General setup tips
08-29-2011, 01:51 PM
#1
General setup tips
Okay, I am looking to compile like a little cheat sheet. When track or weather conditions change what should I change?
If the track is blown out do you typically use lighter or heavier shock oil?
If a track is smooth and grooved do you use heavier or lighter shock oils?
If a track has very small short jumps do you use a heavier or lighter shock oil?
When do you use more or less rebound?
Would you want more or less ride hight on a rough track?
If it is very hot and humid how will this effect your tune?
I run an 8T 2.0 and I know my setup for my home track, but as I go to other tracks for a race day I would like to have an idea on how to change my setup.
Thanks
If the track is blown out do you typically use lighter or heavier shock oil?
If a track is smooth and grooved do you use heavier or lighter shock oils?
If a track has very small short jumps do you use a heavier or lighter shock oil?
When do you use more or less rebound?
Would you want more or less ride hight on a rough track?
If it is very hot and humid how will this effect your tune?
I run an 8T 2.0 and I know my setup for my home track, but as I go to other tracks for a race day I would like to have an idea on how to change my setup.
Thanks
08-29-2011, 09:39 PM
#3
I have downloaded the xray off road set up book from their set up station. and go by what you car is doing or not doing
08-29-2011, 09:51 PM
#4
Okay, I am looking to compile like a little cheat sheet. When track or weather conditions change what should I change?
If the track is blown out do you typically use lighter or heavier shock oil?
If a track is smooth and grooved do you use heavier or lighter shock oils?
If a track has very small short jumps do you use a heavier or lighter shock oil?
When do you use more or less rebound?
Would you want more or less ride hight on a rough track?
If it is very hot and humid how will this effect your tune?
I run an 8T 2.0 and I know my setup for my home track, but as I go to other tracks for a race day I would like to have an idea on how to change my setup.
Thanks
If the track is blown out do you typically use lighter or heavier shock oil?
If a track is smooth and grooved do you use heavier or lighter shock oils?
If a track has very small short jumps do you use a heavier or lighter shock oil?
When do you use more or less rebound?
Would you want more or less ride hight on a rough track?
If it is very hot and humid how will this effect your tune?
I run an 8T 2.0 and I know my setup for my home track, but as I go to other tracks for a race day I would like to have an idea on how to change my setup.
Thanks
The problem with this is everyone drives differently and every one wants a different feel (set up), I would talk to people where you race and study the x ray guide and make the changes you feel you need in relation to where you feel your lacking on the track or not handling as well/ as quick as others
There is always more than one way to obtain what you want out of your car all with different side effects and opinions on how to adjust this will change from driver to driver
Another problem is all tracks are different, where you may change to a lighter shock oil for bumpy conditions on one track might not be what you would want to do on another track
Thats what i reckon anyway
.. i have only just started to play around with set up in a serious way after 4 years of racing and it confuses the hell out of me with the ten thousand adjustments available on these things Dave
08-29-2011, 11:03 PM
#5
Pistons And Shock Oil:
-In the front smaller holes take away turn in and increase mid corner steering. In the rear, smaller holes increase turn in and give more on power rear bite which means less on power steering. Smaller holes jump and land better.
-The problem is the dust. Nothing has traction on dusty surfaces. Try using smaller hole piston/lighter oil combination with the same springs your using now.
-Smaller hole pistons will have more pack which will make the chassis drive flatter around the track. They will also jump better. On really bumpy tracks small hole pistons will stay on top of the bumps and with big hole pistons your car will stay lower through the bumps.
-In the front small pistons take away response, and in the rear the big pistons are to absorb bumps
-Answer from Matt on how to get more side bite: Lighter front oil
-Front-More pack gives you more steering and more responsiveness. Less pack gives you less steering and smoother reaction.
-Rear-More pack gives you more forward traction and side bite. Less pack, just the opposite.
-The heavier your car is dampened the less chassis roll it will have. I feel this creates more stability and easier to drive. Lighter dampening makes the chassis roll. This at times can be good if you are on a track where you need rotation in the turns.
NOTE: Also keep in mind you will want to change your oil to keep up with outside temperature. For example, you practice at 8:00a.m. and its 70 degrees out and your car is dialed. Then you run your first qualifier at 12:00p.m. when the temp gets up to 95 degrees, suddenly your car feels unstable and unpredictable. Up your shock 5wt and your car will back to being dialed. This is something that you want to play with to get a good feel so you know when to increase or decrease your oil and how much to do it by.
Springs And Limiters:
-Buggy front springs work good when using the inside hole on the front arm. This creates a progressive feel and keeps the front end up with such a soft mounting location.
-Front limiters give more on power steering on smooth tracks, but on rough tracks takes away steering everywhere. Washers on both cancel each other out
-Inner limiters control weight transfer. As you move in on the mounting location of the arm, you must limit the shock to equal down travel of a farther out mounting location.
- Softer front springs give less high-speed steering and more low speed and less nose height when jumping. Softer rear springs, give less high-speed side bite, more exit corner steering, less forward bite, less height when jumping.
Anti Squat:
-Stock is 2 deg. less anti squat give more side bite and less forward bite. Vice versa.
Sway Bars:
-Generally, sway bars take away rear traction, which means on high bite tracks they give more on power steering.
Camber Links:
-A longer camber link gives the car less roll in the turns and more forward bite. Making it longer in the bulkhead is similar to moving it up on the inside in giving the wheel less camber change.
-What effect does changing the roll center on the car have, when the camber link is basically kept the same length? Specifically in the front: 3-B vs. 2-A? Answer from Matt: Going in on the front camber link takes away initial steering, making the car easier to drive.
Hub Spacing And Carrier Info:
-If you run the hubs forward it will increase forward bite, but decrease side bite. If you feel the car is too locked-in in the middle of the turn run the hubs forward. If the track gets really bumpy run the hubs back.
-When you raise the spindle it will make the car react faster. When the spindle is down it will smooth out the steering.
-25 degree castor blocks will be smoother going into the turn and have more steering coming out compared to 30 degree blocks.
-Washers under the spindle give the car bump in which makes it less responsive and more forgiving during jumping. Under he bellcrank give it bump out which increases responsiveness.
Tire Stuff:
-The softer the tire is the better a multi stage foam works. Soft tires have soft sidewalls, which roll over in cornering, and the multi stage foams hold the tire up. In firmer compound tires it is not necessary to use a multi stage foam, but can be to an advantage. On a general note, multi stage foam creates more corner speed.
-With foam, run firmer foam on smooth tracks and soft foam on rough tracks.
Shock Location:
-Adam- what is the advantage of changing shock positions from #2 and middle in the arm to #3 still using the middle in the arm in the rear of the XXXT. More forward traction or more side bite? Answer from Adam: Moving from the #2 hole to the #3 hole will make the truck square up faster and give you more forward traction. It will also go through the bumps better.
This info is from various LOSI manuals:
Ride Height:
-Raising the front ride height can cause quicker steering reaction.
Camber:
-Increasing negative camber in the front will increase steering.
-Increasing negative camber in the rear will result in less side bite.
Rear Hub Camber Location:
-Outer hole will make car feel stiffer resulting in straighter acceleration.
-Inner hole will go through bumps better and give feeling of more steering but from the rear end which may be the car swinging around.
Rear Camber Link Length:
-Longer camber link will usually result in more rear traction due to less chassis role.
-Shorter camber link will usually result in more steering from rear end due to increased chassis role.
Washers Under Front Camber Link Ball Stud:
-Less washers makes the steering more aggressive.
Front Camber Link Length:
-Shorter camber link will result in more front end role which increases high speed steering.
-Longer camber link will make the care feel stiffer and have less role.
Front Shock Location:
TOP
-Moving the top of the shock out will result in an increase in steering and the car will react quicker.
-Moving the top for the shock in will slow the steering response time.
BOTTOM
-Moving the bottom of the shocks in will result in more low-speed steering and less high-speed steering and will usually require limiters to limit downtravel (inside shock) and the springs should be changed to a stiffer spring.
-Moving the bottom of the shocks out will reduce overall travel, increase high-speed steering, and reduce low-speed steering.
Rear Shock Location:
TOP
-Moving the top out results in more side-bite.
-Moving the top in results in more forward traction and a softer spring should be used.
BOTTOM
-Moving the bottom in will make car smoother in bumps but reduce stability.
Rear Anti-Squat:
-Less anti-squat will give you more side-bite.
Rear Hub Spacing:
-Spacing the hub back will help on large, high-speed tracks (more traction).
-Spacing the hub forward will help on small, tight tracks (more steering).
Battery Location:
-Moving the battery back will improve rear traction. (Caution: Too far back will cause rear end to swing around)
This info is from RCV:
Need More Steering
• Batteries - Move batteries towards the front of the vehicle.
• Front Shock Mounting - Move the lower shock mount towards the outside
• Front Camber Link - Longer camber links increase steering
• Front Ride Height - Lower the front ride height
• Rear Ride Height - Raise rear ride height for more high speed steering
• Rear Shock Mounting - Move upper mount towards outside
• Wheelbase - Lengthen the wheelbase for more steering
• Rear Toe-in - Decrease rear toe-in
• Ackerman - Use less Ackerman for more sensitive steering
Need More Traction
• Batteries - Move batteries towards the rear of the vehicle (but not too far)
• Rear Ride Height - Lower rear ride height
• Rear Camber - Less camber (0 -1 deg.)
• Camber Link - Longer camber links
• Rear Shock Mounting - Move upper mount towards the inside
• Wheelbase - Shorten the wheelbase
• Rear Toe-in - Increase rear toe-in
• Slipper - Loosen slipper so wheels don't spin as much
Need Better Jumping
• Shock Oil - If bouncing too much or bottoms out over jumps, use heavier oil
• Shock Pistons - If bottoming out over jumps, use smaller hole pistons
• Rear Shock Mounting - If bottoming out over jumps move upper mount towards the outside
• Battery Position - If nose high during jumps, move battery forward, move rearward if nose is down during jumps
• Weight - Add weight to nose if it's too high during jumps
Need More High Speed Steering
• Front Toe - More toe-in gives you more steering coming out of the corners
• Front Caster - Less caster gives you more steering exiting corners
• Rear Ride Height - Raise rear ride height for more high speed steering
More Stable Over Rough Tracks
• Anti-squat - Less anti-squat allows better acceleration on rough tracks
• Rear Camber - More negative camber is more stable on bumpy tracks
• Rear Camber Link - Shorter camber links is more stable on bumpy tracks
• Front Shock Mounting - Move lower shock mount inside for bumpy tracks
• Battery Mounting - Place in the middle for most stable on all tracks
-In the front smaller holes take away turn in and increase mid corner steering. In the rear, smaller holes increase turn in and give more on power rear bite which means less on power steering. Smaller holes jump and land better.
-The problem is the dust. Nothing has traction on dusty surfaces. Try using smaller hole piston/lighter oil combination with the same springs your using now.
-Smaller hole pistons will have more pack which will make the chassis drive flatter around the track. They will also jump better. On really bumpy tracks small hole pistons will stay on top of the bumps and with big hole pistons your car will stay lower through the bumps.
-In the front small pistons take away response, and in the rear the big pistons are to absorb bumps
-Answer from Matt on how to get more side bite: Lighter front oil
-Front-More pack gives you more steering and more responsiveness. Less pack gives you less steering and smoother reaction.
-Rear-More pack gives you more forward traction and side bite. Less pack, just the opposite.
-The heavier your car is dampened the less chassis roll it will have. I feel this creates more stability and easier to drive. Lighter dampening makes the chassis roll. This at times can be good if you are on a track where you need rotation in the turns.
NOTE: Also keep in mind you will want to change your oil to keep up with outside temperature. For example, you practice at 8:00a.m. and its 70 degrees out and your car is dialed. Then you run your first qualifier at 12:00p.m. when the temp gets up to 95 degrees, suddenly your car feels unstable and unpredictable. Up your shock 5wt and your car will back to being dialed. This is something that you want to play with to get a good feel so you know when to increase or decrease your oil and how much to do it by.
Springs And Limiters:
-Buggy front springs work good when using the inside hole on the front arm. This creates a progressive feel and keeps the front end up with such a soft mounting location.
-Front limiters give more on power steering on smooth tracks, but on rough tracks takes away steering everywhere. Washers on both cancel each other out
-Inner limiters control weight transfer. As you move in on the mounting location of the arm, you must limit the shock to equal down travel of a farther out mounting location.
- Softer front springs give less high-speed steering and more low speed and less nose height when jumping. Softer rear springs, give less high-speed side bite, more exit corner steering, less forward bite, less height when jumping.
Anti Squat:
-Stock is 2 deg. less anti squat give more side bite and less forward bite. Vice versa.
Sway Bars:
-Generally, sway bars take away rear traction, which means on high bite tracks they give more on power steering.
Camber Links:
-A longer camber link gives the car less roll in the turns and more forward bite. Making it longer in the bulkhead is similar to moving it up on the inside in giving the wheel less camber change.
-What effect does changing the roll center on the car have, when the camber link is basically kept the same length? Specifically in the front: 3-B vs. 2-A? Answer from Matt: Going in on the front camber link takes away initial steering, making the car easier to drive.
Hub Spacing And Carrier Info:
-If you run the hubs forward it will increase forward bite, but decrease side bite. If you feel the car is too locked-in in the middle of the turn run the hubs forward. If the track gets really bumpy run the hubs back.
-When you raise the spindle it will make the car react faster. When the spindle is down it will smooth out the steering.
-25 degree castor blocks will be smoother going into the turn and have more steering coming out compared to 30 degree blocks.
-Washers under the spindle give the car bump in which makes it less responsive and more forgiving during jumping. Under he bellcrank give it bump out which increases responsiveness.
Tire Stuff:
-The softer the tire is the better a multi stage foam works. Soft tires have soft sidewalls, which roll over in cornering, and the multi stage foams hold the tire up. In firmer compound tires it is not necessary to use a multi stage foam, but can be to an advantage. On a general note, multi stage foam creates more corner speed.
-With foam, run firmer foam on smooth tracks and soft foam on rough tracks.
Shock Location:
-Adam- what is the advantage of changing shock positions from #2 and middle in the arm to #3 still using the middle in the arm in the rear of the XXXT. More forward traction or more side bite? Answer from Adam: Moving from the #2 hole to the #3 hole will make the truck square up faster and give you more forward traction. It will also go through the bumps better.
This info is from various LOSI manuals:
Ride Height:
-Raising the front ride height can cause quicker steering reaction.
Camber:
-Increasing negative camber in the front will increase steering.
-Increasing negative camber in the rear will result in less side bite.
Rear Hub Camber Location:
-Outer hole will make car feel stiffer resulting in straighter acceleration.
-Inner hole will go through bumps better and give feeling of more steering but from the rear end which may be the car swinging around.
Rear Camber Link Length:
-Longer camber link will usually result in more rear traction due to less chassis role.
-Shorter camber link will usually result in more steering from rear end due to increased chassis role.
Washers Under Front Camber Link Ball Stud:
-Less washers makes the steering more aggressive.
Front Camber Link Length:
-Shorter camber link will result in more front end role which increases high speed steering.
-Longer camber link will make the care feel stiffer and have less role.
Front Shock Location:
TOP
-Moving the top of the shock out will result in an increase in steering and the car will react quicker.
-Moving the top for the shock in will slow the steering response time.
BOTTOM
-Moving the bottom of the shocks in will result in more low-speed steering and less high-speed steering and will usually require limiters to limit downtravel (inside shock) and the springs should be changed to a stiffer spring.
-Moving the bottom of the shocks out will reduce overall travel, increase high-speed steering, and reduce low-speed steering.
Rear Shock Location:
TOP
-Moving the top out results in more side-bite.
-Moving the top in results in more forward traction and a softer spring should be used.
BOTTOM
-Moving the bottom in will make car smoother in bumps but reduce stability.
Rear Anti-Squat:
-Less anti-squat will give you more side-bite.
Rear Hub Spacing:
-Spacing the hub back will help on large, high-speed tracks (more traction).
-Spacing the hub forward will help on small, tight tracks (more steering).
Battery Location:
-Moving the battery back will improve rear traction. (Caution: Too far back will cause rear end to swing around)
This info is from RCV:
Need More Steering
• Batteries - Move batteries towards the front of the vehicle.
• Front Shock Mounting - Move the lower shock mount towards the outside
• Front Camber Link - Longer camber links increase steering
• Front Ride Height - Lower the front ride height
• Rear Ride Height - Raise rear ride height for more high speed steering
• Rear Shock Mounting - Move upper mount towards outside
• Wheelbase - Lengthen the wheelbase for more steering
• Rear Toe-in - Decrease rear toe-in
• Ackerman - Use less Ackerman for more sensitive steering
Need More Traction
• Batteries - Move batteries towards the rear of the vehicle (but not too far)
• Rear Ride Height - Lower rear ride height
• Rear Camber - Less camber (0 -1 deg.)
• Camber Link - Longer camber links
• Rear Shock Mounting - Move upper mount towards the inside
• Wheelbase - Shorten the wheelbase
• Rear Toe-in - Increase rear toe-in
• Slipper - Loosen slipper so wheels don't spin as much
Need Better Jumping
• Shock Oil - If bouncing too much or bottoms out over jumps, use heavier oil
• Shock Pistons - If bottoming out over jumps, use smaller hole pistons
• Rear Shock Mounting - If bottoming out over jumps move upper mount towards the outside
• Battery Position - If nose high during jumps, move battery forward, move rearward if nose is down during jumps
• Weight - Add weight to nose if it's too high during jumps
Need More High Speed Steering
• Front Toe - More toe-in gives you more steering coming out of the corners
• Front Caster - Less caster gives you more steering exiting corners
• Rear Ride Height - Raise rear ride height for more high speed steering
More Stable Over Rough Tracks
• Anti-squat - Less anti-squat allows better acceleration on rough tracks
• Rear Camber - More negative camber is more stable on bumpy tracks
• Rear Camber Link - Shorter camber links is more stable on bumpy tracks
• Front Shock Mounting - Move lower shock mount inside for bumpy tracks
• Battery Mounting - Place in the middle for most stable on all tracks
08-30-2011, 04:56 AM
#6
/\ and that is the "short" answer about setups....
08-30-2011, 12:52 PM
#7
R/C Tech Elite Member
08-30-2011, 01:23 PM
#8
The problem with this is everyone drives differently and every one wants a different feel (set up), I would talk to people where you race and study the x ray guide and make the changes you feel you need in relation to where you feel your lacking on the track or not handling as well/ as quick as others
There is always more than one way to obtain what you want out of your car all with different side effects and opinions on how to adjust this will change from driver to driver
Another problem is all tracks are different, where you may change to a lighter shock oil for bumpy conditions on one track might not be what you would want to do on another track
Thats what i reckon anyway.. i have only just started to play around with set up in a serious way after 4 years of racing and it confuses the hell out of me with the ten thousand adjustments available on these things
Dave
There is always more than one way to obtain what you want out of your car all with different side effects and opinions on how to adjust this will change from driver to driver
Another problem is all tracks are different, where you may change to a lighter shock oil for bumpy conditions on one track might not be what you would want to do on another track
Thats what i reckon anyway
.. i have only just started to play around with set up in a serious way after 4 years of racing and it confuses the hell out of me with the ten thousand adjustments available on these things Dave
08-30-2011, 01:52 PM
#9
The problem with this is everyone drives differently and every one wants a different feel (set up), I would talk to people where you race and study the x ray guide and make the changes you feel you need in relation to where you feel your lacking on the track or not handling as well/ as quick as others
There is always more than one way to obtain what you want out of your car all with different side effects and opinions on how to adjust this will change from driver to driver
Another problem is all tracks are different, where you may change to a lighter shock oil for bumpy conditions on one track might not be what you would want to do on another track
Thats what i reckon anyway.. i have only just started to play around with set up in a serious way after 4 years of racing and it confuses the hell out of me with the ten thousand adjustments available on these things
Dave
There is always more than one way to obtain what you want out of your car all with different side effects and opinions on how to adjust this will change from driver to driver
Another problem is all tracks are different, where you may change to a lighter shock oil for bumpy conditions on one track might not be what you would want to do on another track
Thats what i reckon anyway
.. i have only just started to play around with set up in a serious way after 4 years of racing and it confuses the hell out of me with the ten thousand adjustments available on these things Dave
exactly everybody drives diffrent so no matter what change it says will happen doesnt mean the person driving will like it.
for instance im using 35w oil front, and rear on my rc8te on a rough track and i like it because of the stableness. Even know usally you want to use 30w to 32 w shock oil.
sometimes i just say screw it and just drive on the track because of all the adjustments.
but i stay with the simple things 90% of the time camber/ride height/maybe droop more or less.
08-30-2011, 04:37 PM
#10
This is very nice to read when you have some free time.
Click setup manual if you want a quick manual.
Click setup manual if you want a quick manual.
08-30-2011, 07:19 PM
#11
Thanks everyone. I understand my driving style may be different - but I guess what I asking the effects of changes which you guys have hit on.
I just don't want to get to the track and be like... The truck is pushing so I should do X when in reality doing X will make it push more and I should've done Y.
Thanks
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