Stormer Serpent S120 conversion.
02-24-2009, 12:15 AM
#18
My only gripe about link cars is that I personally SUCK with them. I have some opinions on why that is and would like to re-visit a few cars. I was talking to Calandra in Cleveland, just general hallway chitchat. he's giving me a good natured ribbing and says, "what the heck? How come you're not running our car".
I'm 2/10's slower, all the time per lap with a link car. It's me, don't kid yourself. But I have some opinions on how I viewed setup (at that time), and they've changed slightly.
Setup is a puzzle, and it's always changing, and it's different for everybody. A car that's loose for my son, pushes for me. Everybody has point at which a car works best for them.
Last edited by Bob-Stormer; 02-24-2009 at 12:25 AM.
02-24-2009, 05:00 AM
#19
I have always found T-plate cars faster for me. I've had link cars that drove beautifully but just were not as quick.
02-24-2009, 07:19 AM
#20
Tech Adept
Link and t-bar
Nice to see that it is not only AE based cars that get converted.
I can drive faster for one lap whit a link car but not for 8 min, my car have both t-bar and link, never broken a single t-bar after i made the car
how do you like the frontend ?
Lets se Somme new images
I will tell my friend Markus that you change is design :-) laugh.
Good luck!
Alf
I can drive faster for one lap whit a link car but not for 8 min, my car have both t-bar and link, never broken a single t-bar after i made the car
how do you like the frontend ?
Lets se Somme new images
I will tell my friend Markus that you change is design :-) laugh.
Good luck!
Alf
02-24-2009, 10:58 AM
#21
Helo Bobb,
I wont two bee sponcerred. Can I male you my rezumay?
Thanks,
Conrad Stapleton
I wont two bee sponcerred. Can I male you my rezumay?
Thanks,
Conrad Stapleton
02-24-2009, 03:08 PM
#25
Why do most racers remind me of a golfer that is looking for some magic club that is going to make them a better golfer. Pro's or racers that are good enough for some type of factory sponsorship dont put off this vibe, but your average local club guy is usually guilty of this.
02-24-2009, 04:21 PM
#27
Tech Apprentice
iTrader: (1)
I have to agree with Bob and changing cars. Since I started 12th scale I have done something to update them.
First car was a Trinity Revolver (first edition). I got the car and made a new t-plate for it so I could use Corally pivots.
Second car was a Corally 12m which I replaced the front end with an associated 12L. This meant making a new chassis plate. I also went to the tubes vs the friction pivot.
Third car was the SP12X and change that front end to CRC Pro-strut, put front kingpin springs on the dampening tubes and cut a new t-plate to get better feel in the rear pod.
Now I have the S120. And to be honest other then the pod balance I like it. The dampening is right on. The spring bars are much better then those crap springs on the 12r5/CRC. The front end is really a CRC but built better. Overall it is very good. Just one issue, balance. I see the big issue not just with Serpent but with all the manufacturers. We (racers) went to brushless before they did. Not an issue just an observation. So I started pulling axles apart to replace the current spline with tungsten. Still have not got the balance right but I am getting closer. I could not bring myself to cutting up the rear end. The axle on the other hand, hell with it
In the end I feel that Serpent got it 90% right. This is based on my current lap times, and amount of modification done to get it where I like it.
Thanks
Jeff
First car was a Trinity Revolver (first edition). I got the car and made a new t-plate for it so I could use Corally pivots.
Second car was a Corally 12m which I replaced the front end with an associated 12L. This meant making a new chassis plate. I also went to the tubes vs the friction pivot.
Third car was the SP12X and change that front end to CRC Pro-strut, put front kingpin springs on the dampening tubes and cut a new t-plate to get better feel in the rear pod.
Now I have the S120. And to be honest other then the pod balance I like it. The dampening is right on. The spring bars are much better then those crap springs on the 12r5/CRC. The front end is really a CRC but built better. Overall it is very good. Just one issue, balance. I see the big issue not just with Serpent but with all the manufacturers. We (racers) went to brushless before they did. Not an issue just an observation. So I started pulling axles apart to replace the current spline with tungsten. Still have not got the balance right but I am getting closer. I could not bring myself to cutting up the rear end. The axle on the other hand, hell with it
In the end I feel that Serpent got it 90% right. This is based on my current lap times, and amount of modification done to get it where I like it.
Thanks
Jeff
02-24-2009, 04:25 PM
#28
Tech Fanatic
iTrader: (23)
[B]
I have about 100 hours in designing JUST the motor side pod plate. I'd make 3-4 versions, show them around, make a few more, until I felt it had function I wanted and some optical appeal. Hopefully you'll see the difference.
Problem with anodizing is the main colors are used and no matter what we do somebody is gonna flip us crap for ripping off somebody elses color.
CRC is known for red,
Serpent for orange,
Cyrul for Green,
Purple is kind of an HPI, Hot bodies thing.
Xray just did the xII in black.
12r5 is blue
Corally did red.
This is likely to be a small run deal. It's going to be pretty obscure.
I have about 100 hours in designing JUST the motor side pod plate. I'd make 3-4 versions, show them around, make a few more, until I felt it had function I wanted and some optical appeal. Hopefully you'll see the difference.
Problem with anodizing is the main colors are used and no matter what we do somebody is gonna flip us crap for ripping off somebody elses color.
CRC is known for red,
Serpent for orange,
Cyrul for Green,
Purple is kind of an HPI, Hot bodies thing.
Xray just did the xII in black.
12r5 is blue
Corally did red.
This is likely to be a small run deal. It's going to be pretty obscure.
As for anodizing color, I did some parts in Grape back in the RACEtech days that was really cool and unique. Kind of a real dark purple/blue that came from experimenting when we developed the G-Force oval car kit. Picture Welch's Grape Jelly color. Only problem was getting consistency in colors when you have different vendors supplying parts. If you are producing all of the parts at one facility, check with a local anodizing company, they should be able to come up with just about any color you want.
Good luck with the project!
02-24-2009, 05:11 PM
#29
Tech Fanatic
Seeing as we are just a few days from having stuff in hand, I thought I'd drop this on ya. We've been racing the S120 as delivered. I like the car. But there are a few things that I would like to have seen slightly different... so we changed them. I've been talking with Ciccarello about some of these ideas, and haven't even shown him this conversion yet... Ha ha Chicky. 
The prototype of our stuff was good and I was happy with the results.. We are to the "pre-production" side of it, so I've decided to mention it. These will be for sale, shortly.
This first S120 part is a new T-bar and upper deck, works with all existing Serpent S120 parts. Changed the T-bar design to increase durability and improves side bite.
https://www.ssl-stormerhobbies.com/c...s&pn=STO411002
The second part is a complete re-do of the back of the car, and is a complete pod conversion. Basically, we made a new pod better balanced for brushless among other small refinements. and I made changes that I found "interesting" to the flex and dampening. The newest version of the pod is set up so that the axle is in the dead center of the adjuster with a 43mm tire and 4mm of ride height.
https://www.ssl-stormerhobbies.com/c...s&pn=STO411001
Long story short, our pod also converts the S120 to the 12r5 center shock and side damper, and is also drilled to accept standard damper tubes for folks that like to use those. T-bar has also been re-shaped and altered to use Associated pivot sockets, 12L or 12r5. I find the 12r5 sockets to be a bit more sexy. But they limit the ability of what can be done using whats left of the screw as it sticks through the ball for other parts.
I'm only showing these pics because it was the prototype (shown below). And it looks different enough from the pre-production stuff that I'm not as worried about it. Please excuse the wiring, I did the final assembly of this car at the track in between heats. Also the pics are not very "intimate" yet. Closer pictures soon enough.
Serpent is pretty aggressive when it comes to updates, so I wanted to put off discussing this as long as possible. I like Serpent, and hope they are not insulted that we changed things. Their designs are very impressive to me, and I respect their work.
"SPENT", that's an abbreviated Serpent.. IF YOU HAVE IDEAS that you'd like to see implemented or changed, PM me. Don't post it here. Different ideas don't stay different for long if they are posted in public places ...lol...
The prototype of our stuff was good and I was happy with the results.. We are to the "pre-production" side of it, so I've decided to mention it. These will be for sale, shortly.This first S120 part is a new T-bar and upper deck, works with all existing Serpent S120 parts. Changed the T-bar design to increase durability and improves side bite.
https://www.ssl-stormerhobbies.com/c...s&pn=STO411002
The second part is a complete re-do of the back of the car, and is a complete pod conversion. Basically, we made a new pod better balanced for brushless among other small refinements. and I made changes that I found "interesting" to the flex and dampening. The newest version of the pod is set up so that the axle is in the dead center of the adjuster with a 43mm tire and 4mm of ride height.
https://www.ssl-stormerhobbies.com/c...s&pn=STO411001
Long story short, our pod also converts the S120 to the 12r5 center shock and side damper, and is also drilled to accept standard damper tubes for folks that like to use those. T-bar has also been re-shaped and altered to use Associated pivot sockets, 12L or 12r5. I find the 12r5 sockets to be a bit more sexy. But they limit the ability of what can be done using whats left of the screw as it sticks through the ball for other parts.
I'm only showing these pics because it was the prototype (shown below). And it looks different enough from the pre-production stuff that I'm not as worried about it. Please excuse the wiring, I did the final assembly of this car at the track in between heats.
Also the pics are not very "intimate" yet. Closer pictures soon enough.Serpent is pretty aggressive when it comes to updates, so I wanted to put off discussing this as long as possible. I like Serpent, and hope they are not insulted that we changed things. Their designs are very impressive to me, and I respect their work.
"SPENT", that's an abbreviated Serpent..
IF YOU HAVE IDEAS that you'd like to see implemented or changed, PM me. Don't post it here. Different ideas don't stay different for long if they are posted in public places ...lol...Very cool, Bob! I too have gone down that rabbit hole before. Many years ago I made a monocoque chassis 1/12th using Associated’s old mono shock, independent front end and a three shock rear suspension. It even had a monocoque motor pod mounted to my own T bars. The dam thing had so much rear bite I could never get the thing to turn. The batteries where connected together as a square and fit in the middle of the tub right over the T bar. Every Sunday there would be a new part on the car.
I think one of the beauties and appeal of 1/12th to me is that there can be such a variety of cars as each owner improves on the factory design. Wish we all lived closer so we could race our mutts against each other every Sunday!! Of course I will be watching the Stormer website for availablity. Need one for my collection!
02-24-2009, 08:57 PM
#30
Holy Bride of Frankenstein, Batman!! Is nothing sacred?! The Serpent engraved on your pod cross brace should say Repent, not Serpent!
Very cool, Bob! I too have gone down that rabbit hole before. Many years ago I made a monocoque chassis 1/12th using Associated’s old mono shock, independent front end and a three shock rear suspension. It even had a monocoque motor pod mounted to my own T bars. The dam thing had so much rear bite I could never get the thing to turn. The batteries where connected together as a square and fit in the middle of the tub right over the T bar. Every Sunday there would be a new part on the car.
I think one of the beauties and appeal of 1/12th to me is that there can be such a variety of cars as each owner improves on the factory design. Wish we all lived closer so we could race our mutts against each other every Sunday!! Of course I will be watching the Stormer website for availablity. Need one for my collection!
Very cool, Bob! I too have gone down that rabbit hole before. Many years ago I made a monocoque chassis 1/12th using Associated’s old mono shock, independent front end and a three shock rear suspension. It even had a monocoque motor pod mounted to my own T bars. The dam thing had so much rear bite I could never get the thing to turn. The batteries where connected together as a square and fit in the middle of the tub right over the T bar. Every Sunday there would be a new part on the car.
I think one of the beauties and appeal of 1/12th to me is that there can be such a variety of cars as each owner improves on the factory design. Wish we all lived closer so we could race our mutts against each other every Sunday!! Of course I will be watching the Stormer website for availablity. Need one for my collection!
Seriously, drop me a note if you still have one or two of them.
Last edited by Bob-Stormer; 02-24-2009 at 09:56 PM.