False Lipo advertising
#76
In the good old days, a matcher would have a climate controlled room with a bunch of turbomatchers in it, and when they'd get a shipment of cells they could process a whole bunch in a workable time frame.
Turbomatchers won't work with liPO's, they can't charge them and from what I remember of mine, there's no way to set a discharge cutoff voltage that would work with a LiPO cell.
That leaves a matcher in the unenviable position of running every LiPO cell on a Turbo35GFX to get similar numbers... it would take forever (or a crapload of Turbo35GFX's, not an attractive proposition) to process a batch of LiPO cells, because a Turbo35 GFX can handle one cell at a time, where a turbomatcher could handle 4, 6 or eight at a time depending on which models you had.
Turbomatchers won't work with liPO's, they can't charge them and from what I remember of mine, there's no way to set a discharge cutoff voltage that would work with a LiPO cell.
That leaves a matcher in the unenviable position of running every LiPO cell on a Turbo35GFX to get similar numbers... it would take forever (or a crapload of Turbo35GFX's, not an attractive proposition) to process a batch of LiPO cells, because a Turbo35 GFX can handle one cell at a time, where a turbomatcher could handle 4, 6 or eight at a time depending on which models you had.
#77
SMC uses a C rating because that is how you test lipos. There C ratings are excellent and accurate. I had a 35c pack that was not even close to performance as an SMC pack-
#78
I may be able to answer this one-
people will buy the biggest, think about it, if one says 25, and the other says 30, bigger is better right?
its all marketing, true numbers or not.
Remember the old panasonic 3600's? they sucked!! yet, people still purchased them because they where "bigger" than 33's, regardless of actual cell facts.
people will buy the biggest, think about it, if one says 25, and the other says 30, bigger is better right?
its all marketing, true numbers or not.
Remember the old panasonic 3600's? they sucked!! yet, people still purchased them because they where "bigger" than 33's, regardless of actual cell facts.
With sub-c cells it has happened more than once that a cell with higher capacity wasn't better and inf fact was worse than one with lower capacity but many racers bought the latest and greatest only to find out it wasn't.
#79
Tech Elite
It doesn't really make sense for ROAR to worry about C rating or mAH hour as a manufacturer can submit packs with true C rate and mAH and then sell packs with lower C rate cells. Unless ROAR wants to start buying packs from every company from time to time to check as see what they are selling but that could get pricey.
Potentially, ROAR could go to a LHS six months after the fact and purchase product under suspicion though. Pricey or not - this is what the membership depends on... the products on the list are truly evaluated as per the rules and the ROAR Approval stamp is on it.
As of 1/1/09 - lipos will have to carry the ROAR approved label over the seam so we can detect tampering as well.
Danny - your thread here is a FANTASTIC thing and EXACTLY what you have said must be out there. I thank you for this and I'm greatful you are going to be first in line with the new ROAR approval system.
Its all about moving with the times and changing as the technology changes.
#80
Tech Master
iTrader: (12)
C rating is the proper way to rate Lipo, but he is just pointing out that some other brands are fudging the numbers.
This is the same crap with LCD monitors and response time, no standard for reporting, so while some companies give meaningful numbers, other will report false numbers using a BS standard to make their panels look faster.
But in both cases, if you know HOW they are obtaining the number then you can make educated choices.
All Danny has done is point out how SMC gets it C rating and that other fudge the numbers.
Look if none of you care that you're paying inflated prices for a pack with inflated numbers, don't attack Danny.
#81
Potentially, ROAR could go to a LHS six months after the fact and purchase product under suspicion though. Pricey or not - this is what the membership depends on... the products on the list are truly evaluated as per the rules and the ROAR Approval stamp is on it.
As of 1/1/09 - lipos will have to carry the ROAR approved label over the seam so we can detect tampering as well.
Its all about moving with the times and changing as the technology changes.
As of 1/1/09 - lipos will have to carry the ROAR approved label over the seam so we can detect tampering as well.
Its all about moving with the times and changing as the technology changes.
Dawn
So will this make previous approved pack non compliant??
Or will this new ruling not effect pre 2009 approvals
Thanks
#82
Tech Elite
#83
Potentially, ROAR could go to a LHS six months after the fact and purchase product under suspicion though. Pricey or not - this is what the membership depends on... the products on the list are truly evaluated as per the rules and the ROAR Approval stamp is on it.
As of 1/1/09 - lipos will have to carry the ROAR approved label over the seam so we can detect tampering as well.
Danny - your thread here is a FANTASTIC thing and EXACTLY what you have said must be out there. I thank you for this and I'm greatful you are going to be first in line with the new ROAR approval system.
Its all about moving with the times and changing as the technology changes.
As of 1/1/09 - lipos will have to carry the ROAR approved label over the seam so we can detect tampering as well.
Danny - your thread here is a FANTASTIC thing and EXACTLY what you have said must be out there. I thank you for this and I'm greatful you are going to be first in line with the new ROAR approval system.
Its all about moving with the times and changing as the technology changes.
It will also save us money from having to buy test equipment to prove to everyone who is honest and who isn't.
#84
Will the label printing be up to the manufactures , the OEM supplier Or will ROAR be suppling the Labels at a fixed cost??
I assume their will be a Label template if the latter is not the case
#85
danny
this may be off topic,
but how do i store my lipo packs full charge, low charge
how do i "cycle" them on my lipo gfx????(where do you hook the leads)
this may be off topic,
but how do i store my lipo packs full charge, low charge
how do i "cycle" them on my lipo gfx????(where do you hook the leads)
#86
I will take it slow for everyone to catch up. There is a maximum power point to every battery. At some point the battery can not take any more load and the total wattage is decreased by the reduced votlage.
Using the SMC chart, I made my own speculation
Watts on the X, Load in AMPS on the Y
#87
I assume your using connectors on your packs ? If so look at the picture below this is how you can attach the voltage sensing leads. Typically a Deans connector will increase the IR by 1.5 milliohms and drop the voltage by .04 under a 35 amp load.
#89
Tech Elite
iTrader: (16)
The reason LiPO's are rated by C rating isn't because it's the "right way", it's because LiPO technology in R/C racing is still in its infancy. When the technology catches up, we'll see LiPO's rated by average voltage and IR as much as C rating. My whole reason for making comments in this thread was to hopefully get folks to want to see that information. I applaud SMC for printing discharge information on their LiPO packs.
I had a 35c pack that was not even close to performance as an SMC pack-