B4 vs. XXX-KE article in new RCCA
09-18-2003, 12:20 PM
#1
B4 vs. XXX-KE article in new RCCA
Hi guys,
Just read the shootout article in the new RCCA, which took place at SoCal Raceway. Results were based on each kit's box-stock setups, using the locals' tires of choice and Fantom EPIC-based stock motors.
The results were quite interesting. In the end, the B4 got the SLIGHT nod (and I do mean slight). Of the driver preferences, 3 favored the B4, 3 favored the XXX. Some of the general driver comments about the cars:
The B4 has great turn-in and exit speed in the corners... The B4 felt a little twitchy in the washboard sections... The XXX had excellent turn-in, but seemed to push a bit coming out of the turns... The XXX had great attitude when airborne, the B4 was a little nose-heavy on the jumps, but nothing that couldn't be adjusted with a little throttle control... The base setup on the B4 seems to be better suited for experienced drivers, the XXX setup is very stable for beginning drivers... Of the two base setups, the B4's setup seems to favor the SoCal track... With propers setups, either car could be a winner on this track...
Of the two cars, the B4 is lower in price ($199), but the XXX-BK is the better value ($240), considering all the hopups in cluded in the kit. Only time will tell once the FT Edition of the B4 is released.
Hmmm... It looks like things will be VERY interesting in Clearwater, FL next month. OK, talk amongst yourselves...
Just read the shootout article in the new RCCA, which took place at SoCal Raceway. Results were based on each kit's box-stock setups, using the locals' tires of choice and Fantom EPIC-based stock motors.
The results were quite interesting. In the end, the B4 got the SLIGHT nod (and I do mean slight). Of the driver preferences, 3 favored the B4, 3 favored the XXX. Some of the general driver comments about the cars:
The B4 has great turn-in and exit speed in the corners... The B4 felt a little twitchy in the washboard sections... The XXX had excellent turn-in, but seemed to push a bit coming out of the turns... The XXX had great attitude when airborne, the B4 was a little nose-heavy on the jumps, but nothing that couldn't be adjusted with a little throttle control... The base setup on the B4 seems to be better suited for experienced drivers, the XXX setup is very stable for beginning drivers... Of the two base setups, the B4's setup seems to favor the SoCal track... With propers setups, either car could be a winner on this track...
Of the two cars, the B4 is lower in price ($199), but the XXX-BK is the better value ($240), considering all the hopups in cluded in the kit. Only time will tell once the FT Edition of the B4 is released.
Hmmm... It looks like things will be VERY interesting in Clearwater, FL next month. OK, talk amongst yourselves...
09-18-2003, 02:16 PM
#2
Hey, at RCCA, something getting a "slight nod" is like Earth-shattering progress! 
I read the article too, it wasn't bad.
I read the article too, it wasn't bad.
09-18-2003, 08:50 PM
#3
like every kit that losi and associated put out they seem so close to each other that it all comes down to driver skill imo.
as for the box set up wasnt the b4 proto types driven at socal?
as for the box set up wasnt the b4 proto types driven at socal?
09-21-2003, 10:34 AM
#5
Well guys in all honesty it's nice they do these but let's see the problem with them.
They used KIT tires for both test and anyone that has driven with a losi and X-2000's knows this car will push unless you vary to another setup or different front tires.
I have also found out that the acceleration plus they say the B4 has was due to the OLD gearing losi list and them using the gearing in the books to test.Meaning the losi was OVERGEARED.
They are both nice cars.The B4 is a nice improvement over the B3.Lil more stable and easier to drive.I can lay down a faster SINGLE lap with it but over all in 5 minutes it's losi.Expecially in Modified where the losi is ALOT more stable.
It really depends on the setup,track conditions and so on.You cant really say that either one of these buggies are bad.Both very nice machines.Only problem I have with B4's is on Rough tracks.WOW this thing doesnt like rough tracks at all,bouncing around everywhere and trying to get traction exiting a corner is not possible wanting to slide out with the 10 different setups we tested.Like I said both nice cars and it will depend on the driver.I have noticed guys with B4's FEEL faster but when looking at lap times they arent.Goodluck to anyone purchasing any one of these 2 buggies.
They used KIT tires for both test and anyone that has driven with a losi and X-2000's knows this car will push unless you vary to another setup or different front tires.
I have also found out that the acceleration plus they say the B4 has was due to the OLD gearing losi list and them using the gearing in the books to test.Meaning the losi was OVERGEARED.
They are both nice cars.The B4 is a nice improvement over the B3.Lil more stable and easier to drive.I can lay down a faster SINGLE lap with it but over all in 5 minutes it's losi.Expecially in Modified where the losi is ALOT more stable.
It really depends on the setup,track conditions and so on.You cant really say that either one of these buggies are bad.Both very nice machines.Only problem I have with B4's is on Rough tracks.WOW this thing doesnt like rough tracks at all,bouncing around everywhere and trying to get traction exiting a corner is not possible wanting to slide out with the 10 different setups we tested.Like I said both nice cars and it will depend on the driver.I have noticed guys with B4's FEEL faster but when looking at lap times they arent.Goodluck to anyone purchasing any one of these 2 buggies.
09-22-2003, 11:41 AM
#6
Hello all,
It was a good article, but I don't like their philosophy of using box stock setups. I tried the kinwald recomended setup, and it was terrible. No steering at all!!! A change of springs, some more washers under the bulkhead ball stud, and it was a totally different car!!!
In my humble opinion, the RCCA staff should allow roll-center changes in their shootouts, because how many of you guys out there actually run the recommended setup??? All their current shootout deturmine is who's setup sheet that's included with the kit is better.
Later,
It was a good article, but I don't like their philosophy of using box stock setups. I tried the kinwald recomended setup, and it was terrible. No steering at all!!! A change of springs, some more washers under the bulkhead ball stud, and it was a totally different car!!!
In my humble opinion, the RCCA staff should allow roll-center changes in their shootouts, because how many of you guys out there actually run the recommended setup??? All their current shootout deturmine is who's setup sheet that's included with the kit is better.
Later,
09-22-2003, 12:41 PM
#7
Cory,
The only logical reason that I can see for that is that the "base" setup is supposed to be the standard starting setup that the team drivers used based on the R&D that has been perfored on the buggy. It's important to note that it is a starting point, and not necessarily the final setup that will use at any given track.
Of course, the determination of what the base setup should be is totally dependent on how many total tracks were used in testing. As the article suggested, it's possible that the B4's base setup was better suited to SoCal than the XXX-KE's base setup.
I hope I presented the information fairly... no Fanboy-ism here! I'll admit, I'm an AE guy all the way, but I'll be the first guy to give the TL boys props where props are due! Again, it will be VERY interesting in a few weeks. The industry seems to agree that both teams are pretty much on an even playing field equipment-wise; it's gonna come down to who brings their A-Game to Clearwater
!!!!!
The only logical reason that I can see for that is that the "base" setup is supposed to be the standard starting setup that the team drivers used based on the R&D that has been perfored on the buggy. It's important to note that it is a starting point, and not necessarily the final setup that will use at any given track.
Of course, the determination of what the base setup should be is totally dependent on how many total tracks were used in testing. As the article suggested, it's possible that the B4's base setup was better suited to SoCal than the XXX-KE's base setup.
I hope I presented the information fairly... no Fanboy-ism here! I'll admit, I'm an AE guy all the way, but I'll be the first guy to give the TL boys props where props are due! Again, it will be VERY interesting in a few weeks. The industry seems to agree that both teams are pretty much on an even playing field equipment-wise; it's gonna come down to who brings their A-Game to Clearwater
!!!!!
09-22-2003, 10:49 PM
#8
Tech Apprentice
I hate rcca shootout challenges, infact, I hate rcca. They always end up in a tie (monster pirate vs. t maxx= tie, I mean, come on!). The b4 and the xxx almost tied to, I would of **** my pants and send rcca a hate later if it did. They also never have any bad things to say about cars, what a jip.
09-23-2003, 05:17 AM
#9
Originally posted by CoryD
...All their current shootout deturmine is who's setup sheet that's included with the kit is better.
Later,
...All their current shootout deturmine is who's setup sheet that's included with the kit is better.
Later,
Big time beef with their shootouts. Has been, and always will be.
09-23-2003, 07:50 AM
#10
Guys I will put it like this.Both companies spend THOUSANDS of dollars in your magazine.Why would you pick one?lol.
Hell I just won stock this weekend with a XX Cr,Tekin G12,2000 matched packs and a Greenmachine 2 and your going to tell me it's all the car.Yea right.I proved about 20 guys wrong this past weekend.What cracks me up even more is when they say a Team or Team Driver won so he thinks that car is better.Wow this is crazy due to their abilities,team setups and sometimes even team parts.I would look at my personal track conditions,my driving skills and go from there instead of shootouts.
Hell I just won stock this weekend with a XX Cr,Tekin G12,2000 matched packs and a Greenmachine 2 and your going to tell me it's all the car.Yea right.I proved about 20 guys wrong this past weekend.What cracks me up even more is when they say a Team or Team Driver won so he thinks that car is better.Wow this is crazy due to their abilities,team setups and sometimes even team parts.I would look at my personal track conditions,my driving skills and go from there instead of shootouts.
09-23-2003, 09:43 PM
#11
my beef with RC Car Action and other publications is that they dont do long term tests of vehicles. i've probably said this countless times, but all they do is take it around the block once and write up a half ass report on it. another thing is now RCCA is completely cluttered with OFNA ads and the price of subscription is higher than other mags. plus their service is horrible. i misssed 2 issues, most of my other ones were damaged cuz they refused to use plastic bags, even with their higher subscription price!
our domestic RC magazines really do us an injustice IMO. look at RC World, a Japanese publication. They have long term tests (multiples of them), pages of new products, project rides from readers and from themselves, tech talk that is useful to newbies and advanced users, etc.
i've been boycotting RCCA and its other publications for a while. i refuse to believe that they cannot do a better job with the magazine with the amount of subscriptions and money they rack in from advertisements.
our domestic RC magazines really do us an injustice IMO. look at RC World, a Japanese publication. They have long term tests (multiples of them), pages of new products, project rides from readers and from themselves, tech talk that is useful to newbies and advanced users, etc.
i've been boycotting RCCA and its other publications for a while. i refuse to believe that they cannot do a better job with the magazine with the amount of subscriptions and money they rack in from advertisements.
09-24-2003, 07:39 PM
#13
Tech Apprentice
RCCA does fine when they compare two bricks out of the box, but an adjustable set of buggies like the B4 and Losi? What a joke!
Even RC-X had a competitive comparison of the two buggies. Plus SoCal is usually a tight track, fairly smooth, and indoors. I've seen it, the layout changes but it usually affects motor choice and minor suspension tuning.
Where does everyone else run? Bumpy tracks, with slick parts, and uneven soil. Even the Nationals and state venues are inconstitant.
Even RC-X had a competitive comparison of the two buggies. Plus SoCal is usually a tight track, fairly smooth, and indoors. I've seen it, the layout changes but it usually affects motor choice and minor suspension tuning.
Where does everyone else run? Bumpy tracks, with slick parts, and uneven soil. Even the Nationals and state venues are inconstitant.
09-24-2003, 08:34 PM
#14
I think with the experienced people they say it like it is.They are both wonderful buggies with about an even playing field.I think the losi is easier to drive for someone new and on rough tracks but on smoother tracks and someone with SOME experience it will be driving style.This post didnt start out about magazine's but more about just the cars.I personally like the Losi due to in Mod it's more stable and more consistant.I like the edgy feel of the B4 to an extent.But if you fall behind and try playing catch up I like a car I KNOW I can push without problems.In that particular situation I personally DONT like the B4 at all.I think it's still very unstable and not as consistant as the losi.Straigt up racing I think they are both fine buggies and dont think anyone would loose by picking one of the other.
**NOTE** This is simply my opinion but an experienced one.
Les
**NOTE** This is simply my opinion but an experienced one.
Les
09-24-2003, 10:10 PM
#15
Tech Apprentice
Complete agreement with TexRacer. The B4 is excellent for very aggressive drivers, but it's tempered with having to be consistant and mistake free. On tight tracks like SoCal making speed in the turns can shave some time off of the laps.
But if you are a newbie and driver scared then the B4 responds just like your hands: jumpy and twitchy.
Plus I have posted in some other forum, the B4 needs longer shocks and towers. Screw the cg if you can't keep going straight over bumps.
But if you are a newbie and driver scared then the B4 responds just like your hands: jumpy and twitchy.
Plus I have posted in some other forum, the B4 needs longer shocks and towers. Screw the cg if you can't keep going straight over bumps.