nitro...they each had their fair share of wins n losses,but if i remember correctly,the electric won eventually....
agreed that electric cars r faster in the infield,most of the RCers tat i know of tells mi tat,...
brushless is a heavy investment,i'm still waiting 4 it 2 settle down b4 getting 1,....the technology is still new and quite a limited selection here in s'pore...
agreed that electric cars r faster in the infield,most of the RCers tat i know of tells mi tat,...
brushless is a heavy investment,i'm still waiting 4 it 2 settle down b4 getting 1,....the technology is still new and quite a limited selection here in s'pore...
07-23-2002, 07:16 AM
#54
Originally posted by NightKidZ
I apologize on behalf of all Singaporean racers for any distress Hobbyboy may have caused you.
I personally feel racing or not it's a personal choice...
Truth is, racing conditions don't always bring out the fastest drivers as the winners....
Hobbyboy is a troll we are all trying to flush out, like Alvin has posted earlier, just ignore him and he will starve and go away
I apologize on behalf of all Singaporean racers for any distress Hobbyboy may have caused you.
I personally feel racing or not it's a personal choice...
Truth is, racing conditions don't always bring out the fastest drivers as the winners....
Hobbyboy is a troll we are all trying to flush out, like Alvin has posted earlier, just ignore him and he will starve and go away
07-23-2002, 04:34 PM
#55
Tech Apprentice
Originally posted by ijnek
i remember reading abt the drag race in RC car action between electric n nitro...they each had their fair share of wins n losses,but if i remember correctly,the electric won eventually....
agreed that electric cars r faster in the infield,most of the RCers tat i know of tells mi tat,...
brushless is a heavy investment,i'm still waiting 4 it 2 settle down b4 getting 1,....the technology is still new and quite a limited selection here in s'pore...
i remember reading abt the drag race in RC car action between electric n nitro...they each had their fair share of wins n losses,but if i remember correctly,the electric won eventually....
agreed that electric cars r faster in the infield,most of the RCers tat i know of tells mi tat,...
brushless is a heavy investment,i'm still waiting 4 it 2 settle down b4 getting 1,....the technology is still new and quite a limited selection here in s'pore...
IJNEK : Maybe you can invent some solar powered car !! Save battery, motor and ESC ...... chargers ...... Very LOW COST !!
Come on. If you omit a comm lathe, motors and normal ESC, you can easily get the BRUSHLESS. Or you can sell away some ESC to other people, like the Garang Guni man SUBARU WRX, and get the mony to buy the brushless(Add gST too)
07-23-2002, 07:39 PM
#56
my thoughts
juz my thoughts
Brushed System:
High-end ESC - $250-$350
Hot motors - $60-$140 each (definitely need more than 1)
Spare brushes - $5 est. per pair
Motor spray - $15 est. per can
Runtime Scenario#1 - geez, my hand-wound 11x2 motor so ex, dun over-play it, save it for race
Runtime Scenario#2 - nevermind not racing, juz get a cheap machine-wound motor for playing... oops, brushes seems to be wearing out already... uh-oh, commn's turning black... say, is tat power loss i'm experiencing?
Motor power - dun think my 14x2 can make it, need a 10x2 instead...
Maintenance - regular comm cleaning, commn cutting, change brushes, clean dirt off the motor Bearings followed by re-lube
Commn cutting - pay a small fee/get some favours/fork out >$200 for a lathe
Pinions/Spurs - the usual fix
Sanctioned for races locally - yes!
Brushless System:
BL ESC - $300-$350
Hot! motors - $300 est. each (juz need 1)
Spare brushes - no need
Motor spray - no need
Runtime Scenario#1 - run and run and run... oops, running out of batts!
Runtime Scenario#2 - race or play, dun matter... run and run and run... no problems...
Motor power - hey, tis BL ESC allows power setting adjustment... juz lemme increase it and play wif the gearing...
Maintenance - clean dirt off the motor bearings followed by re-lube
Commn cutting - no need, instead go for ball bearings change by factory after they've gone thru 1 year's worth of regular running...
Pinions/Spurs - the usual fix
Sanctioned for races locally - yes, but not in all races... maybe never will be for all, or maybe not yet...
Brushed System:
High-end ESC - $250-$350
Hot motors - $60-$140 each (definitely need more than 1)
Spare brushes - $5 est. per pair
Motor spray - $15 est. per can
Runtime Scenario#1 - geez, my hand-wound 11x2 motor so ex, dun over-play it, save it for race
Runtime Scenario#2 - nevermind not racing, juz get a cheap machine-wound motor for playing... oops, brushes seems to be wearing out already... uh-oh, commn's turning black... say, is tat power loss i'm experiencing?
Motor power - dun think my 14x2 can make it, need a 10x2 instead...
Maintenance - regular comm cleaning, commn cutting, change brushes, clean dirt off the motor Bearings followed by re-lube
Commn cutting - pay a small fee/get some favours/fork out >$200 for a lathe
Pinions/Spurs - the usual fix
Sanctioned for races locally - yes!
Brushless System:
BL ESC - $300-$350
Hot! motors - $300 est. each (juz need 1)
Spare brushes - no need
Motor spray - no need
Runtime Scenario#1 - run and run and run... oops, running out of batts!
Runtime Scenario#2 - race or play, dun matter... run and run and run... no problems...
Motor power - hey, tis BL ESC allows power setting adjustment... juz lemme increase it and play wif the gearing...
Maintenance - clean dirt off the motor bearings followed by re-lube
Commn cutting - no need, instead go for ball bearings change by factory after they've gone thru 1 year's worth of regular running...
Pinions/Spurs - the usual fix
Sanctioned for races locally - yes, but not in all races... maybe never will be for all, or maybe not yet...
Last edited by Bryan Thng; 07-23-2002 at 07:54 PM.
07-24-2002, 06:21 AM
#57
hm .... then i wasted my$$ on my new ESC .........
should have waited on BRUSHLESS
then again without the esc i cant PLAY !!
i think i will sit and wait and see how things go for some time ......
brushless is defenately an option but not soo soon ..... still too early to jump excited over something
alvin ..... hehe my guess is that u were trying to say that any EP and beat the kyosho super 10 LOL
its too old a car
well i agreed .....
and i dun need to gear the motor soo high
but since he 'hau lian' with me and puts the electrict cars down
(says electrict no mater how good cannot beat nitro )... so........why not ....
( stock motor geared low also same speed with the gas car i think )
should have waited on BRUSHLESS
then again without the esc i cant PLAY !!
i think i will sit and wait and see how things go for some time ......
brushless is defenately an option but not soo soon ..... still too early to jump excited over something
alvin ..... hehe my guess is that u were trying to say that any EP and beat the kyosho super 10 LOL
its too old a car
well i agreed .....
and i dun need to gear the motor soo high
but since he 'hau lian' with me and puts the electrict cars down
(says electrict no mater how good cannot beat nitro )... so........why not ....
( stock motor geared low also same speed with the gas car i think )
Last edited by imataquito; 07-24-2002 at 06:31 AM.
07-24-2002, 06:52 AM
#58
Bryan- One thing you forgot;
BL- Crap throttle response
Brushed- Excellent throttle response
Thats why my BL sits looking pretty on the shelf and the brush motors are on my RC car!!!
BL- Crap throttle response
Brushed- Excellent throttle response
Thats why my BL sits looking pretty on the shelf and the brush motors are on my RC car!!!
07-24-2002, 07:18 AM
#59
imataquito: No! It was a vague initial D reference ;-)
dtm: Odd, the brushless motor I tried had a pretty smooth powerband. OTOH, I have no idea if it has been tuned that way...
dtm: Odd, the brushless motor I tried had a pretty smooth powerband. OTOH, I have no idea if it has been tuned that way...
07-24-2002, 08:35 AM
#60
brushless is still pretty new,so prices high as not much manufacturers around...in the near future,it is definitely worth considering...
imataquito:
still waiting 4 u 2 join us at dataran...
imataquito:
still waiting 4 u 2 join us at dataran...